Do we live in a "paedophile" culture? I think so.

[BlytheSpiritsSpirit]

I came across this old article on Feminist Current:

You’ve heard of rape culture, but have you heard of pedophile culture?

It's really made me stop and think; children are hyper-sexualised in our culture, aren't they? A recent issue my own DD brought up was the way Millie Bobby Brown from Stranger Things has been sexualised as she's grown (example here) and her co-star Finn Wolfhard (example here)

Why do people feel it's ok to sexualise children like this? What about the beauty pagents for 3 year olds, the drag queen competitions for pre-teens, or remember the internet countdown for when the Olsen twins turned 18? (that was a while ago, so clearly this isn't a new phenomenon)

The more I think about it, the more disturbed I get. I think we do live in a paedophile culture, or at least a culture where the hyper-sexualisation of children is completely normalised. AIBU?

CensorshipHereIsAJoke
And that's the problem. The whole culture of sexualising girls has managed to warp the debate where those questioning it are the bad ones, and those who enable it, promote it, let their 13 year olds wear bralets as tops and have their backsides hanging out are feminist warriors who are empowering their child.

Alot of fetishes were also on display.

I was chatting to someone about this the other day. There seems to be a conflation between “you have the right to your fetish and it’s more acceptable now to have fetishes/kinks” and “it’s acceptable to show fetishes and kinks in public”

It got into a bit of a heated debate in the end because the other person was adamant that if they and their partner wanted to walk around in gimp suits or one of them leading the other by a leash attached to a collar they should be able to do that anywhere. Whereas to me that’s private, and whilst I’ll defend your right for things between consenting adults to be none of the governments business I don’t want to see it in Asda or in the park with my kids. It’s not acceptable for couples who like sexy lingerie to walk around Asda wearing them and that’s the same thing.

I also think though social media has magnified some specific things we are mostly moving further away from it. In the past people wouldn't have been called out for saying inappropriate things as they are now.

I remember when everyone would just joke about 'dirty old men' leering at schoolgirls like they were just a funny part of life, I remember the press being all 'You lucky old goat!' at Billy Wyman and way underage Mandy Smith in the 1980s rather than calling him a paedophile. I remember when kids who reported abuse would be told not to say horrible things about Nice Mr Bloggs and told they had an overactive imagination (I know it still happens, but less than it used to). So on balance, I think we are moving further away

It's fucking difficult to find decent length shorts for preteen girls, let me tell you. It's not like I haven't tried, either! And a 12 year old goes from looking like a little girl to young woman practically overnight, keeping her clothed is a challenge.

It’s the same for 16-year-olds.

I have twins. One lives in denims regardless if snow or record temps. The other likes pink, lilac and the likes. But she also likes her backside, boobs and belly covered. Trying to find stuff for her is murder. Shorts all tiny and skirts are either belt length or ankle length.

The first I knew of Millie Bobby Brown was on a site that talks about Hollywood, she has been groomed by some nasty directors who are quaking in their boots about Epstein revelations about now. Since PIE in the seventies they have been working to normalise fucking our children every which way. Children from third world countries are allegedly imported to satisfy these beasts then disposed of. I believe this after two inquiries into a childrens home near us which came to naught, one run by a very dodgy mp, the only thing I could do I decided was protect my children to the best of my ability until they were too old to be interesting.

is there a source for this? Fucking pride. What the fuck is it all about these days?

If you look on twitter and search minor attracted person, it's very eye opening. Especially all the people trying to justify it.

There seems to be a conflation between “you have the right to your fetish and it’s more acceptable now to have fetishes/kinks” and “it’s acceptable to show fetishes and kinks in public”

Yes and most of them publically display it because that is part of their fetish too. Forcing people to be part of your sexual games isnt ok

I've thought for some time that the digital age brings many benefits but is also part of the problem. I've spent many years dealing with prolific and serious sex offenders. They've always networked with each other - in a way that other offenders, like burglars and muggers never do - but communication by mail and by landline was relatively slow and cumbersome. Now communication is almost instant and it's easy for people with very particular interests to connect with, and link up with, likeminded individuals.

In other words, crazies can easily find fellow crazies on the internet. More particularly, they can easily find the young, the vulnerable, the naive, the gullible - and then share their "finds".

Yes to the shorts. I have a preschooler with sensitive skin who wants long shorts and all I find are hot pant styles in the colours she wants. Plus short shorts are hardly practical for children. I'm having to buy boys shorts and take them in as she's also tall and skinny. I remember wearing unisex sports shorts in the 80s and early 90s. When did it become acceptable to dress children, or more specifically girls, like mini sexualised adults.

I think we have always had a culture of paedophilia, we just didn't always give it the title.
I think it's much better than it was because we are aware of it more and have more safeguarding policies.
growing up in the 60's and 70's we were warned about certain houses in the area because someone funny lived there and we weren't to go near their house.

A lot of people will role their eyes at me, but there is a clear agenda to normalise peodophilia. Please google it if you don’t believe me and suspend your disbelief in ‘conspiracy’ theories. This is coming from the people that run the world, not a fringe group.

As a child we were told to never, never go into the vicarage which was on the school route and to walk on the other side of the road. Mother never explained why I was 8 at the time. The vicar used to leave messages on the gate to encourage us to come get apples, plums from his garden. hmmm...

Weirdly, this article just appeared on my facebook timeline:

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/08/03/lolita-phenomenon-allowing-men-groom-teenage-girls-without-fear/?fbclid=IwAR1bgky52zPhRH-zabQEjQNeXLZuYoGFB6sSWYN0sl1kc5y98y6OQGxPws8

"Lolita phenomenon" happening in plain sight on normal social media platforms.

What's also scary is that pre teen and teen girls are then blamed and shamed for 'asking for it' when wearing the clothes they're pressured into/are the only ones available.

Alternatively, I've also seen some very insidious views on how we should affirm children's sexuality rather than 'repressing' it, basically justifying grown men fucking teenagers. Zero recognition of the fact that as adults who have a clue about the world, we should be guiding teens through sexual awakening which includes educating them that such men are abusive and an equal relationship based on respect with them is impossible.

I find it scary. Ditto fetishes being treated like sexualities - no one is going to convince me that exposing girls and women to bdsm dynamics or adult babies ain't normalising abuse.

@BlythSpiritsSpirit have you seen the Stacey Dooley doc on sexualisation of girls in Japan? Lolita fetish is one of the least horrific aspects- grown men openly saying they're attracted to children, high school girls in uniform being pimped, childre acknowledging that paedophilia is just'a thing'. Made me feel sick amd I dedo see it creeping in here.

Are there any primary source links to Pride supporting pedophilia or it being normalised?

All I can find via Google are a load of right wing fake news type sites which I wouldn't trust to provide any factual information whatsoever.

Snopes and similar seem to think it's all bullshit.

This is not to say I disagree with anything else posted but I'm viewing the claims about links to Pride and high up groups trying to normalise it with a reasonable amount of suspicion until I can find a more genuine/primary source.

(Excluding PIE which I know was absolutely a real thing back in the day)

I have a pre-teen. It is IMPOSSIBLE to find shorts that fit properly. She currently has only 2 pairs, as I won't let her wear hot pants.

There is a lot of sexualisation of very young girls.

It's a scary world for parents, negotiating the world where any mistake a kid makes is documented on social media and uploaded for the world to laugh at and to be remembered for eternity.

In the 70s and 80s, people had a vague (sometimes knew out right) the paedophiles that lived in the local area.

Then there was the pages where law enforcement knew about it (Rotherham, Jimmy Saville) but turned a blind eye.

Now we seem to be a phased where people are scared to challenge someones paedophilia and they are allowed to try and frame their sick thoughts as a reasonable idea. And anyone who challenges them is a bigot .

It's not got better. It's just the same. People still getting away with child abuse.

Yes, but it's always been there, the avenues of expression are just different today than 30 years ago. There does seem to be at least a shift to talking about it and many people feel strongly that it's not fucking ok.

Fourteen year old schoolgirls aren't fair game for 'relationships' with older 20-something men the way they were in the seventies for example, that's not socially acceptable anymore.

But on the other hand a lot of really dubious attitudes seem to be part of culture now. I'm in the same age range as Charlotte Church and the Olsen twins and the countdowns to legal age are revolting - at the time I didn't bat an eyelid though, I suppose because like many teens, I thought I was a full on proper adult from about 14 anyway.

That's a while ago, but it's concerning if the kids from Stranger Things (as just one example, I'm sure) are the focus of that kind of bs too? Clearly certain people still feel fine being fairly open about it.

This took me 20 seconds to find. Bot from yesterday. I am sure if you actually look at twitter, you will see.

They even have their own version of the pride flag.

There's a difference between paedophilia (attraction to pre-pubescent children) and attraction to underage teens. They're not the same thing entirely.

Attraction to young teens has long been a thing in mainstream society, and I think that may be getting better? Men aren't so open about lusting after girls in uniform, this is less acceptable these days - isn't it? Some of the pop music in the 70s for example had shocking lyrics that wouldn't be acceptable now.

But I suspect the internet has encouraged deviance in many people who wouldn't have gone down that road, necessarily, otherwise eg access to child porn. I worry that the internet is encouraging a rise in CSA eg by MAPs being acceptable in their corner of the internet.

Also the sexualisation of young children in popular culture seems to be getting worse to me.

I also think one of the biggest issues is the constant use of the phrase “child porn”. It’s used on the news and in the papers.

Porn is so mainstream now, even extreme porn is just seen as normal viewing. The use of such a normalising phrase for child abuse is something that shouldn’t happen. It should be announced that person X from Y town was arrested for having 1000 child abuse or child rape images and videos on their PC rather than child porn images.

I remember seeing this tweet recently

I've noticed the language is subtle, but needs changing. No 14 year old is in a relationship with a 20 year old man - a 20 year old man is sexually abusing a 14 year old child.

And yes, the phrase "child porn" should be erased from all vernacular. It whitewashes the reality.

Agree there is an obsession with youth

Possibly a reach, but I’ve always thought it’s slightly bizarre how acceptable it is when Men (particularly rich or famous men) will leave their partner and date someone significantly younger. Whenever I’ve mentioned this to my friends they would just shrug and say well they’re rich so can be picky, and obviously they’d prefer to date someone in their prime
But surely a childless woman in their mid 20s is in their ‘prime’, still young etc?? 18-20 is very young compared to 30+ year old men imo

Examples I can think of is Scott Disick dating 19 year old Sofia Richie, Elon Musk and Grimes (ok admittedly she wasn’t as young but she looks like a teenager), Richard Madden dated a 20 year old (who looked like a teenager) after Jenna Coleman who was his age