Tipping in North America

[chopc]

I don't understand tipping in North America- apparently it's the biggest source of income for waiters/ tour guides etc. However all these people are employed. Isn't it up to the employer to pay them an adequate wage then the tip would be just that - an additional amount given if the customer thinks they received exceptional service. If it's a compulsory payment it's not a tip 🤔. Does anyone know the logic behind the N American way of thinking?

I find tipping in America embarrassing all round. I don't want a server kowtowing to me, I don't like the feeling of subsidising a paycheck so small that it would be illegal to pay to any worker but a waiter, I would prefer to pay more for the meal to allow them to be paid a decent amount and then add a tip if I'd like to. It's all very outdated and 'here, let me share my wealth with the lowly staff' which is excruciating to be part of. I do it, because I know it's not optional, but it feels bad.

It’s because there is a different minimum wage for waitstaff/bar staff in the US (at least). I’ve not lived there for 10 years now but I know it used to be like $3 an hour vs $6 an hour for everyone else. They are paid poverty wages and expected to make it up in tips. So tipping is 15-20% on food bill and $1-2 per bar order to the bar staff. You get better bar service if you tip liberally.

You can make a very good wage via tips. My friend used to be a shot girl at a busy sports bar (not like a Hooters! A normal bar) and she made $3 an hour so like $15 for 5 hours work but on a Friday/Saturday she could make $1,000 in tips per night. Most people don’t make that though.

Kowtowing? Lowly staff? Perhaps you are superimposing class-based assumptions from other cultures because I think that most wait staff serving people in the US don't kowtow and dont perceive themselves as lowly. They are performing a service for you. It is unlikely that they think of themselves as your inferior. And they come from all backgrounds. In some high end restaurants, you may even be served by a long-term professional server who has worked there for 25 years or more.

Though then with your $15 per shift, you then have to pay $600+ per month in health insurance (if you’re lucky and your crappy restaurant job even offers it).

It’s because there is a different minimum wage for waitstaff/bar staff in the US

I think that's the wrong way round!

drsausage

Thanks for that info – that’s very interesting. Fair enough, then, if that’s what people are happiest with.

US: Has no nationwide minimum wage.

Bollocks. The federal minimum wage is currently $7.25 per hour.

Apologies again – I did retract my misunderstanding when somebody else pointed it out. It doesn’t sound a very high hourly wage for the US, though.

Thanks for the link – very interesting.

Though then with your $15 per shift, you then have to pay $600+ per month in health insurance (if you’re lucky and your crappy restaurant job even offers it).

Yes, that is a massive chasm between the US and UK. However little we might earn, we always have the free NHS safety net and it's very easy to forget/not realise that other countries don't have anything like this at all.

It is unlikely that they think of themselves as your inferior.

Agreed. That's what makes it embarrassing - these are people like me, relying on everyman to directly subsidise their terribly meagre wages. It makes the transaction awkward.

It's not awkward for them, any more than it would be awkward for anyone providing a service in the US to be paid directly by the person receiving service.

I'm going to the US for work next month and worried about this. Our expenses policy doesn't cover tips so if I tip it comes out of my personal money (with a crap exchange rate). I guess I'm going to have to walk shame faced out of every restaurant clutching my receipt because to tip each time is going to cost me €€€€€.

Paying other service providers a fee for work done is a different system. A company tells you how much it's going to cost to ensure they make enough to pay themselves a decent amount. They set their own wage, essentially.

So of you really like to give your money away. I live in the US and don’t tip half the people mentioned. In a restaurant, yes always. I’ve lost count of how many Brits I’ve seen over the years making a big song and dance about not tipping their waiter. It makes you look like a pretty crappy traveler, never mind cheap.

@nichynoo I'm the same position when I travel with work too. I reconciled myself to it for meals and cabs, but I drew the line at the guy who grabbed my bag from the boot as I was paying the taxi driver and similar.

I’ve lost count of how many Brits I’ve seen over the years making a big song and dance about not tipping their waiter. It makes you look like a pretty crappy traveler, never mind cheap.

I'm a New Yorker. We love our UK tourists here, but the one complaint I hear consistently is that some think it a virtue to not follow the local custom on this. Or that they're being swindled somehow.

I tended bar while on holiday from uni back in the late Pleistocene and experienced this first hand. Most servers here are aware that there's a different approach elsewhere, but it's a hit on their wages effectively.

BTW, the server may wind up paying tax on the tip you didn't give them. Employers are required to withhold based on imputed income, which for servers includes an estimate of tips.

directly subsidise their terribly meagre wages

It’s not a subsidy though. You are paying for the service provided directly via the tip (I actually prefer the term gratuity) rather than as a component of the food cost.

In the UK, the menu shows the cost of food and drink including VAT and the overheads of service. That’s why a gratuity isn’t mandatory.

In the US, the menu shows the cost of the food excluding tax and service.

The final bill would be food and drink plus the local sales tax (similar to VAT) and the gratuity. That is the true cost of the meal. The problem is Brits think the tip is optional because they think the cost of service is paid for, and it isn’t. By not paying a gratuity the server is not compensated for their labour.

So for the PP travelling for work who can’t claim back gratuity, I suggest you should clarify the policy with your employer (as you should be able to claim the total food bill, the gratuity is not extra I’m the US) or just not eat out anywhere where you cannot commit to a 15/20% gratuity.

I’ve lived in the US a couple of times and it’s just a different mindset. You just get used to mentally adding on about 50% on top of the menu price to cover tax and service. I had a few embarrassing moments when friends would visit and point-blank refuse to tip properly because ‘my pizza cost $9 and I’ve put in $10 so that should be enough’, where I’d have to try and explain that their generous extra dollar probably didn’t even cover the tax

Having said that, I recently stayed at a hotel in the US which had a strict no-tipping policy, and they supposedly paid their staff significantly above average to compensate. It felt weird at first but then it was amazing once you got used to it. Not having to awkwardly apologise for not having change when someone helped us with our luggage was such a relief!

Hollycatberry is correct. It seems strange that you would not be able to claim the standard bill, which would include a fifteen percent tip, for a trip to the U.S. If your employer is unwilling to subsidize you and you find yourself unwilling to pay for the service you receive from regular restaurants, please just eat at places like McDonalds or pick up food from delis.

It's ridiculous that Americans try and defend this tipping culture as some sort of norm or good thing. Heaven forbid business owners have to pay their staff appropriately. I guess it's just another part of American culture, like obsession with gun ownership and the resulting consequences, that us "brits" just don't understand

@itsyersel. Please stay home. Really. We don’t need you in the USA making our servers life more difficult. It is what it is. This is the culture here. If you don’t like it, just. Stay. Home.

American culture gets a lot of bashing on MN because some British people assume the culture is the same or worse, that it should be like ours. It’s bloody arrogant.

I think it's more when the rest of the world does something, the USA does something different and then think they are the default.

Things like universal healthcare, including tax in the price (with today's tech it would be simple to have both pre and post tax prices displayed) and meat production practices.

Those of you in the US what are Japanese tourists like? It's really insulting to tip in Japan so I wonder how well they cope with it being expected.

I don't like the feeling of subsidising a paycheck so small that it would be illegal to pay to any worker but a waiter

Servers love tipping culture, they make way more money than an average service worker because of it. There’s always a lot of chat around abolishing the tipping culture in the States but servers are always the first to defend it 🤷‍♀️

I don’t eat out when I’m in the US simple as that.

There seems to be a lot of confusion in this thread about the minimum wage in the States. I'll repeat what I said earlier:
Plenty of US states have a minimum wage that applies to restaurant staff the same as all other workers. Eg in California the minimum wage is around $15 an hour for everyone, including restaurant staff. But people still tip 20%. Truly bizarre.

I'll expand on this:

1. There is a national minimum wage currently around $7.25/hour.
2. Many states have their own minimum wage which is higher.
3. Some - but by no means all - states have a 'tipped minimum wage' which means employers can pay wait staff much less than the statutory minimum wage because the difference is made up in tips. It's laid out here if you're interested: www.minimum-wage.org/tipped

And I don't care about their stone-age employment practices! The employers are the ones relying on your tips to circumvent tax and to subsudise the poor wages they pay their staff.
It amazes me that Americans seem almost proud of cheating a large percentage of their population of a living wage. A tip should be for service above and beyond the norm, not for putting a plate in front of me, that's their job after all. They seem to think that inane chatter with the customer constitutes 'good service', no, I really don't want to discuss my day with you.

Be angry at the tipping system all you want but by refusing to tip you are just hurting the waiters and waitresses directly and come across as tighter than a nats arse.

@NichyNoo Can you not eat at the hotel and pay the entire bill by card therefore claiming the entire amount back?

A tip should be for service above and beyond the norm, not for putting a plate in front of me, that's their job after all. They seem to think that inane chatter with the customer constitutes 'good service', no, I really don't want to discuss my day with you

Well that’s your definition of a tip, but not the US one. In the US service is charged extra to the food and drink cost started in the menu.

The total bill is food/drink plus sales tax plus gratuity. It’s not not extra, it forms part of the total cost of your meal.

It represents the cost of the table service you received so it needs to be paid. That’s the ‘norm’ there. Why do so many Brits feel the need to challenge this or educate Americans on how it should be done?

If you don’t like being spoken to in restaurants or paying for service then self serve delis or fast food are probably a better option when visiting the US. Although I think it’s odd to take umbrage with a server interacting with you.

@Hollycatberry - thanks for the clarification. Now I understand. It's not really a tip but a service charge which is commonly charged elsewhere. The term gratuity/ tip does suggest its optional by definition though ........