To ask for help with possible qualification fraud?

[Shambu]

I've discovered a relation of a close family member is promoting himself to his clients as having an Hons degree he does not have.

I've known him for 20 years, and his qualification was a much lower status one which he didn't finish.

It is featured on his email on all communication with clients.

How would I find out? I contacted the institution to find out if they offered that course at the time, but I cannot make a request for specific information without his being informed.

This thread is a waste of space.

Unless the person is in a protected profession then lying about a degree is neither here or there.

Saying that I work in an area where not having a degree can mean that you can't get employed permanently at some companies but does not mean you can't get work.

IncandescentShadow pity your accuracy isn't as strong as your conviction. Most trainee lawyers at the big law firms have taken a variety of degrees. Firsts from top ranked universities in pretty much any traditional subject. Not law. History, English, Economics, PPE and Philosophy being some of the common ones. Some do take law. How do I know? Worked in corporate HR for EVER. You really need to know your facts before dissing others.

titchy
Yeah sounds like bull to me. There is NO occupation where a degree is the requirement.

That's a mighty emphatic 'NO'. Guess doctor/dentist/veterinarian don't feature in your universe.

OP, I had the exact same thing with someone I was close to. I did absolutely nothing as there was nothing that could be done and I realised that it wasn’t affecting me anyway so I just left it. Was still annoying though.

Guess doctor/dentist/veterinarian don't feature in your universe.

The legal requirement for the above is to be registered with GMC, GDC or RVC. It's the registration with the professional body that enables them to practice. Having a degree in dentistry doesn't mean you can practice - you need to be registered with the General Dental Council.

Someone can be struck off and not able to practice - they still have the degree though.

poopypants IncandescentShadow pity your accuracy isn't as strong as your conviction. Most trainee lawyers at the big law firms have taken a variety of degrees. Firsts from top ranked universities in pretty much any traditional subject. Not law. History, English, Economics, PPE and Philosophy being some of the common ones. Some do take law. How do I know? Worked in corporate HR for EVER. You really need to know your facts before dissing others.

The figure for solicitors is actually 50:50 (qualifying law degree versus conversion course) and for barristers 75:25 (QLD versus CC).

Source: www.theguardian.com/law/2018/jan/16/late-to-law-studying-another-degree-first-is-a-sensible-option

NB these figures will have originated from the Law Society's own annual report, which is not generally available to non-members.

Your attention to detail is clearly not that good. As a lawyer, my experience is that actually that all but two of my colleagues had done a Qualifying Law Degree.

You write very informally for one who works in HR.

If he has 20 years experience I’m surprised he’s putting a degree qualification on his signature - a professional membership would be usual though.

If there is a professional body he's a member of report him to that. If there isn't, there isn't much you can do. Unless any of the cases against him are still open.

The 'engineer' who supervised the construction of one of the buildings that collapsed in the Christchurch earthquakes had fake qualifications. 115 people died.

You are not coming across well here, OP. There is no way you are involved in this. Surely it's the clients in danger, not his family so your theory about protecting them doesn't really stand up to scrutiny - you are trying to end his career. You may not like him, but that seems a bit extreme. To go to the trouble of contacting his academic institution is slightly obsessive!

A lot of people haven't read this very carefully. The ethical thing to do is to report someone IF they have fake qualifications that give a serious enough risk to others. The problem is that the OP actually DOESN'T KNOW anything of the sort, she THINKS he didn't complete a specific qualification 20 years ago. Since then she doesn't know what qualifications are even needed in his current role, she doesn't know anything about professional bodies, she doesn't know what he might have studied in the interim and she won't disclose what the role is so that anybody can help her to identify the likely impact of his using "Hons" and who to report him to if he even was lying. She definitely knows she dislikes him, that's clear. And I'm happy to take on trust that the guy is an arse, but for all we know he's a qualified arse.

You sound spiteful. Let it go.

MRex the OP says clearly that she's known the individual for 20 years and that he dropped out of a lower level qualification than the one he is claiming to have. And furthermore that he is claiming to have the higher level qualification in writing, on emails sent via his work. That's potentially fraud.

@QualCheckBot - the issue is that she doesn't know what other qualifications he might have done, she doesn't even know what professional bodies are involved for his role that might have conferred a degree following his professional training. Based on the information given OP knows nothing.

I'm always surprised by the way threads like this tend to go.

Even though someone else lying about a qualification doesn't directly affect others, it indirectly affects anyone holding a degree or similar qualification as it stands to diminish the genuine ones.

Likewise a benefits cheat doesn't directly impact others, but it does direct funds away from genuine claimants, and (much as I hate to say it) increases the stigma around being on benefits.

When people cheat the system, it negatively impacts all of us.

Most of the places I've worked have wanted to see my degree certificates, even though they don't need a degree (a number of my colleague don't have degrees.) I even had to show my GCSE certificates the other day, to prove I had English and maths, before doing some training, despite the fact I wouldn't have been eligible to get on a degree course without it. As I'm mid 40s, I had assumed people had long since stopped caring about my GCSEs. So some companies do check.

They didn't used to, at my current employer, and people have been sacked for claiming qualifications they don't have, even if they were doing their job well and a degree isn't an essential prerequisite as in some professions - it's the lieing rather than the knowledge and piece of paper per second that is the issue and what makes it gross misconduct.

HR aren't going to investigate without reason, though - something has to trigger it, what ever that may be. But you don't have firm evidence, just a suspicion. I don't think I would say anything if I didn't know for sure, and I don't know if I would go to much effort to find out, other than a bit of cyberstalking on LinkedIn. I don't know what I'd do in reality, which would probably mean apathy wins.

the issue is that she doesn't know what other qualifications he might have done, she doesn't even know what professional bodies are involved for his role that might have conferred a degree following his professional training. Based on the information given OP knows nothing.

I do know what further qualifications he has done: none. Of that I am 100% sure.

They didn't used to, at my current employer, and people have been sacked for claiming qualifications they don't have, even if they were doing their job well and a degree isn't an essential prerequisite as in some professions - it's the lieing rather than the knowledge and piece of paper per second that is the issue and what makes it gross misconduct.

Exactly. That's what worries me.

Thinking about it he first started with the company 20 years or so ago, he may well have had to show his certificates etc.

Since then he's moved across the country twice and the places he's worked have a completely different staff. As he's got more senior there are fewer people to question him. At some point latterly he's started to use his 'qualification' in his signature, but there's no-one around him who would have known what he started the firm with. And they wouldn't know he hadn't done the 'degree' subsequently (he hasn't).

Ok OP, you feel very certain now about what you know. So what is your question? Because originally it was "How would I find out?" (See your OP, there was no other question in it, later you said you didn't know what professional qualifications are even needed for his role.)

If your concern is his company being deceived then send his HR team an email tip-off from an anonymous account. Job done.

If you actually want help, you need to be a bit clearer; state what the role is and state what help you need. E.g. He is an accountant with job title "Finance Director", his email signature says Hons, what professional body can I report him to as well as HR at his company? (At that point we'll send you into LinkedIn for the name of his professional body, though ACCA / CIMA etc would more usually be written in an accountant's signature rather than the "Hons".)

@Grumpos

You know what, if more people were willing to call out the liars and arseholes in this world I actually think we’d be better off.

Absolutely! Why should the rest of us have to abide by the rules when some cheat and lie to get on.

I can't actually think of any professions that directly require an Hons Degree. Often the hons is a passport to then go on for some form of higher qualification or accreditation and the class of degree would be checked as part of the entry requirements. University degrees are largely academic; not proof of competency in fulfilling a job role.

I wouldn't be concerned about someone saying they have an economics degree but don't, but do have FPC qualifications and membership of the FPS. Similarly, an HR person might have CIPD quals which are far more important than a degree in Human Resource Management. (and the CIPD is shit hot at chasing people who lie about level of accreditation).

I came on to ask if he was Mike Ross of Pearson spectre litt but I see someone’s beaten me to it! 😂

Seriously though is he actually purporting to have a degree from x university or is he saying that he attended x university.

An ex colleague of mine dropped out of uni after her second year. She still got a diploma or something and still said she attended. Which she did.

A current colleague of mine is an accountant. He has no qualifications as such but has been doing the job for 20 years whichever professional body he’s a member of (Acca I think) has allowed him membership based on his experience.

Dh is also an accountant (qualified 5 years ago now) after attending university. But studied sports science. On his email signature from his work he states he has a degree from x university. But doesn’t state what in as it’s not his “house standard”

Ok OP, you feel very certain now about what you know. So what is your question? Because originally it was "How would I find out?"

Two different issues.

My question was how I would find out for sure if his original qualification (which he didn't finish) is as I thought.

However I am 100% he has done no further qualifications since.

I don’t understand why the OP has been given such a hard time on this thread.

It is absolutely reprehensible to actively lie to your employers and clients.
This thread is completely hypocritical in areas, see the recent thread where the op asked wether she should cheat on her degree - cue an onslaught of posters telling her how awful she was and how cheats and liars devalue the work others put in to their qualifications.
Experience counts but so does education, it’s disingenuous to pretend otherwise.
The person in question may have been doing the job for 20 years but that doesn’t mean they are necessarily competent.