To really dislike the attitude some people have about council estates?

[MoominMantra]

Specifically this;

'I grew up on a council estate but I wanted to better myself'

Better yourself? What does that actually mean? I think people like this are insecure and suffer from internalised shame about their roots.

I was then told that because I didn't grow up on a council estate myself then I have no right to an opinion on this.

All I know is that it's deeply unpleasant to look down on others whatever the circumstances. It's not wrong to be happy living on a council estate is it.

AIBU?

around be me we are 99% little welsh villages that have their own shops,schools, library,doctors with 1 doctor, community centers etc(for example you cant go to next villages doctors or school you have to go to the one in your village,shops you can obviously shop where you want) and 1% towns with the big shops which for most is a good bus drive or car ride away so no estates to talk about or any experiences of it but when i hear council estate i think or whats shown via films or telly

places like shameless,only fools and houses tower blocks or this is england type estates(off the top of my head)

Im not hypocritical and I'm not stereotyping at all - I'm saying that rich people are not automatically immune from social problems. And it's disingenuous to say that they are.

Even though I do accept an earlier posters point that if you have money, you automatically have more choices.

It's ok for you to call people posh, criticise a private school, stereotype oxbridge students as all having drug problems - you're making exactly the same negative judgements about other people.

I was talking anecdotally. I was not saying that all Oxbridge students are 'low lives'

You also cannot deny that poor people are marginalised and looked down upon. Rich people definitely are not.

Meh, it's a turn of phrase. I grew up in a council estate. We were stinking poor. It wasn't nice, no fucker would chose it, and although I don't use that phrase, nope, wasn't the life I wanted as an adult. No one living there wanted that life.

Not wanting it doesn't mean you look down on people who live in council houses, wanting to better yourself doesn't mean you think you're superior, it means if you grow up in a shitty situation you don't want it as an adult.

Not all council, estates are lovely. Not everyone living there is living their best life.

@MoominMantra nhs can be difficult avoid (no private A&Es in our area-or in general as far as I’m aware?) but yes, we are as independent as possible.

*you know you don't need a mortgage to pay a £12k house! grin

I could just put that on my credit card. Anyone else could.*

People with no job wouldn't get a £12 limit on a credit card.

I grew up in the 80s on a council estate in an ex-mining town in Derbyshire. It was a complete shithole and I couldn’t wait to get out of it.

Most of the residents had no respect for anyone or anything. Jobs were not exactly plentiful, but so many of them had no intention of working for a living, contributing to society and supporting themselves. They thought society owed them a living. It was far from the sort of Ken Loach style idealised ‘community’ of honourable, decent, downtrodden working class people which patronising, guilt-ridden middle-class leftie do-gooders who have never lived on a council estate like to romanticise.

Education was my ladder out. I was the first person in my family to go to university. I don’t use the phrase ‘better myself’, but I certainly much prefer my life now to the life I would have had on that estate.

I grew up on a council estate and now live on a different one.
I'm a homeowner now and live at the "respectable" end. So I've "bettered myself" to that extent I suppose.
There's loads of positives to estate life. You aren't "better" if you leave.

Ok, so I have asked this person about his individual experience of living on a council estate.

There was no crime, and no people throwing rocks at him when he went to school.

Apparently 'it's just not him'. He's better - belongs in different circles.

So I think my assumption in this case was right.

I dont actually live on a council estate but it is a council house and i love it.
Its Victorian so thick walls, high ceilings, character and a lovely cottage garden.
If anything goes wrong they fix it quickly.
I do pay full rent as i work but nobody has the right to look down on me even when i was a single mum of 2 on benefits after my partner walked out when dd was 3.
Council tenants mostly are normal decent people who once maybe fell on hard times and couldn't afford to buy or rent privately.

Maybe when people say better themselves perhaps they might mean fulfilling their potential?

Most large council estates are rife with crime or antisocial behaviour. Some are worse than others of course but many people living there would like to realise their potential.

I grew up on a tough London council estate but was in catchment of a good school. I was teased, someone once in a throwaway comment when realising where I lived said 'oh I didn't know you were a tramp' I then went to a very academic uni and most people I met lived in sprawling homes. Everyone who lived / lives on a council estate has differing experiences and I think you're BU by having a strong opinion having never lived in one.

I don't deny that poor people can be marginalised or looked down upon. That happens and it shouldn't. it happens all across society though. Wealthier people are called snobs, greedy, it seems to be imagined that they somehow don't live in the 'real world' even though their world in inhabited by just as many normal people. There's a perception that wealthy people don't have any really bad problems, and even if they do it's not as bad as it should be because they have money. Or it's thought that financial struggles only cause actual suffering if they result in a visit to the food bank.

Less judgment and more of an open mind is needed all round, in both directions. Divisiveness comes from both sides of this.

I grew up in a council estate. My life is completely different and I’d say I have bettered myself. By a long way

I think YABU a bit. You sound offended but unless you did grow up on one then clearly you won't understand. So you can have an opinion but it won't hold much merit.

There may be an element of insecurity to it because council estates are judged negatively (rightly or wrongly). However, blaming insecurity on someone's attempt to better themself makes you sound like an idiot.

I grew up on one and it was mostly great but also rough. There was little expectation to pursue an education, get a mortgage, look after yourself etc.

It's perfectly acceptable to want to 'better yourself', as in improve your quality of life from that. You sound a bit naive about it all.

I don’t think anyone grows up dreaming of living on a council estate. ( I personally never known a ‘good’ one )

11 plus tuition type confusion- what to choose

Hi everyone

My son will be in year 4 this September and so I wish to start the 11 plus weekly tuition with him.

We normally do extra work together at home with DH taking the lead on math tuition and me focusing on English/ verbal reasoning etc

Owing to time constraints, my DH has been able to do more daily maths tuition with our son, which has now become his area on strength

At school, son in top groups across the board but does occasionally struggle to focus if not set a specific task.

I have come across 2 options for tuition,

1st option

Run in a school setting fairly close to home

Children taught according to age

Children expected to do specialists 11 plus homework 5x a week

1 class on Saturday between 1-3pm

Owner seems popular, eg lots of parents of former students calling out to her as she walked past like a mini celebrity

we attended a test day some months back, son did ok, with maths being clearly area of strength

The written feedback from test day seemed very accurate and summed up my son's ability perfectly, given pointers on how to improve although we did have to wait 2 weeks for the feedback!

Going forward cost will be £40 per week with £20 monthly top up for specialists subject support, so potentially £180 a month in tuition!

2nd option

Person teaches from her home in groups of between 4/5 students (not sure I am happy leaving my child in a strangers house -totally my issue)

Weekly classes

Person comes personally recommended from acquaintance whose child recently got into a gramma

Classes cost £24 per session (so miles cheaper)

So people, which would you choose?

Money is not necessarily an issue as I am desperate for child to do well and this is obviously cheaper than an independent school

I didn't grow up in a council estate but many of my friends did and interestingly when they were looking to buy they specifically didn't want ex-council so I think people have plenty of reasons why they wouldn't choose to live there. Interestingly when I was looking for my first home I was happy to look at ex-council but DP who spent his whole life on one said no he'd rather go smaller and private

Sorry didn't mean to post here

@recklessruby council housing didn't exist in Victorian times. Do you mean housing association/council owned?

Who cares...most houses are owned private.

@MoominMantra why is it wrong to judge the people who still live there? Obviously they're judging the invalids who are drug dealing, stealing and vandalising.

If you haven't lived there then you don't get a say.
I would consider myself a failure if i stay on a council estate my whole life. And i would be right.

You don't have to walk the long way round to avoid a drugdealer, or group of yobs throwing stones, or the local junky who tries to hand your child a manky teddy for drug money and think 'well isn't this great'

You get nice areas and shit areas but whoever you spoke to about bettering themselves and escaping the depths of dirty dangerous society was right. They are better than the people who happliy stay.

If you've never had to ask someone not to take a shit on your steps then i suggest you stfu about it.

You do not know what was normalised for this person by living in such bad standards. And its probably worse than having a big garden and a structually sound house will fix.

By the way, nice stealth boast about never growing up on a council estate. You must be feeling pretty good about yourself for sticking up for the poor unfortunate souls.

Well done OP. Well fucking done.

It depends. You could have had an idyllic childhood on a council estate, then moved to another that was really nice initially, but then the wasters, druggies and drunks moved in, completely ruining everything. To move would indeed be bettering yourself. And before anyone criticises my comment, I'm speaking from experience.

Didnt grow up on a council estate, but i do now live in HA house.

It's a simple fact really that an average council estate is a worse place to live than the average private road.

It's reflected in property prices, and the fact that people with options are not really clamouring to live on council estates.

I wouldn't personally like to live on any estate.