Financial thing with DM - AIBU?

[CassetteTapes]

My parents divorced when I was an older teen 15 years ago. My DM was left struggling financially and convinced me to buy her council house with her when I was 20, as she was entitled to a discount. I was reluctant as I was on min wage at 20, and it felt like a huge commitment, but DM had been through a tough time and needed my help to buy it. She told me that we would sell it one day and split the proceeds, So we split half the mortgage and all council tax, bills down the middle from day one. I worked 6 days a week to cover my share of everything and still have some fun money.

At 21 I got a much better paid job with better prospects but to accept it I had to move out and rent a room from a friend (very early shiftwork job in London and I needed to be on a nightbus route). I was also starting to need my own freedom and space. My mum didn’t want me to accept the new job because of the house commitment so I agreed to carry on paying my half of mortgage and bills so as to not leave her in a pinch. I had to pay for my own room rent and bills, plus the commitments at my mums so I had very little left over. My housemate said at the time it was a bit of a weird set up (my parents divorced but it was like I, the child, paid the matrimonial support at a time I needed to get on my own two feet).

Long story short, I paid my half at my mum’s for over 5 years, by which time I was married with a baby. I had to cut my maternity leave short and we really struggled with childcare costs and had to count every bean. I felt I had to go for promotions when DC was tiny and could not afford to go P/T. I was desperate to get out of the mortgage as DH had a small inheritance for a house deposit and we wanted to use it to buy our own place but couldn’t because I was financially tied up in a house already. I was also expected to fork out half the cost of some small home improvements at my mum’s which left me struggling, but she said I was obliged as the house was ‘half mine’. I was stuck for a long time as if I ever gently suggested we sell up, DM got upset as she couldn’t afford to buy on her own.

Eventually her boyfriend moved in and bought me out of my share, he added up all my payments over the 5-ish years and added a couple of grand on top. It was half of the equity. (So say for example he bought me out for £20k but received £40k in equity) and obviously it’s gone up loads more in recent years so he is very happy indeed. I was desperate to just get out of the situation so I accepted whatever I was offered and happy to get back what I put in.

Fast forward to now and DH and I are doing fine financially, DM has just retired. She was so excited because she ‘found’ a stocks and shares ISA that she started after the divorce, she had only been chucking the odd £50 a month into it and it’s now grown to £150,000. This is on top of her work pension and state pension.

I can’t help feeling that she was putting way more into the ISA than £50 a month, to reach £150k in 15 years and that she was only able to achieve this because I was covering half of all the bills for 5 years. From the ages of 20-25 when I needed to start building my own life.

AIBU to feel a bit coerced and put out?

On the plus side I got back what I put in originally, and I am very good at budgeting now as have had to be. I may inherit DM’s half of the house etc, but who knows what will happen with regards to her care in the future etc. We don’t need the money, in one sense the graft I have had to do has stood me in good stead so I can’t complain.

On the downside, I lost out on a lot of free time and was pretty much workaholic from the age of 20-25 to keep up with the bills, had to cut short time with DC early on, which is time you never get back. And I must admit I can’t stand when DM and her DP talk about how shrewd they have been with their equity and investments when I gave up so much to facilitate their good fortune.

I don’t want money from them. But am I justified in feeling a bit uncomfortable about how it panned out?
And would you ever say anything to them or is this a touchy subject? I am not good with conflict.

£50pm for 15 yrs and she’s now got £150k, wow we better all get financial advise from your poor struggling mum!!

Is it possible she wants was investing in premium bonds? That might support her story that she was only chucking in the odd £50 here and there. She could have got lucky and won one of the top prizes. Otherwise, was it at all possible she could have earned all that from an ISA in 15 years?

I have an idea that the will should be 'tenants in common' so that you inherit 50 % when your mum dies. Unfortunately 'joint tenants' means that if your mum goes first he'll get everything. Then what happens when he dies?

I think the behaviour of your mum and her partner has been despicable towards you. You were just starting out in life. When my daughter was the same age we were supporting her through uni with a monthly allowance etc. That's the way it should be. OK maybe for a grown child to help support a parent if they're in dire straits, but clearly she wasn't.

However you can be very proud of yourself. But she should be very ashamed.

If this were me I would question her closely about the ISA money and then I would point out that I felt exploited because she was making money off the back of my efforts

£50 a month, with 3 percent interest for 15 years is approx 11k

ISAs are currently paying approx 1 percent

Unless she had a lump sum that she invested at the beginning

150k is an enormous return, I don't believe her

children should feel gratitude to their parents for all they've done for them and the years they have spent raising them.

Even children whose parents have screwed them out of time with their own kids by fleecing them financially?!

Did you ever see any paperwork for the money you were giving her? Mortgage, bills, council tax, food (presumably)?

I bet she stashed away a lot more than the odd £50 here and there.

I think a PP is correct re tenants in common, ie mum and partner can leave their respective shares to whoever they wish in their wills, and it seems you may have already had a conversation about this as you state:

*Wills were made recently and whatever happens, I have been asked not to force him to sell if she were to die first (she is older than him).

He will not tell anybody what is in his will, but he has no DC. I am not close to him so I wouldn’t expect any to go to me. Which is fine.*

On that basis it also seems your mum has left her share to you (subject to care fees, equity release etc!!). Did your mum ask you not to force him to sell should she predecease him? I'd certainly force a sale in these circumstances, given what they've both done to you.

Out of curiosity, do you know how much the house was sold for originally, and what it's now worth?

Do you know what the house was worth when he bought you out? So how much equity he gained?

I think I’d ask your mum for that amount.

Do not do a thing for her in old age. She will have the money to pay taxis to ferry her to appointments, meals on wheels, care home etc.

I am stunned at how your own mother has treated you. My mother would never do this and I cant begin to imagine doing this to my son.

I definitely would say something. She sounds truly vile.

@DOckDOck364. It was stocks & shares ISA not Cash. Long terms S&S ISA's have been returning around 8%pa. Well, my clients ones have....😁

CassetteTapes, can I just reiterate what a couple of previous posters have said - if your mum and her partner own the house as joint tenants, he will inherit her half if she dies before him. They need to own it as tenants in common for her to be able to leave her half to you in her will.

I would find out what it was worth when he bought you out.... It may help your decision making re moving forward.... You could get an idea from sold house prices sites and see what simialr houses sold around the time in the same street...

www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices.html

When they bought you out. You should have had the property valued by at least 3 estate agents
All paperwork should have been done via a solicitor
You should have received a lump sum of money
Did you do this

I think your mum was left a lump sum in the S&S ISA in the divorce. That would be the only way that it could be worth £150K now with only £50pcm invested, over 15 years.

So whilst your mum might not have been able to “afford” to buy on her own with her income 15 years ago, she probably had this lump sum she could have used. For whatever reason she preferred to make you responsible.

I would have to ask more questions about the ISA, as it’s such an outrageous amount to ‘discover’ and her story doesn’t add up, What she said about that would inform how I went on.

I think it would be highly unlikely to pay £50 per month into an ISA for 15 years and it be worth £150k. She would only have paid in £9k.
The only way to do that would be for it to be a Stocks and Shares ISA invested in companies that did fantastically well.

What I suspect she has done is save the money you paid her for mortgage and bills and actually paid the mortgage and bills herself from her wages. Only way I can see her building up that much money.

A good S&S ISA pays what, 8% now? Even assuming that had been steady over 15 years, you're talking about £450 a month.

NB my compound interest maths is guestimate only as I'm too lazy to do it properly.

I reckon you need to talk to her or you're right, it will fester. I would approach it as talking about how she is planning to look after herself in old age if she needs care etc because you have no plans to help her financially having done so in your 20s. You can then spell out exactly what that sacrifice meant for you. It may be that she won't/can't hear it though and you need to be prepared for that. I'd also prepare yourself for not inheriting anything. Sorry.

Her £50 bullshit literally doesn't add up.

She was financially abusive when she should have been facilitating you becoming independent.

I would find it hard to be in the same room as her due to this situation, nevermind keeping quiet when she harped on about being shrewed.

She threw your early adulthood under the bus and has now rewritten history to pretend it was her good money management? She abused your good nature to treat you like an ex who had court ordered alimony payments.

Absolutely appalling.

Oh bless you ..you are a wonderful daughter..But I feel your mum took advantage of you in a big way

“I’m glad you feel like that because I feel robbed of my early 20s and time with my child when they’re were small because I had to support mum. I don’t like it when you discuss how “shrewd” you’ve been in front of me so please don’t.”

Completely this.
You mum's partner ripped you off for £20k, & she enabled him. You should have been paid the entire £40K equity, & if your mum is sitting on a £150k nest egg from savings she was able to put by because you were working 6 days a week & missing out on your DC's early years, the least she could do would be to dip into it & repay you properly.

However - your mum is clearly used to being shored up, & is highly unlikely to admit culpability & responsibily - so prepare yourself that you will only receive the satisfaction of finally getting your feelings off your chest. A thank you &/or an apology might be nice, but your mum isn't going to want to admit that she's effectively diddled her own daughter out of a large sum.

Oh OP, first of all my heart massively goes out to you. You are clearly a wonderful human being and an even more wonderful daughter

However, your mum has emotionally manipulated you to do something that was financially silly at the age of 20. Of course you didn't understand the full implications of what you were doing, you were too young and your mum was in a desperate situation and she took advantage.

Secondly, there is no way on Gods green Earth she has built up that much of an ISA in 15 years from "chucking in an odd 50". Even doing £50 a week, every week would not bring that much returns. She is lying to you.

It's bad enough that she took advantage of you in the first place to put you in an unstable financial situation so young, its another thing to make you give up your maternity leave early because of the situation she put you in, even underpaying you what you should've been owed, but to do all this whilst sitting on an £150k ISA is disgusting.

She emotionally manipulated you, took advantage of you, made you give up time with your baby, all so she could have a nice little pension saved up at the end

I don't know how you can even look at her and be in the same room as her, never mind to not have said anything yet

I am sorry, OP, I have to agree with everyone else. Your mother financially abused you and then allowed her partner to profit from you as well. They are despicable people and I would be having this out with them before going low contact. But don't blame yourself - from what I have read in your OP, your mother knew exactly what buttons to press to make you feel guilty. I could not imagine treating my own children like this.

OMG you poor thing. This is horrendous behaviour OP, what kind of woman does this to her daughter?
Parents are meant to bust their ass to support their kids, not the other way round.

Hello, thanks all, sorry I have not been on all day.

I have checked out the house prices for sales at around that time. My mum’s DP got about double the equity as to what he paid me for.

I was bought out legally and I received a lump sum. I know exactly how much the mortgage payment was and even how much the interest rate was (I was so stressed about meeting the commitments when I was 20 that it’s burned into my brain!)

Thank you all so much for validating how I am feeling, the only trouble is that I don’t know how I am going to bring it up.
I am really angry but I’m not used to anger as I wasn’t really allowed to express it in childhood.