Hospital visit escalated out of control

[Outmuch]

DH here in need of advice. Apologies for epic post.

DC is month old and yesterday DW was concerned they were feverish and had a small mark on their arm. She phoned NH24 to be safe and her and baby were brought in for observation.

The fever was put down to the hot weather (all vitals are normal) and one of the nurses observed baby sucking it's arm which produced another small mark same as first.

We assumed the mystery was solved. all other tests were normal and baby was by all other accounts healthy. So assumed mum and baby would be home today...

Mum was informed as baby had a mark they were informing SS and today they've had numerous consultants but nobody is informing us when we can go home.
There's been suggestion someone fron SS could need to stay with us for a few days!!!

Does this seem ridiculous to anyone???!! On the balance of evidence:

• we self admitted to the hospital (not neighbours phoning over a domestic but our concerns)
• the mark had reasonable explanation as witnessed by 2 nurses
• baby has no other marks and is otherwise healthy confirmed by nurses (so no evidence of a pattern of abuse)
• baby has been visited by health care professional/midwife every 3 days since birth (stabilising feeding routine was a battle). These professionals have observed baby closely and would've reported anything untoward surely?

So this is one isolated mark, which is getting blown out of proportion.

Mum is upset and in constant tears. She's not being well updated and feels she's being punished for trying to be a good mum and report her initial worries.

If I wasn't so annoyed I'd find it hilarious. What happened to common sense? Appreciate any words of wisdom.

Thanks

Op I know how deeply upsetting it is for you to experience this, but remember it is for your baby's safety, they are not being unkind, they are following a procedure.

• Ask for the full names of both nurses (wards and the sister's name) who witnessed what happened to your baby. If they will agree please ask them to please write briefly what they saw, sign and date (This could be very very useful)

• If you have any videos or photographs please save them.

• Be calm, together at all times. Any raised voices or anger will not help your case at all.

• Given the number of visits your DW has received from HV I very much doubt your HV will have any concerns to support SS. It sounds like you are very supportive and supported.

This is frightening, but it will come to an end when they have established the facts. Try to get some sleep and comfort your wife, she must be beside herself.

As pp have said marks on non mobile babies are likely to trigger a social services referral.
Also true is that while mum and baby are in hospital they won't be the very top child protection priority but they should be seen reasonably quickly, not least because hospital staff will start getting fed up.
The losing weight stuff may slightly increase their concerns but I would expect health visitors to be asked to continue to support.
Social workers do not move into people's houses, there is no legislation which would make this possible. Occasionally very young mothers move into a foster carers house and there are very limited mother and baby units for some cases of significant concern. But social workers have their own homes they live in, you have just misunderstood something somebody said. Social workers will visit you in your home ( but they always leave)

This must be a horrible feeling, OP. But I think this is simply a tick box thing, so I hope your wife can be reassured. Even thirty odd years ago, a trip to hospital with my baby resulted in an unannounced visit from the health visitor next day. And things have tightened up HUGELY since then.

So yes, stay calm and co-operative, while still ensuring that steps are being taken efficiently to enable them to come home tomorrow.

OP, my heart really goes out to you and your DW. It's a crazy time anyway, adding all this to the mix must be so stressful and frightening. I hope you're doing OK.

Nothing constructive to add, I only wish to confirm for the BUT HOW COME SHE SAW THE COMMUNITY MIDWIFE SO OFTEN I NEVER DID THIS DOESN'T ADD UP brigade that I had a baby 20 weeks ago and also struggled to establish feeding, and the community midwife kept deferring on discharging me - I probably did see her every three days or so for quite a while. I was really grateful for her support. So, yeah, it does happen.

We had similar and it was horrible. We also had to remain in hospital. We had to make a (polite) pain of ourselves and keep asking, eventually getting a name at SS and calling direct pretty much saying did we need any legal advice as we were taking our daughter home that day (Christmas Eve). We were let go without seeing a social worker, but they did phone me saying they had no concerns and there would be no follow up.

I have nothing to add except good wishes to you both and your baby.
Just to answer some of the disbelief about frequent hc visits - i had daily MW visits when i had dd 4 years ago, for 3 weeks after birth (checking stitches, helping with 10% weight loss and mild jaundice, and then monitoring my unexpectedly high blood pressure). So it can happen, it’s just different in every trust/area much like all MW/HC practices you read about on MN.

Easier said than done, but please try not worry. I remember my son (at about 8 days old) sucking on his arm (and it caused a red mark). The HV and Student HV spotted him doing it and documented it in his "red book". They said that they wrote it all down so that no one would spot the marks and assume it was a non-accidental injury.

I'm a nurse, so I work with SS an awful lot (for my adult patients), however I have also asked them for advice re: my own children (due to my ex and his problems). I know how scary it can be but I've always found them to be helpful and kind. Wishing you all the best

Hope all gets sorted - we had regular visits for our recent dc - as feeding not established. Our day ten MW visit was cancelled due to them being busy, but we noticed a red mark on his back - it looked like a bruise/nasty rash and had not been seen by us or anyone before or documented at brith or red book - so we insisted he be seen by a doctor - MW came and sent us to A&E who declared it a type of birth mark - although we pointed out not seen at birth - we made them and follow up HV visit put it on the body map in the red book.

Do make sure it is recorded in the red book on the body map and he them to sign it.

Again thanks for the ongoing advice and support.

Any DC is breastfeeding with some additional bottle top ups. We have another DC1 (toddler) so when they were in nursey/bedtime my parents watched DC1 whilst I went to hospital for few hours. Trying to minimise disruption to DC1 routine.

I totally understand the need to raise and follow through SS concerns but equally I'm frustrated as zero progress was made today. 24hrs since they mentioned needing to report to SS and yet nothing was done in those 24hrs (a few unsuccessful phone call attempts late afternoon). No contact was made. No arrangements were agreed. It's in the best interests of baby and mum to resolve this issue and clearly nobody is owning the process of following through with SS which is unacceptable imo.

Sorry not sleeping well and it's plaguing my thoughts.

I had similar with the midwives with each 3 of my children where baby lost a lot of weight and I had daily visits of bf'ing support. It does happen.

OP, I can only imagine how you and your wife feel. I have experience of baby being in hospital and not knowing when you'll be out - it's awful. I sort of think that if you want to leave tomorrow then to get in touch with PALS, not with a complaint (and make that clear), but for support and for them to record the situation and provide guidance. Whilst you can leave hospital it's probably a good idea to have a record of what's happened and how you want to cooperate.

I hope you are all home soon.

I wonder if you could stress the impact on your other child of your wife being needlessly stuck in hospital?

Seems rather perverse that this issue is causing a toddler to be away from its mother for an extended period, very soon after birth of a sibling. There is actual harm being caused to the toddler, in an attempt to ensure no harm comes to the newborn. This is in addition to raising the risk your wife suffers PND/A, which could then affect both children.

I think PALS is a good call, in a ‘are you able to help us get this moving along, way’, rather than a complaint, much like pp suggests.

Also, could you ask the staff in the hospital which team at SS they are in touch with, and then start calling them up yourself? Maybe explain that you understand they have a job to do, but say you are concerned about the impact of an unnecessary absence on your toddler, and that prolonging such a stressful situation may have a detrimental effect on a new mother’s mental health. While you understand they have a procedure to follow, and no doubt few resources, you wonder if these adverse effects could be borne in mind, and is there any way they could speed things up, I.e, very politely and respectfully point out they are causing actual harm while carrying out this check into possible harm. It would also show you are mindful of the mental health if your wife and child.
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I'm so confused. Why is a 1 month old baby who has now completely recovered from a fever remaining in hospital?

Id be getting them out of there and away from the various hospital bugs! And letting the poor mom sleep.

Give them to midday op, and then explain that they are putting your baby at risk by keeping him/her in a hospital full of germs. They can easily follow up at home if they so wish to.

I hope you have managed a few hours sleep.

A living nightmare, but one that will soon be a memory op. Hope your baby and wife are okay this morning?

I have every sympathy with your wife. She's parted from her other young dc, worried about her new dc, then someone mentions SS and keeps her in hospital.

I would be panicking in her situation as I get really nervous when I don't understand what the situation is. I'd be inclined to list what has happened and then speak to PALS questioning whether the system in place is reasonable bearing in mind the stress it places on the parents. If you do not get a satisfactory response then refer it to your MP.

*sparkly72

Is there any reason why you aren't at the hospital with your wife and child?*

What, because he sounds like totally disinterested in them, right? Best start on the guy when he's obviously very concerned... FFS....

This timescale does sound totally ridiculous and you would have thought that if there were genuine concerns (enough to insist on mother & baby staying in hospital) that some action would have/should have been taken by now, imagine if there was a serious threat of harm and things were moving this slow!

I also got daily community MW visits with DD1 as she lost 12% of her birth weight and my milk was slow to come in - in fact at the start it was twice a day right at the start – in fact one day I think it was three times across the MW team – they were trying to avoid hospital admission which they did then they started spacing the visits down in second week so we were used to being by ourselves more.

Honestly the MW care up there was fantastic - didn't realise how good it was till we moved.

I agree OP get in touch with PALS and remain calm and ask questions – who are they contacting, when are they expecting this to be resolved – are they taking count impact on toddler and wife mental health, why do you have to remain in hospital.

I'm not sure I'd leave till it was resolved though or they decided we could.

...I still want to know who told you SS would stay at your house...

There's been a suggestion someone from SS could need to stay with us for a few days!!!.

WTAF? That is total bullshit for a start.

It could be time now to instruct a solicitor and perhaps even a private child specialist
Keep notes of the names of everyone who speaks to you and what they spoke about.
Strangely Child Protection Social Workers do not even acknowledge the damage done to any other children.
It looks very much to me that these Social Workers have gone barging down a road (of accusations) and can not find their way back.
Do not allow the Social Workers to follow you or DW to Solicitor or private Child Consultant. Unless request by either of the last named professionals.

No experience or advice that will help you but I just wanted to add that I understand how frustrated you must feel.

My son has had a condition from birth that means that we’re in hospital a lot of the time but being there a second more than we need to drives me insane.

I don’t want to give you any advice in case it’s the wrong thing to say but my thoughts are with you.

thebouquets
I'm not sure reading what OP has written that there has been any contact with social workers yet.
It seems that healthcare professionals saw an injury on a non mobile baby and have correctly followed protocol and tried to report this to social services.
They haven't made contact with social services yet so mother and baby are left waiting in hospital for this to happen.
So I think the last thing social workers have done is gone down any road, let alone accusations.
Keeping a note of your conversations and who you spoke to is a sensible idea however.

Such a shit safeguarding investigation given that nobody is safeguarding the other child who is at home!

I'm not suggesting that you are a risk, OP, just that by their logic you are being investigated as a potential risk (understandable) so the baby is being monitored in hospital, whilst you are totally unsupervised with the other child!

If the fever is gone, the Dr saying no more tests are needed but then mentioning Xrays, sounds to me like s/he thinks the marks are not from the baby sucking their arm & that an xray will show injury?

Op what a worrying time and utter waste of resources.

Fever and mark now gone.
If you had caused the mark deliberately you would hardly have phoned NHS 24??

The world has gone mad.