To think that Home Educated children should be inspected every year?

[jennymanara]

I think home education can work. I know a fair number of parents who are home educating from some who teach their kids to those who are unschoolers.
But I also think there are parents who home educate who are not up to the job and claim to be unschooling, but are in fact just educationally neglecting their children.
There should be an annual inspection of all kids being home schooled. This should check that children are actually getting some form of education, and not just left for example to play minesweeper all day, as one single mother I knew did with her teenage son.

SmileEachDay I’m sorry I don’t see what you aren’t understanding. If you met other HEers what could they have done to help, or observed. If you didn’t how would listing a group of families you had no interaction with help in similar cases to yours?

I haven’t said anything about listing or registers.

Very happy to outline the signs of abuse, if that’s what you mean by “observed”?

Are you mixing me up with another poster? Which of my posts are you responding to?

Nobody knows if abuse rates are higher in HE children or school children.
And school children are inspected at school - on their educational attainment and teachers notice many signs of neglect or abuse and report.
I suspect many HE parents know they are educationally neglecting their kids and are afraid of being found out.

but will not support anything that would actually help.
I think it would be interesting to hear what you think would actually help and how? I think you’re wrong, I think they are by nature a child centred and concerned group.

So you think we need to institute a regime of inspection on the basis of not knowing if there is a problem at all?

Well that's nuts.

I mean I have a hunch that people who have trampolines in their gardens are way more likely to be abusing their kids - so I request inspections of them!

Also, we do know. There are numbers and they do not show that HE are at higher risk.

I suspect many HE parents know they are educationally neglecting their kids and are afraid of being found out.
If "educational neglect" will be considered not teaching gender agenda - people need to be afraid

I'll admit I found it hard not to pressure my DD to try reading...and there were times when I felt neglectful for that. But it turns out the HE method was right. Leave them till they want to learn it and they love it when they do.

DD went from 3 years behind on reading to 2 years ahead in about 18 months.

This is why inspecting education in this community is a difficult thing to do.

Do you think I DID neglect my DD's education in those years I wasn't teaching her to read? Or is it school based education that is flawed in this respect and neglecting a whole generation of children?

YANBU there used to be more checks, it all seems pretty lax these days.. amazing that parents can get fined for taking their kids out of school for an unauthorised holiday, but perfectly ok to home ed and not send your child to school at all, with no watchful eye.

I suspect many HE parents know they are educationally neglecting their kids and are afraid of being found out

This is where the problem lies. Schools are uniformal and follow the same curriculum, they are judged by attainment at certain levels.

How on earth could this apply to families that don't follow a curriculum. to all H.ed communities nationwide. Who would deem educational neglect? Who would judge/ evaluate the education provided? Would they be a teacher with no experience of H.ed comparing to the NC.

A parent who agrees to being on roll and that their child will be in school in a place funded by the LA is breaking that agreement by their child not turning up. A parent HEing is educating their child at home.

IS being inspected every year safeguarding?

There are no circumstances in which I would agree to my home being inspected. I'm not a criminal, I'm a parent.

Would anyone be ok with their private space being inspected on the spurious grounds that something bad might be happening?
Children are not automatically'safe' at school. There was a rape committed on school premises every school day last year. 5000 sexual crimes committed at school that were not rape.

My friends' 5yo was taped by an 11yo boy ...nothing got done about it. Oh, social services called round a few times, but nothing happened to the boy who committed the crime.
Yes, I home educate. No, I don't follow the curriculum, because most of it is nonsense.
No, I don't replicate school at home.
No, my child is not at risk. In fact he is safer here than he would be in school.
When did we totally lose faith in parents and their ability to raise children?
If inspection of home educators is on the cards, why aren't inspections planned for those who have children too young for school?
If children are being abused and neglected, there's a real long holiday coming up, better go check em all then!

I'm baffled that people still place such blind trust in a government that lies, defrauds and neglects its vulnerable sick, elderly and disabled.

Our education system is underfunded and broken. Children are failing in school every day, nothing gets done.
Teachers are not all amazing. Govt website has a huge list of teachers disciplined and struck off for paeodphilia, theft, drug taking, fraud, drunkenness, inappropriate behaviour, literally hundreds of them. Go read it and then tell me how my child is at risk at home with me.

Children fall under several categories. I don't think they've been understood here, forgive me if I'm wrong. I know the media has gone a long way to cast HE families as shady types but there is genuinely already a system in place for identifying us who actually home educate.

Schooled children - sent to school daily.

Home educated children previously registered at a school - reported to LA and are already being monitored. (This makes up the vast majority of HE children, my own family included).

Home educated children never sent to school whose parents are legitimately home educating - either A, reach out to their LA, or B, are active in the community and not invisible by any means anyway. (Seen by Gps, dentists and so on who could report safeguarding on snapshot moments such as the intended annual monitoring would be).

Abused children being wrongfully classed as home educated children (simply as they weren't registered at a school) - kept indoors and abused at home. Not registered anywhere and not seen by anyone at all since birth, if birth was registered. Or not seen in years by any medical professionals they would expect to see, such as a dentist.

Abuse can of course happen in any of these categories and as we know, abuse is often hidden well.

What would further monitoring of HE families who are already under a LA achieve? It wouldn't find the ones lost through the cracks.

I find this debate fascinating.
I grew up in a country that isn't very accepting of anything different yet home tutoring was encouraged. Children didn't start school until seven years of age, so were effectively 'home educated' until then.

To receive an education that is completely individual to the child and is formatted around his or her needs and abilities is seen as a privilege, and generally these families are respected as very rarely anything controversial happens amongst them.
It's a culture shock to find it so stigmatized here!

As to whether a register will be useful - the proof will be in the pudding, most likely at the detriment for those children whose parents are doing an outstanding job in an area so judged and misunderstood.

ohrainy I am so sorry for what you suffered. I wonder if you fully understand that what you describe as happneing to you in the past is already impossible under the new/current system. Anyone who withdraws their child from school will be visited and checked up on under current rules.

Completely unreasonable.
Do you know for instance that you can follow an entire curriculum on Minecraft?
Including:
Reading

Handwriting

Creative Writing

Spelling & Vocabulary

Classical Literature

Biographies

Classical Music

Mathematics

Science

History

World Geography

Social Studies & Current Events

Computer Skills

Building & Design

Art, Drawing and Design

Creative Comics

Library Skills

Aaaaand... coding.

The truth is, you dont actually have a jar of glue what's going on with your home "friends".
Nobody has to explain to you WHY they are on Minecraft, that "actually they are on it 2hrs a day whilst learning about ironmongery and they are working on tools and trades, whilst also exploring it's history, decline and modern uses"... And how that then lead them to study ancient civilisations .
And all because of an anvil on Minecraft.

Meanwhile im teaching school children with an American accent from YouTube!

There are lots of STEAM computer games that I highly recommend that are also utilised in schools so why not lin HE? If it's lazy home educating then surely it's lazy teaching too?

@ohrainydays

Our conversation is over. I think that’s for the best as I seem to be causing you some distress. Call it a victory if it makes you happy. I don’t think you are really here for a debate and I don’t think anyone can get through to you. I certainly don’t seem to be the first to take this position.

You feel it appropriate to attack people as being ‘paranoid’ (a genuine and serious mental illness you so easily make light of) and to hand-waive the experiences of others but are outraged if challenged on the basis of your opinions despite your status as an abuse survivor.

You appear to have a knack for misrepresenting what I say. I don’t recall ever referring to your abuser as being ‘hypothetical’. I have referred to the hypothetical evil genius Home Ed mastermind (exaggeration) that is used as a scarecrow to justify more curtailment of Home Educated Children’s rights. Likewise you have had it explained to you by me and others that my microchipping HE kids was clearly used as hyperbole to help illustrate a point. The fact that you continue to misrepresent this is also worrying. Frankly I get the impression that you are manipulative and see only danger in engaging with you further.

If you are struggling with your past then seek professional help. Good luck to you.

@Sootyandsweep2019 so you would be happy for a complete stranger to come to your home and privately discuss your child’s education with said child?

@AngrySquid I went through school with alcohol and abusive parents and teachers knowing about it and deciding to ignore it. They also knew about a teacher bullying me for years and my entire class complained to head of year in my final year at school and they still decided to ignore it. I left with literally nothing and screwed up college because I wasn’t in a good place partly because of school and home (college did try to help to be fair to them). I succeeded despite school.

ohrainydays .I have asked you questions that you haven't answered.

I think this thread is upsetting you ohrainydays. It’s hard to see what you are looking for.

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I honestly don’t see how a one off inspection of children who are educated outside of institutions is going to protect anyone from anything.

How will the inspector be able to assess the education being provided and why do these children need more investigation to ensure they aren’t being abused than any other child?

How would a register safeguard anything?

I think HEers are fairly open to all sorts of ideas, but there has to be a rationale behind them that holds some water.

A few facts for your consideration:

1. All parents are responsible for their child's education. Home education is just parenting without delegating the education element of that responsibility. If I am fit to patent, I am fit to home educate.

1. Children are only in school for 13% of their cared-for time. If home educators need checking up on, then so do all parents.

1. Abuse does not start at compulsory school age; if the govt really cared about abuse, they would not have cut the health visitor service.

1. No one can define what a perfect universally-applicable education looks like. Try it!

1. Home educators have rejected the state's definition of a good education- why would they want to be assessed by the system they have rejected?!

1. Innocent til proven guilty, rights to privavy, family life, educate your child in accordance with your wishes etc.

1. Local Authorities get no funding for their duties in relation to home education.

1. There is no qualification in home education. Why would I want to be assessed by someone with no qualifications or experience, who has been trained by and is employed by a system I have legally chosen to reject? Or worse, has already completely failed or just not worked for my child?!

1. If anyone has concerns about a child, we all have a duty to report our welfare concerns. It is community and family, not the state, who see when there are problems. If you are thinking, 'someone should do something about that', you are the someone. School does not prevent abuse and I maintain that if someone really dislikes their child, they are unlikely to refuse the govt free child minding service and put themselves under the spotlight of being home edders!

I think that's enough for now! I could go on. I've never had a home ed visit from our ("good") LA that has offered me anything useful, in fact, as we feel under pressure to put our best foot forward, it has usually wasted a learning day while we tidy our fun-filled, creative house!!

No one is as invested in or cares about my children as much as me and their father. If someone can prove otherwise, then they have a right to take over. Until then, I, knowing my child best, have to be trusted as the best person to raise my children, including with their education.