Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Adoption with parental consent

158 replies

FakeUsername · 21/06/2019 09:42

I hope to phrase this respectfully, and would be grateful for anyone with more insight and opposing views- I am not an expert. I am asking questions. To be clear, I certainly do not disagree with the idea of adoption in the case of relinquished children, or those with no one to care for them. Also I think adopters themselves are usually resilient people who do amazing jobs (often managing a lot of fall out from a poorly run system, for example adoption following inadequate support of a child over a long period). I’m also not into the weird stuff online about financial incentives for adoptions etc and don’t wish to echo individuals who say this.

I’m concerned that the process is sometimes flawed. That a secret court can split families without evidence that would be taken to a criminal court. That particularly emotional abuse cases have potential to be unsound. Or new evidence comes to light in an irreversible process. Is the risk acceptable, that children are removed without warrant for the sake of others. There could be a clause for maybe categories of physical abuse and criminal convictions of neglect or assault and therefore losing parental rights (eg a criminal conviction of abuse)- but most cases I believe don’t reach this. I’m not sure we are placing enough value in family structure and identity. Or maybe working with families to either adequately support them, or work towards a point of accepting the best route forward is adoption. Does the system have enough checks, and when does it become too secretive to be held to account.

Many families may either react poorly to professionals or have difficulty acting in court in a way that reflects parenting. The current system has few checks or recourse for when it goes wrong for families. Some families can present themselves in a way to the system that shields parents, others get lost in it. For example some women may speak culturally of events in a way seen as ‘minimising’ events, whereas another culturally speaks very openly to professionals. Both carry out the same actions.

I’d also question the links of poverty, budget cuts and adoption from families below the poverty line. If society is either directed towards a bias or families are facing additional struggles that break up units. That underfunded care systems can lead to more unsafe conclusions, strings of locum SW turning over in some departments creating holes in chronology and inconsistencies. We need to be very very very robust if we are to separate a family. Not a bitty system that can be unpredictable and act differently for the same issues.

Do we do enough to support care leavers, is it a cycle that can be broken?

Do we have higher numbers/ different practices from other countries and do we need to learn? Do we need to look at ourselves, track children better, listen to more stories? Are we too often placing children but not talking about disruptions or outcomes?

To me it seems a huge huge deal to separate a family forever (or childhood) and bar contact. A closed adoption, without contact, for every single case seems very difficultly. Disruption, where an adoption ends, is also an issue. If we have a fixed adoption that then breaks down due to a faulty system placing the family in an impossible situation the impact on children is HUGE.

Is there some element of a perception of punishing parents for actions? Do we ever lose focus on the child’s rights and future in the case ion how a mother may present and judgements made?

I won’t write an essay, but I’m happy to expand. As I said these are not views of an expert, if I cause offence I apologise, I hope for respectful dialogue (or being ignored which is also fine!). For transparency I have not had a child in care, these views mainly come from talking to a close friend who had a disrupted adoption/ lots of care places and returned to a (rather dysfunctional) mother and siblings as an adult for a relationship that is messy but carried on. Also from working with children in many stages in care. Are there many cases where contact with family and care would be appropriate?.

Lastly- if you are an adoptee or adopter I hope you do not take questioning a system personally . I do not question an adoptive family as less valid in anyway, I am asking about the UK process.

OP posts:
SavanahXx · 26/06/2019 10:16

I wonder if there will be a day were people can have their own opinion on MN without it being the same opinion as the majority without people questioning it and trying to force their beliefs on you, because they think their opinion is the 'right' one. There are no right or wrong answers. Something someone says doesn't need a direct question in response to it, nor do you need to go round and round saying the same shit. Someone's always going to have a different opinion than yours.

MtotheG · 26/06/2019 10:58

@elliollie thanks, it was badly worded, it’s clear what you mean now. And believe me, I totally get the enormity. I live with it daily in a way that frankly birth parents and adopters never will, because they had choices (however limited) in what happened in my life and I did not. In theory I’d of course preferred to not have been adopted, but in reality given the circumstances I am thankful every day that I was. I certainly wouldn’t have preferred to have been in long-term foster care which is what the OP is about and I thought it would be helpful to give that view. Only mine of course, it it comes from lived experience of having been that child. I wish you well too. Smile

darkriver19886 · 26/06/2019 14:30

I don't think long term foster care is right for anyone. At least with adoption children can feel they belong to a family. Foster carers do an amazing job but, at the end of the day it is just a job.

Cassimin · 26/06/2019 15:21

I am a long term foster carer.
As far as we are concerned our fc is very much part of our family and is treated the same as my birth children.
They have been with us since the age of 4 and will stay with us for as long as they want to.
They were put up for adoption but due to their medical conditions and attachment to mum this was not possible.
Being a foster carer is a job but it’s really not as simple as that.
We all love our fc and want the very best for them.
I wish mum and dad could have taken them back but this is never going to happen. Their life is too chaotic. In the 8 years I have known them they haven’t changed.
They were given chance after chance but just couldn’t maintain a lifestyle that would benefit a child.
They tell the child they were removed for nothing, they claim they did nothing wrong. This is very unfair and confusing for the child.
Some parents just can’t parent.

flapjackfairy · 27/06/2019 20:07

@darkriver.
I second every word of Cassimins post. We have a long term foster child and an adopted child. Both have very complex needs and require round the clock care. Our fc has been with us 12 years since he was a baby and we love him exactly the way we love our adopted child and our 3 birth children. In fact there are legal reasons why we haven't been able to adopt him and that brings us to another point , many children are not legally released for adoption so where should they live if not in foster care ? Adoption is not suitable for all children and the courts won't always grant a placement order as in our case.
And to be honest every foster carer I know would agree that it is not only a job any more than a doctor or nurse would say that what they do is just a job.

darkriver19886 · 27/06/2019 21:00

Sorry I misspoke.

Firecarrier · 27/06/2019 22:45

Sorry, this is going to be blunt.

I'm too tired to put a polite coherent post but just wanted to say to anyone reading this who doesn't have knowledge of the 'system' Savannah's posts are extremely misleading.

It is a lie to say it is easy to have your child removed. She claims living in a deprived area means higher chance of removal! Tosh, (if anything it would probably be the opposite due to general perception of what is 'normal' I'll give you a clue - lower standards than should be) also due to the huge expense of removal.

I live in a deprived area and am a foster carer, there are many children I see who would be 'better off' in foster care.

I concur with previous posts too that I have never heard birth parents admit any fault. Don't get me wrong I've been able to have pleasant relationships with the majority but sadly I wouldn't trust them to raise their children.

The parents are given support (usually multiple times) before removal.

flapjackfairy · 28/06/2019 09:42

@darkriver
You didn't speak out of turn You are entitled to see it your way as much as anyone else. I just wanted to put a long term foster carers perspective and make the point that not all kids are free for adoption. For what its worth I have always appreciated your input on adoption related matters and wish you nothing but good things going forward x

New posts on this thread. Refresh page
Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

This thread is closed and is no longer accepting replies. Click here to start a new thread.