...to wonder why people are so rude about vegans?

[CheekyWombat101]

Obviously not everyone, but in general, I can’t go a single day without hearing a comment or spotting an eye roll if the word ‘vegan’ is spoken out loud. It’s like a dirty word. Ironically a word usually brought up by someone who isn’t vegan, but starts the conversation and then takes offence at it. It’s really bizarre.

Over and over again you hear associated words like... fad, militant, extreme, unhealthy...

Why? Why do some non-vegans take such an interest, and such an offence to it all?

Non-vegans who don’t care or are supportive - you are awesome! Please keep doing what you’re doing, it’s really refreshing.

@Hithere12
But doesn't the fact that you feel you need to justify yourself by comparing the environmental impact of your choice not to have children with a vegan's choice to have children kind of prove that point? "I eat meat but you can't judge me because I chose not to have children" You shouldn't feel you have to justify your choice. It is your choice and a perfectly legitimate one.

This is the issue right here. If someone is vegan, there is an automatic assumption that a) they are doing it to save the world and b) they are judging you for not doing the same.

Veganism is evolving in the same way everything else is. I became a vegan by doing veganuary. I didn't expect to last a week but I actually love it. I am not an animal rights activist or an environmentalist. I don't see veganism as my identity.(it actually grates a bit on me how many times I have said "I'm vegan" on this thread.) It is just a thing I do.

I have joined vegan groups and they are far more interested in helping each other with recipes, restaurant recommendations and practical support than spouting bile against meat eaters.

@TheDarkPasssenger

Again, how do you know every single vegan you know pushes it on people? Did it ever occur to you that you could know vegans who don't push it on people but you just don't know they are vegan precisely because they never bring it up?

And again I ask how do people always seem to know so many vegans in the first place?

I think vegans have bigger problems than other people taking a piss. Companies taking a piss...

Remember this M&S "steak" ? 😂

@Ticklingcheese

Baked beans on toast? Jacket potato with beans? Pasta with a simple tomato sauce? It's really not that difficult if you think about it for even just a few seconds.

And meat eaters can eat vegan food. Vegans however cannot eat non vegan food so your analogy of catering for each other doesn't work.

@Alsohuman Assuming you are living in the UK, is it pretty much impossible to be vegan and remain healthy, unless you live off imported foods, cosmetics, shoes and clothing.

Most vegan foods (rice, nuts and avocadoes, for example) require an awful lot of water, destroying landscapes and natural resources in mass-production. Nut production comes with similar issues to drug production in terms of human use and abuse as well. And to get a decent amount of food and variety in your diet is impossible without relying heavily on imported goods. Animal fat has far fewer environmental issues associated with it than plant-based oils; the former often being a by-product of the meat industry.

Cosmetics - the alternatives to animal-based products often include palm oil, which is well known for the damag done to the environment.

Clothing - where to start? Unless you wear 100% hemp clothing or cotton (with the associated water use) you are either wearing animal-based products or some form of polymer. Leather, again, is a by-product of the meat industry, as is wool.

I'm not debating that we should reduce our animal consumption in general, of course, but going vegan isn't as ethical as it is made out to be, just because insects and plant life aren't quite as cute as lambs.

“But can't meat eaters feel strongly for their way of doing things, too?”
.So you have ethical/religious reasons for eating meat at every meal? Do tell me more!!

queenofthetofutree i wouldn't dream of having a party and serve beans on toast etc. I have really tried to accommodate all and spent a huge amount of time in doing so. It isn't helping that the person I'm thinking of, is super picky, so you can spend a hole day catering just for her. She will then make a huge thing out of questioning what is in it (at the table) get her answers, and then say no can't eat it, I don't like broccoli (or cauliflower or you name it). And then spend the entire meal looking sad, talking about people not understanding the vegan way.

This kind of behavior gives vegans a bad name, I think. I have meet some who just eats what they know is OK for them.

And no meat eaters can't necessarily just eat vegan. I get stomach cramps and soo much wind you wouldn't dream of it 🤣.

bertrandrussel i know you can get quite eerh not polite, so won't have a fight with you.

As I wrote, I answered the ops question, if op was interested.

“This kind of behavior gives vegans a bad name, I think. I have meet some who just eats what they know is OK for them.”
An arsehole is an arsehole-regardless of dietary preferences.

There are lots of meat eaters on this thread who are behaving like arseholes. I don’t think they are giving meat eaters a bad name.

But doesn't the fact that you feel you need to justify yourself by comparing the environmental impact of your choice not to have children with a vegan's choice to have children kind of prove that point? "I eat meat but you can't judge me because I chose not to have children" You shouldn't feel you have to justify your choice. It is your choice and a perfectly legitimate one

You can’t be serious? I was responding to a sanctimonious comment about how people feel guilty about not being because of environmental damage. I was educating that person that going vegan is going to make little to no difference on the environment compared to not having children, it’s not something many people are aware of!

Vegans with kids are doing 75x more damage to the environment than meat eaters. They should feel much more guilty than childless meat eaters by your own logic.

“bertrandrussel i know you can get quite eerh not polite, so won't have a fight with you.”

Not sure where you got that- I a very rarely rude. But if you can’t defend your position, fair enough.

LOL@ not polite 😱😂

I am ambivalent. But then I can tell you all the vegans I know, I couldn't tell you all the carnivores I know. Only vegans seem to need to tell people. I respect their personal philosophy but I don't need to hear it. I am happy with my choices to eat meat.

Bert is always polite btw,I don't think I've ever read a rude post.

Chillingly polite

@Tessalectus, so non vegans don’t eat nuts, rice or avocado? Cosmetics aren’t an issue that particularly affect a bearded man with no vanity, whose toiletries are restricted to a bar of soap and a stick deodorant. Clothes? Well, most vegans don’t wear wool or leather and while cotton production absolutely consumes vast amounts of water, it’s possible to minimise your impact by buying the minimum of clothes from ethical sources.

All you’ve done is highlight the damage all of us do to the planet. Mindful vegans do less than the rest of us.

“Bert is always polite btw,I don't think I've ever read a rude post.”
Thank you. I admit I do say “bollocks” quite a lot. But in a very polite way.....

As the joke goes:

• How do you tell someone is a vegan?
• You don't need to, they'll tell you themselves!

All the vegetarians I know are just that, without going on about it. All the vegans I know are incredibly annoying and make every conversation about their diet. Admittedly a small sample but still...

'Bollox/bollocks' is a necessary expression on MN these days!

Tge environmentalist vegans are questionable considering bees are becoming extinct because of all the pesticides that are catering vegetables and fruits. End we all know the world will come to a halt if bees become extinct.

I would love to go vegan. Or mostly vegan anyway.

Planet reasons. Want to switch to a plant based diet. Not sure where to start though.

I'm going to try and gradually swap a meal out each week and make it vegan.

There are some crazy militant vegans out there. I remember in my first week of MN there was a mad poster who kept saying that milking cows was a form of cow rape... and how awful it was 😳
But it's the same with everything. There's always a militant side or extreme side to everything, be it religion or politics or, in this case, food.

You can't tar everyone with the same brush though. That's really not fair.

Tge environmentalist vegans are questionable considering bees are becoming extinct because of all the pesticides that are catering vegetables and fruits*

I’m not a vegan but what does fruit and vegetables have to do with being vegan? Do you think vegans replace chicken with a mango?

No they eat vegan proteins! Meat eaters like myself eat tonnes of vegetables lol I don’t understand this point at all.

@Alsohuman I am trying to highlight to you that, a a non-vegan, I have the choice to make far more ethical decisions than a lifetime of veganism would leave me with.

None of the points you have made above have any relevance. The vast majority of meat eaters do not get their protein through huge amounts of nuts and can make a choice to use butter and lard as base-fats, rather than oils or nut-/avocado-enriched foods. Plant protein is not absorbed as easily as animal protein (nor are other nutrients, such as iron), so vegans have to over-consume.

I am all for reducing consumption in general, but wool and leather in particular are by-products and therefore do not add to overall land over-use, compared to cotton and hemp farms. And, given we can rear the animals locally, don't have the same issues with transport.

So as a non-vegan, I can still choose to buy only the minimum amount of clothing, but my choice of clothes may well be more ethical.

But this isn't about who is more ethical, in the end. I just wish the vegans I know (who are rather vocal and force their children into veganism) would stop being sanctimonious about their choices and accept that their lifestyles may not be as morally superior as they think. I also wish they'd accept basic biological facts about the damage a vegan diet can do to the body, which is adapted to an omnivorous diet, and the wider environment.

Probably for the same reason that vegans are so rude to meat eaters. They believe in different things and believe they're way is the right way and the others are wrong.

@hithere12 point was meat eaters/vegetarians/vegans etc we are all as bad as each other when it comes to environmental issues.

please If vegans dont eat plant based foods what exactly are they eating?

eaters/vegetarians/vegans etc we are all as bad as each other when it comes to environmental issues

They aren’t any where near as bad as each other, the meat industry (especially cows) cause so much more global warming. Anyone who has done any research on global warming knows this. That’s like saying getting a private jet to Scotland is as bad as driving there. They are both bad for the environment but one is much worse.

please If vegans dont eat plant based foods what exactly are they eating?

They eat regular foods like cereal (with almond milk), quorn, lentils, chickpeas, crisps, mock meats, veggie burgers, they don’t live off lettuce?