Jobs are getting more competitive and wages don't match effort

[mumofthreehundred]

Is it just me or are jobs getting crazy competitive these days?

I lost out on an entry level job today because I didn't have enough experience. I'm a graduate, first class degree , with tonnes of experience just in a different sector. The job was so poorly paid there would be no national insurance. I was interviewed by a panel four people and spent hours filling in the longest form.

I just can't find much else out there that pays enough to cover my current situation (3 children in nursery, yes I had surprise twins)

There is so much competition these days that you can't afford to rock boat and ask for more money or flex working.

I'm trying to move out of my current sector but it just seems impossible these days.

I don't have time or money to retrain. See above for family situation!

I am sure I remember a time 15-20 years ago when it was so much easier to get a job. Drop your cv in, head to a recruitment agency etc. You could pick a professional career and there was a clear route in. I'm seeing a lot of jobs that are minimum wage and they should be more. Others require lots and lots of volunteering before you could be considered for a paid job. Or some extra qualification that costs a few grand to get.

Aibu or is the job situation getting out of hand for people like me?

The sheer volume of non vocational graduates is partly the problem. Disproportionate to genuine grad schemes

A lot of the truly rubbish degrees that I see in new applicants are actually vocational though - I'm thinking Tourism, journalism, media production etc. They are often in areas where pay is low in any case, jobs are scarce, and and a degree doesn't get you much further than on the job training. Personally I'd choose a person with a decent BA in History or Physics first.

As a recent graduate I'm finding this thread interesting.

I did a so called "proper" subject at an RG uni (maths), have managed to get a temp job and have an interview for an entry-level job that only wants GCSEs. doubt I'll get that one. Either way, won't be using any maths skills and won't be earning more than 20k.

In contrast, my friend graduated last year with an Art degree from an ex-poly And went straight into a fairly well paying, relevant to her degree, job. Not at all jealous there.

And refugees caught in Greece is caused by?

A lot of the truly rubbish degrees that I see in new applicants are actually vocational though - I'm thinking Tourism, journalism, media production etc.
But for a lot of jobs they want the so called rubbish degree. My last job, after I left, was advertised with a person spec that included a journalism degree (which I dont have and really didn't need).
Everything has been "professionalised'.
Whoever the pp was who wanted a trainee go learn on the job-that's rare now.
And yy to it being almost impossible to move sector. Nobody will accept transferable skills anymore. I see jobs advertised wanting candidates to have the EXACT experience needed.
I think the problem actually stems from the fact that there are so fewer manufacturing jobs now; people who would have worked as, say, pattern cutters in a local factory are now applying for low level admin jobs.

And as technology advances won’t they’re be less jobs ?

This is what happens when everyone is pushed into going to university and you can get into some with awful grades. It's took away the prestige of gaining a degree.

If I was advising any young person now I would make them think twice about Uni unless they A. Wanted a traditional vocational course like Medicine, Engineering, Pharmacy etc or B. Good subject at Russell Group Uni like Maths, English Lit or C. Going for Oxbridge.

Where I live, there are few decent jobs - unless you are a teacher, healthcare professional, solicitor or something of that ilk. There are minimum wage jobs in tourism, retail and hospitality. There is no industry here or HQs of corporate companies.

There is an NHS Trust that is continually recruiting admin staff at band 2 - 4. Most of the jobs are badly paid (17-19k) and part time. I see the same jobs being re-advertised over and over. Especially medical secretaries. Yet in other parts of the country, admin job adverts attract 250 applicants. 🤷🏻‍♀️

I was working in an NHS office manager job (band 4) until recently when I decided I had to retrain via a university post graduate programme or I would be forever stuck in admin hell.

There will definitely be fewer low skilled jobs around. Factories, manufacturing, retail, basic clerical jobs etc. My old NHS Trust no longer needs audio typists for example as dictation is digital now or outsourced overseas. Medical secretaries have been downgraded to a band 3 and there are fewer of them. As they have retired, they haven’t been replaced. As much of the job was audio typing at one point, fewer of them are needed. BUT the job descriptions of a band 3 med sec is exactly the same as a band 4 used to be. A band 4 med sec is now called a senior/admin manager/admin team leader which used to be a band 5 job. So did an office manager.

If I was being paid minimum wage, I would definitely put in minimum effort. My old job - around 22k a year. How much did I care about it? Very little! At work I smiled nicely and was polite and friendly but inside I did not care. I certainly never did any unpaid overtime!

worried about boredom and as a small business things like recruitment fees are a lot and we couldn't afford to replace them a year later - I’m sure there are many workers like me who are in their early 50s who would love a job like this -we wouldn’t be leaving a year later and we are hard workers with degrees and lots of skills. We want to downsize our jobs a bit, or do something different, will work for less money than we currently get, won’t be bored - we’ve had enough of the stress and politics.. That’s what is so frustrating.

That's it Basket jobs are being downgraded all the time. I honestly don't think it's because more people have degrees. It's just that in a lot of areas there is really no industry. Your best bet in my part of the UK is to train as an electrician, mechanic or plumber, and even then apprenticeships are very competitive and you have to have a mate or an uncle in the trade. Also any job that is traditionally female- admin, TA, childcare- is increasingly badly paid in real terms.

Basket that's exactly what I'm seeing everywhere. Lower levels expected to do higher skilled jobs. Trouble is if you don't put in extra effort now, in most places you won't last.

I often feel guilty for all of the extra effort I did put in - it is being used not only against me but against all of us now. I'm seeing lower level job roles being forced to take on higher paid role skills, and the higher pay roles vanishing, everywhere. As the op says, so much work is entirely unpaid, voluntary nowadays. And still the privileged witter on about how many choices we all have.

I agree daisypond. It's very unlikely someone in their 50s would take the risk of leaving a job given how hard it would be for them to find a new one!

I hope it's changed now, but I hope universities are encouraging more experience and voluntary work now. I walked straight into work from uni with a humanities degree 10 years ago, but that was only because I volunteered in term time in a related field, organised my own internships in summer holidays and took paid work where I could. Others coasted through uni, waited until they graduated and were disappointed when they realised they needed work experience or voluntary to get related work to separate them from every other graduate applying. Some graduates just don't help themselves. Too many people are going to university so you really have to set yourself apart, whether that's fair or not is another question, but we can help ourselves.

Wages have stagnated in my field, salaries are much the same as when I was graduating 10 years ago. Public sector sets the rate for my sector and obviously that's taken a complete nose dive. I've decided as much as I like my job I don't want to feel undervalued and under paid, so I've just taken a new job in a related sector, a sort of side step (slight step up) but in a field with much more opportunity. It was the only way I am going progress at any rate really. It's a saturated sector.

I'm currently looking at a job and wondering whether to bother applying. It's a step up, there aren't many of those in my work area any more. There are things I haven't done before... rather like my old job when I took it, you expected 15 years ago to have some new things to learn and employers expected it took a while before you became really effective. Now, though, if you can't tick every 'desirable' criteria and know the organisation in advance through voluntary work, it's a waste of everyone's time: you'll be asked what extras you can bring too. It's for £30k in another part of the country. 30k is a good wage in most parts of the country. It is nevertheless not enough to move my family on given house prices. How crazy has employment got??

so you really have to set yourself apart, whether that's fair or not is another question, but we can help ourselves.

And when everyone is doing what you are doing to 'help yourself', that is what the next generation of jobseekers will be forced to do for less money again. That is what I have seen avalanching. What was the point of trying? The more you try, the more exploited you get.

Oh and I've never stayed in a job for more than 3 years. I have found the only way to progress and diversify my experience, and to chase the money and opportunities is by switching employers semi regularly. In my sector at least. Thankfully this isn't looked down on like it used to be, well not in my field as I say, seems to be expected more of my generation.

@DarkAtEndOfTunnel no one I knew who graduated with did half the experience I did. I volunteered at a service at home, I volunteered with 3 services at uni, I got paid related work when studying abroad (only one in our group to do so). So many saw uni as a good time and not actually a time to think about careers. I'm not saying all graduates are like this, but most of my friends doing humanities did not think beyond graduation. So while higher education isn't sustainable IMO, in my experience, not every graduate is going out there and doing all they can while at uni, so if you do it, you stand a good chance.

I’m seriously looking at retraining altogether. I’ve thought about teaching but I don’t think it’s for me. I’m now looking at social work. I have worked in the media all my life but technology is taking over. Jobs are advertised at the same pay as 25 years ago. It’s shocking.

And some people wonder why many especially in deprived areas don't bother! Not worth the hassle and expense to work for minimum wage especially if you've got kids.

I hate the old you are over qualified argument because it's why I can't escape the profession I'm in.

I'll bite re medieval history. On good advice I went to a top university and studied something that interested me, which luckily was a "proper" academic subject. Student finance only covered the basics so I had a part time retail job which taught me how to communicate with adults who weren't other students or lecturers. I'd never really had a plan so after graduating I went into an entry level temp job in business and worked my way up in the same company. The medieval history itself obviously wasn't useful but the ability to write in complete sentences and read and comprehend a large body of text turned out to be an in-demand skill for working on tenders.

The only reason this path would be a lot harder to follow now (and it wasn't that long ago - I'm in my early 30s!) is the contraction of the economy as a result of the crash, then austerity, and now the massive slowdown being caused by Brexit uncertainty. A humanities degree from a good university teaches you how to read, write and think critically in a way that just waiting tables and reading a few books can't.

You're absolutely right OP. I searched for a job for about 6 months before I found one that paid well in line with the job role. I can't tell you how many I saw that advertised £18k but wanted someone with admin, marketing, sales and finance experience.

The overqualified/overexperienced thing can be true though. I took a job last year, in hindsight I never should have done but I was desperate to leave a job I was unhappy in with a toxic culture. I was overexperienced and it turned out to be completely the wrong level for me, I was frustrated as expected to work a level below what I was used to (despite job title being the same) and my boss felt threatened by me. It all went to shit after a couple of months and I walked.