To think airline software should not allow a 3 year old to be seated away from their parent?

[Inkstainedmags]

I suppose I'm looking for reassurance as I lie here unable to sleep before a flight. DP, DS (3) and I are due to take a transatlantic flight in the morning. We were unable to select seats when we booked the flight - we suspect because the grounding of Boeing 737 Max aircrafts meant the airline didn't know what craft they would be putting us on. Then, when check-in opened, the airline's website wouldn't allow us to proceed because it couldn't cope with dual citizenship and insisted we needed proof of visas for travel to the country we live in.

When we finally managed to try to check in at an airport kiosk, we found that all three of us are seated separately and there was nowhere for two of us to be sat together. No one from the airline was available to speak to.

Surely the airline has to sort this out, right? As much as I'd love the opportunity to spend a 7-hour flight watching movies and reading books like I used to pre-DS, they can't expect a barely 3-year-old to be sat next to a stranger can they?

AIBU to think that with all the amazing things software can do these days, an airline should be able to force a parent and toddler to be sat together and cope with travellers with dual citizenship?

We have 3 DC and have had good flights and bad. BA once swapped our chosen seats, put DH and I in the emergency exit row, leaving our DC behind us (next row). My only concern was that if anything happened it was putting a lot on DS (about 9 at the time) to help his sisters.

A man sat in our row volunteered to move so DC could move to us other than for take off an£ landing, DD2 was happy where she was.

When this happened to us, I refused to sit in any seat until I was sat with my child.

The people next to him didn't want to move, so I threw the problem at the cabin director, pointing out that the passenger record had DS as both a minor and associated with my record, so they knew before our boarding cards were issued.. I wasn't having my 6 year old sat between perfect strangers, therefore none of us were sitting anywhere.

By this time the doors are closed and they are about to taxi, and we are standing in the aisle.
It's amazing how quickly he found us seats together.

I think it's ridiculous that they have co-dependancy information, but they choose not to use it in seat allocation.

It is quite noticeable that none of the parents who are adament that you must move as their child can't manage/be managed without them are saying theyd offer to refund someone's seat booking price. And the airlines certainly don't.

I once travelled with a friend, her 10 months old baby, and my 2.10 DD.

As with OP, we weren't able to check in online, and no-one was able to help on the phone. When we eventually checked in, we were placed in three entirely separate seats, and with friend's baby allocated to my lap for some weird reason.

But the humans at check-in were able to sort it for us, so that I got to sit with DD and baby went to friend's lap.

The same problem arose for the return flight though. And this time they weren't able to sort it at check-in. They said to just check with other passengers to see if anyone would be willing to swap. And of course people were! We didn't all get to sit together, but each child with their parent at least.

Oh and just to say, the people who swapped with us didn't lose their aisle seat. They just moved from one aisle seat to another one, in the same general part of the aircraft (close to toilets, as it happens). I do understand that some people have genuine reasons for needing an aisle seat, just like there are genuine reasons for seating young children with 'their' adult. Solving one problem doesn't have to mean causing the other! So people asked to move seats should not reject on principle, but check if it would be possible for them first.

There was one time when I was asked to move seats and I considered refusing for a moment. The reason given was that the guy on the middle seat 'couldn't' be sat next to a woman, for religious reasons (me being 'unclean' or something). I felt insulted. But I realised it is the whole religion that is insulting to all women, not this individual guy insulting me personally; and I didn't want to spend the flight sat next to someone cringeing away from me.

I am amazed that this can happen. I presume it can only happen if you check in after others have checked in, on a fullish plane - so you have rows of 3 seats, and there are lots of 2s seated, leaving odd seats scattered around.

@brilliotic
although you missed the chance to educate him!

It is quite noticeable that none of the parents who are adament that you must move as their child can't manage/be managed without them are saying theyd offer to refund someone's seat booking price. And the airlines certainly don't

To be fair, nobody has asked that, have they? It's not something you immediately think of. I would assume the most likely people to offer to swap would be lone travellers who haven't actually paid (when I travel alone I never pay because I couldn't care less where I sit, so I'd swap with anyone no problem).

Thankfully (or maybe naively) I think most people in real life are kind and helpful to others and these situations are rarely as black and white or as short-tempered as they always are on mumsnet. If it was separated from my toddler I would be looking for a way to swap. If a passenger pointed out that they had paid and would lose that money, I'd happily offer to pay them for the seat and then chase up that money through a complaint to the airline later. It's clearly no other passenger's fault if the airline is separating parents from 3 year olds.

Call WestJet customer service. They will sort it out before you get to the airport. There are almost always seats that the airline hold so that they can use them to resolve situations like this, but they will be released for general check in at some point.

What I'm saying is, I think in real life, most people have more tact and a better ability to see a situation from all sides than appears to be the case on mumsnet. So these situations are usually quite calmly and easily resolved.

Someone who feels so strongly as to actually ask a woman sitting down next to him to please move elsewhere, would probably not have listened to me one bit! Lost cause.

The separating child and parent thing happened to me only when we weren't able to check in online. It wasn't on a 'pay for choosing your seat' type of flight though, you can choose your seat at check-in (first come first serve) but nobody paid for it. And we tried to check in early, precisely to ensure seats together, but couldn't.

Apart from take off and landing, I expect the parent to get off their own seat and take care of their child
How, if that child is in your middle seat with you in the aisle as per your booking? Spend the flight leaning over you?

So the people who wouldn't move, would basically ignore the child, would be happy at the toddler's parent leaning over you to deal with the toddler every time they wanted some comfort or needed help?

A complication in my case (let's make this thread all about MEEEEEE ) is that my disability causes hemialgia, so swapping from an aisle seat where the aisle is on my left to one where it's on my right would be of no benefit to me, as it's only one side that I need to protect from being jabbed / squashed / be able to stretch that particular leg out at intervals. So being offered a seat on the other side of the aisle would be no good for me. (This is one of the reasons why I never fly! )

In the situation where I ended up next to a toddler because no one else could or would swap, I would however do my best to entertain him or her and keep an eye on their safety - I wouldn't just try to ignore them!

drspouse

if I am separated from my 3 year old, I would probably end up sitting in the isle but I wouldn't leave them alone for an entire flight!
You don't need to lean over, but you keep an eye on them, that's what any normal parent would do.

There was one time when I was asked to move seats and I considered refusing for a moment. The reason given was that the guy on the middle seat 'couldn't' be sat next to a woman, for religious reasons (me being 'unclean' or something). I felt insulted. But I realised it is the whole religion that is insulting to all women, not this individual guy insulting me personally; and I didn't want to spend the flight sat next to someone cringeing away from me.

In this situation, I would politely suggest that he should be moved, not I

I would absolutely move for you in a heartbeat - I travelled alone with my 3 children in a 3-3 plane set up my daughter was on the other side of the aisle sat next to a lovely couple who shared their colouring books with her and the lady even held my daughters hand for take off and landing - I was so grateful for the kindness they showed and would pay it forward if I ever had the opportunity! Hope this has all been sorted and you have a safe flight.

In addition if there was no way I could swap due to my own children’s needs but the lone child was placed next to us I would absolutely make sure they were ok during the flight and I’m shocked to read that other mothers wouldn’t naturally do the same

Flying with DD when she was younger was a nightmare to the extent that I vowed never to fly again. She has some issues that manifest in her struggling to 'do as told' - we had all sorts of tricks that help get her do what is necessary, but 'telling' her had the opposite effect of making it nearly impossible for her to actually do it. So getting her to do all the things required for a safe flight, especially at take-off and landing, required very careful planning. Would have loved to see a random stranger attempting to get her to remain seated, keep the table up, keep the window blind up, and keep the seatbelt on! (Actually, no, it would have been a distressing experience for all involved, and would probably have resulted in us being removed from the aircraft.)

Lots of people have all sorts of needs. Some people here are dismissing any needs other than their own. Usually a solution can be found that allows everyone to fly!

Talking about those airlines where you don't 'pay to choose', I agree with OP that really there should be algorithms ensuring that young children are seated with their adult. Just as people with a disability, visible or not, should be able to be accommodated.
When you fly with a 'pay to choose' airline, and have a need for a specific seat/seating arrangement, then you just have to pay. It becomes part of the cost of travelling. A bit unfair but life is unfair to those who have more/other needs than the average person.

DH and I in the emergency exit row, leaving our DC behind us (next row). My only concern was that if anything happened it was putting a lot on DS (about 9 at the time) to help his sisters.

Why didn't you offer your more spacious emergency rows to people in your children's row?

That would have been a nice offer.

"Keep an eye on" a 3 year old for a 7 hour flight ha ha ha ha ha ha ha.
I am minded of the time I flew long haul with DS aged 2 1/2.
I was thankfully next to him.
Apart from the bit he slept I was constantly doing things for and with him for the whole flight.
You can't play with a child who's not next to you.
He also got very over tired and was crying hysterically before his nap. He slept after I cuddled him for 20 minutes or so.
Thank goodness for the lovely flight attendant who said in a loud voice designed to carry to my neighbours GOSH HE'S TIRED POOR THING.
As for those who think telling a toddler off will do anything at all... Again, ha ha ha ha ha.

The biggest issue is that when it all goes wrong (Missed connection, cancelled flight, weather) everyone assumes the parent was tight - even when they weren't. The replacement flight is probably busier too!

Other issue will be unplanned last minute travel where thanks to seat bookings there are no suitable sets of seats available to book. Usually family emergency rather than pleasure ...

Airline systems have access to the necessary data to spot these problems before people get on the plane - change seats automatically at the gate or whatever given lack of need to check in...

completely agree with you randomsabreuse

When you fly with a 'pay to choose' airline, and have a need for a specific seat/seating arrangement, then you just have to pay. It becomes part of the cost of travelling.

It might be worth adding the cost on as a compulsory extra for those with under-12s. It could be added for one adult per two children in the party (so if one parent sits with them and the other sits somewhere else, that could work, but if you are travelling with 4 children both parents need to sit near them).

And for the airlines where you don't pay to choose, the system around what "sitting near" means should be tightened up. BA might think that my 4 year old sitting behind me is close enough. The person next to her who is trying to tell her (as brilliotic says) to keep her seat belt buckled up would disagree.

These threads always make me laugh.

It’s amusing how the children separated from parents are always, coincidentally, the worst-behaved who can’t possibly sit alone

I can't believe anyone thinks a 3 year old can sit alone for 7 hours.
So clearly you have never met any 3 year olds.

I can't believe anyone thinks a 3 year old can sit alone for 7 hours.
So clearly you have never met any 3 year olds

Indeed. My own sprang fully formed as a 7 year old from a nearby gooseberry bush

I never said the kid might struggle. I said I wouldn’t struggle sitting next to them. I’m a rugby coach, I’ve been on tours abroad. Believe me a recalcitrant toddler is plain sailing