Coffee shops

[Kingoftheroad]

What do you expect from a good quality coffee shop?

I was having a discussion with a friend who owns a small chain of independent coffee shops. I mentioned that I’m not keen on having people queue up behind me for take away food whilst I’m enjoying either a peaceful few minutes to myself or chatting with a friend etc.

What, in your opinion makes for the ideal coffee shop?

1. Most of all, super clean including toilets.
2. Table service
3. Good selection of cakes, sandwiches and hot food
4. Variation of hot chocolate flavours
5. Not too loud music/everything spaced out so not on top of each other
6. Quiet areas
7. Special offers/loyalty card scheme

Have to concur with previous posters about cost here. People love the idea of pretty homemade cakes, baristas who are carefully trained in the difference between Guatemalan and Colombian roasts and a million and one different staff members on shift at once to froth your milk AND wipe your arse for you at the same time, but unfortunately will sneer when these changes = they have to cough up more! This is why, unfortunately, cafes have a bit of a reputation as a license to burn money. I've long said we should have a national service but for hospitality work where everyone has to spend 6-12 months working in a pub, club, cafe or restaurant before they get to complain about how it simply won't do that they have to share their space with... other customers!

Great coffee
Free newspapers to read in cafe
Space to relax
Free wi-fi

Kingoftheroad Yes, that would be annoying.

It's the establishments responsibility to ensure that there is an effective layout (including queue management) in place.
That company direction (where to queue, speed of service, when to pay, where the cutlery is etc) is simple and easy to follow for customers.
That staff guide customers effectively.
That the system does not disrupt the experience of any of the customers- including once seated.

The ability to make a proper cappuccino! Some places just seem to serve a milky coffee! I think some of them are trained by the machine manufacturers (who clearly don't know either) so think they're doing it 'right'. Rant over!

The reason I use the large chains is because the calories are either clearly displayed or failing that, easily found.

Itsnotmesothere I did have a bad baby, she screamed night and day for a very long time and in the end it made me very ill. I didn't go to coffee shops, or anywhere else very often. She grew into a happy and laid back child who I do take to coffee shops and restaurants knowing that she'll sit happily with a babyccino and a piece of cake.

There's obviously a market for family friendly cafes, but one where there's likely to be screaming babies is not one where I want to spend much time. I've served my time listening to screaming. The OP's question was what makes the ideal coffee shop - one where there are probably no screaming babies is my ideal.

Filter coffee rather than just machine coffee and don't try and dictate how the customer should have it. I like white coffee, not black but one cafe refused to give me milk with my filter coffee because "it tastes better black". They offered me an americano with milk instead, but I don't really like machine coffee so had a tea instead for about half the price.

one cafe refused to give me milk with my filter coffee because "it tastes better black".

WTF? I would have told them where they could stick their coffee.

I do like a filter coffee, wish all cafes had this option (do they not? I don’t know much about coffee).

Me and dh like going out for coffee, but we're struggling to find somewhere now as our local places have gone downhill.

The best one is a Viennese coffee shop and what we like about it is:

They sell a few different styles of coffee and know how to make it.

The coffee is always fresh.

They do a small selection of nice cakes and tartes, not too sweet. These are fresh every day.

The decor is simple, but cosy and spotlessly clean.

There are a few fresh flowers around.

They play classical music, softly, in the background.

The characteristics of poor coffee shops are as follows:

They stint on the quality of the coffee. It's not fresh and they try to keep batches going too long. This makes it stale and nasty tasting.

They don't do fresh baking every day. Instead, they have a big selection of half eaten, tired and stale cakes and pastries which only look fit for the bin. The worst are covered with clingfilm and look sweaty. If you're charging £2.75 for a piece of cake, at least make sure it's as fresh as a daisy.

They bulk buy crap coffee. Poor quality coffee isn't worth drinking.

Tables are messy and unrelated. There are crumbs around.

Tableware is scratched and past its best. Cutlery isn't clean.

Plastic flowers and childish ornaments, the type you see in garden centres.

Crap pop music playing in the background on some old, greasy portable radio. Crap fm might be what the workers like to listen to, but it's not relaxing or very nice for customers. It's sloppy and a bit greasy spoon.

Unappetising cakes etc. If I want to eat an industrial strength granola bar thingy, I'll find one in the bottom of my hiking rucksack thanks. Nice treats are what you want when you go out.

I'm not going to add anything to the above, except to mention helpful hard working and reliable staff. Which will become more difficult if we have a bad or no-deal Brexit, as many are staffed by EU nationals.

So if you want to see good coffee shops stay, vote tomorrow for a party supporting a second EU referendum. Not the most important reason, but one to add to the list.

Think Valerie Patisserie; the Brits don't know 2 pig shits about proper cakes. Christ no! Patisserie Valerie is over priced, tasteless mush. Very pretty to look at but who wants ornamental cake?

Home made cakes (that are covered while on display), clean tables with no dropped food underneath them, a selection of tables with either two seats or four. I’m really not keen on sofas and coffee tables. A really decent hot chocolate would be nice. No screaming children. I prefer table service. And I’d happily pay more for that.

Ianbro’s sounds lovely!

Space between tables so your conversations are private
Friendly staff
Home baked cakes rather than the mass produced/dry/artificial tasting often on offer in chain coffee shops
Enough high chairs
Regularly cleaned tables

A good coffee. One that is actually hot, no stale espresso shots, no shit ty re-heated milk.
Baristas' that will put effort into the drink. Not a rushed 'cant be arsed ' mess with liquid sloshed over the side of the cup. I 'd gladly wait 20minutes for a good cup than as k to have it remade.
Cleanliness shouldn't need mentioning.
I don't even care about food; tbh I'd rather frequent a place that on ly sells one type of amazing coffee and that's it, rather than a tonne of mediocre coffee and average cakes.
I honestly think the main thing for me is the staff 's attitude. Countless times I've been in shops where there is a snobbery as such you can feel it upon entering. 'You don't belong here, Mcds is over there', or the patronising ones that eye-roll when a customer asks to explain a drink.

Used to be a regional manager for a global coffee chain, and some of the stuff that goes on there is incredible.

Not RTFT so apologies if repeating but;

As I’m not a coffee drinker then decent tea, DO NOT put the milk in for me especially when the bag isn’t still in the cup. Ideally though have tea leaves (appreciate not possible with take away). Have a selection of milks, I never, ever have skimmed so at least offer me semi skimmed, if not whole (Leon is very good for this). Do not give me hot milk (some branches of certain chains do this).

Have a nice selection of freshly cooked food and cakes, not reheated bacon barms, scrambled egg etc. Again, Leon very good in this aspect.

bag IS still in the cup

I do beg to disagree about Brits and their cakes : we know our shit.

Pâtisserie is a different ball game.

Nice food/baking (although if the latter isn't great, it means that I won't eat something, so its probably better if it's shit. For me anyway)
A nice coffee, not too strong if you ask for a latte, not just milk and water and no burnt tasting coffee (looking at you Costa, which I used to like but now even the thought makes me a bit queezy)
I want a table to myself, not one thats so close to another table that I may as well sit with the strangers.
No stupid shaped mugs/cups like the soup bowls you get in some places, and I'm not keen in glasses. Mugs with a decent handle that I can fit my fingers through. Why oh why do they have different style cups for different coffees. Make them bigger or smaller, but just a standard mug will be absolutely fine thanks. Also do away with saucers, they are pointless and just a bloody spilling hazard.

There are two things I require from a good coffee shop:

1. Iced Americano (just an espresso +ice and cold water) that costs the same as an espresso and isn't £4.

1. Irish coffees. At any time of day. These can cost £4.

These will make me come back every goddamn day - you'll know if it's a good day or bad from my order.

Oh and get a talented young woman (give them a foot in the door) who can make pretty avocado on toast with radishes or sliced grapefruit with lime juice and sugar etc.

Not the same boring crap.

Clean highchairs and plenty of them.

Properly clean tables. I hate seeing staff do a lazy wipe with a grubby-looking cloth.

Tea at a sensible price. It's a teabag, water and milk and you want to charge me the same price as a proper coffee?!

Homemade cakes.

Staff who greet you and catch your eye as you come in and help you find a table, so there's none of the awkward peering at tables if they're busy.

I have a few fave independent coffee shops and what makes them great for me is as follows:

• Friendly staff who are willing to have a chat with you
• Baked goods and sandwiches made on the premises (no pre-packed)
• Believes strongly in sustainability
• Clean
• Free papers
• Comfortable chairs to relax on

I have one coffee shop in mind in Birmingham which ticked all of the above. I’d go there with my then boyfriend on the weekend, hungover and we’d read the Sunday papers, devour a lovely breakfast and stay there for a few hours chilling and chatting to complete strangers.

I really did love it there.

@lanbro you had me until you got to the toddler group part. There's a coffee shop near me which is just like you describe but I can't go any more since they got too child friendly and I want to go and get quiet time! I really hope the baby showers are when the cafe is closed to other customers.

I don't go out for coffee much, but when I do I want quiet, childfree time. I want sofas, either a huge lattee or whatever seasonal offering there is with loads of flavoured syrups. I would like a decent sandwich on nice bread and a nice cake or home made biscuit. The lovely cafe I now avoid did amazing iced teas with fresh fruit, I would love to see them more. I don't like loud background music. I fully understand since I spend so little money in coffee shops they will make almost no money from me so will ignore my wants.

Have all chains started using sugar free syrups? I had one which was obviously full of sweeteners which I hate.

I think a clear idea of the ideal customer base is important. I love a child-friendly one with a play area but that’s many people’s idea of hell!

I agree with the 'know your customer base' part of this ^
(I'm the opposite, and would actively avoid a "child-friendly" one).
There is a concept that makes me shudder, which is a 'cat cafe' opened near here. Horrific - but I guess there are some people who will go ?!?
Sometimes, I don't mind paying the extra for a bit of peace and quiet and something fancy when I want to treat myself, but sometimes I just need to hang out for an hour or 40mins whilst waiting for someone, and would prefer something much cheaper simpler. There is no single 'right' thing, but I don't think it works trying to mix up your customer base.

I like to see tables cleared promptly, after customers have left. Nothing worse than just seeing loads of tables covered with dirty cups and crumpled napkins. And even worse when there's nowhere else to sit because all the tables have still got crud on them!