AIBU for wondering why the government assumes 12 year olds don’t need childcare?

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Hi folks,
Looking at Tax Free Childcare and I see it stops when a child turns 12.
www.gov.uk/tax-free-childcare
Can I ask what the heck working parents with 12 year olds are expected to do in the summer and why there is so little provision for that tricky bit where they’re pretty independent but you really don’t want them sitting around the house all day on their own?
DS is 12 and it looks like summer care will cost me £125 a week. Normally I’d apply accrued childcare vouchers, but the summer camps are not registered for childcare vouchers. The ones that are registered won’t take him because he’s 12.

To the op, if you register interest in PGL and Kingswood camps, they start sending you offers, up to 1/2 price in the last few weeks before the holiday.

I've just googled. The OP would have to factor in flights, and presumably take time off work to take her child there and collect them again. Surely that's not a practical solution?

I have what I would consider to be a very flexible employer. But I still have to take part of my annual leave as a two week break, those are the rules. That leaves three weeks for the rest of the year. And there is no way I'd be allowed to take that all in half days.

It's not about babying 12 year olds. It's about knowing that 13 weeks school holidays doesn't work with 4-5 weeks annual work leave, and that leaving 12 year olds to their own devices, and if they are only children, completely alone, for 6-7 weeks.

I remember being on my own after school sometimes, and in the holidays (although I used to go to my Grandparents a lot).That was in the 70s though!so quite different from now.You are right that this is a crossover period as such .In a year or two no real issues.Can you possibly break up the leave a bit maybe a few days here and there or a long weekend ,does he have chums he could go to in the week, while you have them at the weekends perhaps?.

I overpay on my childcare vouchers and have done since day one - the amount is available until the child turns 15 - I am hoping that by overpaying when she is 12 she will only need to go to a club a few days a week in summer holidays and I will hopefully have a cushion to work through so it won't seem too much of a shock.

FWIW though I think leaving a 12 year old for 5 days a week, 10 hours a day is too much but I remember we all used to meet up places and go out together or go to each others houses so we were rarely 'alone' for any length of time really - just make sure the fridge is well stocked for the holidays!

I remember counting down to my twelfth birthday because my mum had told me that I'd be able to babysit her friend's children - three boys: 2, 4 and 7 - and be paid £10. By 13, I was babysitting every Friday and Saturday 7pm till late, for 4 families, sometimes for two sets of children at once.

This is why 'childcare' isn't offered for 12 year olds. For decades, in the absence of relevant special needs (worth noting here: I'm autistic and was the most capable carer in my friendship group), children this age have been considered unrequiring of physical adult supervision. There isn't any basis to think this has changed.

I can understand that you don't want to leave your son for long periods throughout the week. However, I think that's more to do with quality of life than a need for supervision for its own sake.

There are loads of parents where I live (rurally) who are present, but completely skint and unable to do much/go anywhere with their kids during the holidays. Therefore, there's an argument for more, and more accessible, provision for all kids.

I'd personally make this argument at the same time as avoiding references to childcare/supervision etc. It's a small difference, but it helps people focus on the real issue. He's not going to melt like a snowflake because he's on his own, but he'd have a much better time if there was something sociable and enriching for him to do that you could access and afford.

This provision should be within the government's remit, especially considering the rise in mental health difficulties within the adolescent population. It would be prudent for them to ensure older kids weren't being isolated for long periods.

Otherwise, you'll just get lots of people (like me) telling you that they were "working down t'mines at his age!"

I agree OP. At 12 I wouldn't have left any of mine at home for 8/9 hours a day for many days. Luckily I didn't have to but I think childcare vouchers should go up to 14 years old and be more widely accepted.

Sorry if it's been suggested but are there any sports weeks in the area, they may have a shorter day but if your child is ok to travel by themselves they can be a useful stopgap for a few years.

i agree with you. Childcare is less of an issue for 12 year olds, but it is still an issue. It is not appropriate to leave a 12 year old alone 8-6. Not everyone has help on tap, and why should they have to make ad hoc arrangements for a 12 year old but not a 6 year old.

I found that summer camps that provided mixed activities generally took childcare vouchers. But specialist football/drama/tennis etc didn't. The drama teacher said she had tried!

Very usefully PGL take vouchers for residential trips for children without school/parent (obviously!). I accumulated far too many vouchers I couldn't use when the children were older and used some like that. Lost the rest though now I think.

We are in this exact position with an 11 (year 6) and nearly 13 (year 8). We have no family nearby and lots of their friends go to grandparents etc so we can't share that. We don't want them to be at home alone all day so it is really difficult. I think you have have to creative and think in half days. At least if they do something for half the day when they are out and about it is not too bad. The 11 year can still go to some clubs but even he is quite big in them. One of the clubs will allow the older one to go as well as a helper (i.e. he helps out but I still pay the full price for those). By helping out I mean he helps get the drinks for the little one and carries footballs in an out for different activities. He feels more grown up so it makes it more palatable for him to go but I know he won't go often. So it is really only a back-up to break up the weeks. We will send him the odd morning this summer and I have told him we will pay him £5 for being a helper at the clubs so it is costing us a lot. But at least it means he is up and dressed and in the fresh air. He went a few days at Easter and because he is very tall he wasn't allowed to pay football as he could hurt the others so instead the little ones used him for penalty shootouts which is obviously boring after a while. I also pay for him to do a morning of activity most days over Easter (paid and not taking childcare vouchers). We are lucky he plays tennis and there is a club near my work so he went there a few mornings then walked over to meet me for lunch. Then walked home/went to the shop for me/met me back at work or my DH used some flexi hours annual leave hours to take him home a bit early. It is a nighmare. It can't be good for them to spend days alone at home and even with annual leave there are only so many days we can cover because everyone else wants leave at the same time. I think it is worth the money though to know they are safe and outside.

Sorry but I think this is your problem to solve not the government's at 12.

I'm not eligible for childcare vouchers, at all for my 4 year old and or one year old (who can't he left alone where as yours can) as dh earns too much to be eligible. World's smallest violin you might say but it's pretty damn annoying that those that contribute most to the economy to subsidise everyone else's childcare then don't get it subsidised themselves, and so for people like me it actually costs me money to work.

At your kid's age I think a combination of you taking time off, sharing childcare with a friend (ie if you take their kid as well whilst you are off they can take yours for a week or two), paying for activities/holiday clubs and some time on their own.

www.barracudas.co.uk/faqs/childcare-vouchers/ These people run camps for kids up to 14 and take vouchers. You can do a full week or individual days. My kids did this one year for a full week.

OP one more idea. Look at all the local sports clubs and phone them up. They might not advertise as holiday childcare. But my local cricket club for example runs reasonably priced camps from 10 til 16 and non members can come too and learn to play. They don't really advertise though it's just on the members newsletter. This type of thing is perfect for young teens. It's not childcare but keeps them busy and happy. They probably won't take childcare vouchers but are likely to be cheaper than all day childcare and also more appropriate for an older child.

www.barracudas.co.uk/faqs/childcare-vouchers/ These people run camps for kids up to 14 and take vouchers. You can do a full week or individual days. My kids did this one year for a full week.

The voucher savings would be wiped out by the cost of flights.

My daughter was 11 when i left her at home to go to work, during the school summer holiday's i alway's took 2 weeks off work my exh took a week off, when she was alone she spent most of the morning in bed, watching tv sometimes going into town with friend's, i think it also depend's on your child's maturity, my daughter would have been horrified if i said she had to spend everyday for 3 week's with her grandparent's, never had any problem's when she in the house alone,

To be fair if you send them to holiday clubs they are too old for they'll probably spend half the time on their phones and mucking around anyway.

My 12 year old has friends who live out of town, he takes the bus or train, or they do, and they meet up for activities or get together at one of their houses. He hated the holiday club the last time he went, he was one of the oldest there at age 11 the summer before year 7. Scout camp covers one week of summer, then I take another couple, some of it split up a bit.

I was just thinking how awesome it must be to have summer camps like in America and fell into a Google rabbit hole. I had know idea those camps were so expensive . They seem so ubiquitous as well (knowledge based solely on movies) they're clearly not accessible to everyone.

It's not ubiquitous but the ones that tend to come up on google with glossy websites tend to be the higher end ones. There are more basic ones that are far cheaper, especially church camps etc of which there are a lot. Gotta say, by week 5 of the holidays I'd probably ebay a kidney to send the little darlings off to Pennsylvania for a fortnight , wearing t-shirts that say "I'm available for adoption. Call Soulrunner for details"

Since when did the government have the responsibility for childcare, How much is enough? Staggering move in welfare, it never ends. The govt should pay?

Since when did the government have the responsibility for childcare, How much is enough? Staggering move in welfare, it never ends. The govt should pay?

This. All of this.

Ah, well that makes more sense. They were coming in at about £10k for the summer. That might be more than a kidney, you might have to throw a bit of liver into the hat for good measure.

Things that spring to mind - camps really vary in times and prices, so really shop around. You may be able to find a compromise of a few days here and there which makes life a bit harder perhaps as have to remember what DC are doing each day. Camps usually cheaper as they get older as fewer adults required for supervision. Start with the council. Give them a call and see what they offer. Also, costs can depend on what's on offer. The more specialised the camp, the more it may cost. The library near us offers things like coding courses, but not for the 6 weeks, it''ll be a week or something, but usually free or really cheap.

Do you have any youth clubs nearby? They can sometimes provide a supervised place for kids to hang out.

The other thing is yes, we used to be left alone a lot more at that age, but many years ago. These days, my main concern with DS home alone is the internet. Think would want to have that turned off while there was no parental supervision. Not cos I think he would be purposefully looking up stuff, but I am not sure I trust youtube, etc. when he inevitably would spend all day on his laptop without adult supervision.

Years ago, reading books, kicking a ball around the garden, all a bit more of a variety than today's kids that are perhaps more likely to spend 6 hrs solid in front of a computer and forget to eat/drink/etc, or maybe that's just my kid...

People who say that they will just go and spend time with friends are naive.
Because that means that either you basically rely on someone else to look after your child OR that child is also in their own and leaving two 11~12yo in their own devices for the whole day isn’t a very good idea either....

This is exactly how my (then) 12 year old spent last summer, so not sure why I am being naive. And no relying on anyone else as all their friends' parents were out at work too.
Basically it was a fairly simple extension of what happened from age about 8/9 when they went to "play out" with friends, for longer and longer timeframes until they only came home for meal times. By 12, my DC would simply WhatsApp a few friends and find someone/some people who could meet up. Plus they don't get up till late morning so that's half the day gone anyway.

If your child has never had any freedom till age 12 and always relied on parents to organise entertainment for them, I can see it is a bigger jump. But children just don't suddenly arrive at being12 year olds - this should be a process in building up their independence gradually.

Frankly I'm more worried about my DS being left to his own devices now he's 15 than I have been at any other earlier age. My 12 year old who spent the day in the park/playing board games - not so much.

We get £50 of childcare vouchers a month and use them for a week at PGL during the summer holidays. It's expensive but it helps to break up the summer holidays a bit and along with our two weeks holiday and some juggling of favours, our daughter is kept occupied.

Issabellrogino there are private schools in NI