...to think needing a degree to progress is an outdated way of thinking?

[Iflippinghateplaydoh]

I (clearly) don't have a degree, I left 6th form and went to a business college and then spent 6 years working as a manager in my 20s.
I moved companies and went to a non-management role but a lot more money.
Now in early 30s and my children are at school I'd love to progress back into a manager role at this company that I've been at for 5 years (of which there are many manager roles here) however as I don't have a degree it's impossible.
Open uni will take me years

Although there's nothing I can do to change it, AIBU to feel like experience should be taken into account sometimes rather than saying "without a degree you can't go anywhere".

I love the company and am so frustrated as I'm more than capable and have been told so on many occasions, but if they accept 1 in without a degree it opens up a whole new can of worms so they won't budge.

Is this standard across most industries?

Or AIBU to think it's a bit of an old fashioned way of thinking?

I think it's difficult to say due to the utterly huge number of candidates with degrees now - I think those under 30 wouldn't have even got the experience without a degree so it's just kind of assumed.

Even the apprentices at my office have degrees at undergrad or higher.

Have you looked at Foundation degrees? These are vocational and can tie-in with your job. There's more than one type of degree out there, I'd do some research if you are that determined. Don't assume it's 6 years with the OU or nothing, there are other options. DH did an access course then a foundation degree, and DB did a vocational masters later in life (he dropped out of his undergraduate course). I am the only one in my family who completed a BA Hons degree, but I have learned its not the only path.

Find a rival company that doesn’t have a stick up its collective arse.

What can of worms do they think they would open up? The danger of having to choose from a wider pool of talented, hard-working people who have proven themselves capable in the workplace over the course of several years? What an awful prospect.

Given the total idiocy of companies I have had to deal with this week alone.
I would say if these people I have been speaking to or the people who made up the company rules have degrees then they should sack all of them and hire people who know what they are talking about.

This belief that you aren’t able to string 2 words together or hold down anything more than a nmw job without a degree is meaning that people who have basic common sense are being overlooked

Depends on the industry. DH went into the merchant navy on oil tankers, then into oil cargo inspection, then refining. Now living in Canada, earning 5 times what he did in the U.K. No degree and severely dyslexic. Just a shit ton of relevant experience and great skills. He’s understood and appreciated by his staff as he started at the bottom, did night shifts etc.

I was in a similar position a few years ago. I spoke to my local university who reviewed my work experience and suggested I skipped a degree and did a Masters instead. It was a lot quicker (2.5years) and a lot cheaper than doing a degree. No-one cares about your lack of degree if you have a Masters and it puts you above candidates who don’t have a Masters.

Pretty much everyone has a degree these days, but there is a huge difference in the level of degree and the field of work you’re in.
Of course experience is very valuable but imagine if you are filling a vacancy
You’ve got 100 applicants
Before even looking at them you will check them out on paper
Sadly, despite your experience and expertise in your area, if you look ‘weak’ on paper you won’t make it to shortlist

I happen to have a degree (no use in any job I've had) and I completely agree with you. Obviously, there are certain professions where it is essential (law, surgery etc), but it's very frequently used as a shorthand by lazy employers who think that it automatically makes you a better person - especially the ones who state that it doesn't matter what your degree is as the belief that you once spent three years at university must automatically make you a better worker in every way than somebody who did an apprenticeship and has since gained 30 years of solid on-the-job experience in that very field; or even a very young adult starting out, who nevertheless has a logical and intelligent brain, excellent work ethic and obvious huge natural ability.

A relative of mine was a nurse for 40 years and, towards the end of her career, was badgered and badgered and told that she MUST study for a degree to ensure and prove that she was capable of what she'd been doing very well for more years than the management people doing the insisting had been alive. She'd risen up to a very senior level solely through her proven skill, ability and experience. Thankfully, she managed to keep kicking it into the long grass until she retired, but it left a bit of a bitter taste.

It isn't just degrees either - for example, I've had access to and been very confident with IT for 25 years, so I've never felt the need to go on one of these European Computer Driving Licence courses. Plenty of people haven't had the same opportunities, natural affinity, interest or time to devote to it (or even simply been born and grown up in the 'right' generation for it), so many of them do go in for the ECDL, which is doubtless excellent for their needs. Nevertheless, if somebody who'd just passed this and I both went for a job requiring good basic IT skills, many box-ticking employers would automatically consider them more accomplished than me.

Yes, there are basic skills and qualifications that are essential for some positions, but beyond that, the very best employers, who wouldn't dream of discriminating on the grounds of race or sex, will also not discriminate arbitrarily, based on possession of paper qualifications, and will actually consider the PERSON for the job.

Of course experience is very valuable but imagine if you are filling a vacancy
You’ve got 100 applicants
Before even looking at them you will check them out on paper
Sadly, despite your experience and expertise in your area, if you look ‘weak’ on paper you won’t make it to shortlist

Sadly, I think you're right, but I think it's a very foolish criterion to depend on where the qualification isn't strictly necessary. It's the same kind of thinking that has held (and does hold) women back in so many areas - it's just irrationally assumed that a (white) man will be better at it and more committed (largely because they've historically pushed or been pushed forward and/or gone to the 'right' schools and therefore already occupy most of the senior positions), so it becomes a self-fulfilling myth and the huge valuable contributions of vast sectors of society are lost at the first post.

If you just want to be able to tick the box and don't care too much about the prestige (or ethics) of the thing, there are some (kosher) Higher Ed institutions who run (strange but genuine) "APEL" degree schemes.

They basically go through a process of assessing your previous "experiential learning" from work, and use it to award you a tonne of academic credit towards a degree.

Depends on the degree. If you want to do medicine or law for example you need a degree. Many other subjects are useless. I need to finish my current degree if i want to be a sonographer.

Yanbu. I don't think it's old fashioned though - qualified by experience used to be more of an ok thing than it seems now.

I have a degree and I agree with you.

It depends on the degree. If your 18 and want to get into management you are not going to learn everything you need quickly by shadowing are you so therefore study is vital. If you’re 45 you probably have a wealth of experience ( possibly not all evidence based) so a degree is less useful (perhaps). Having a degree indicates other things thought too- perseverance, concentration, sustained work over time, ability to think critically, ability to work under pressure. Its not just about the subject per se.

A degree is so common now that it is a marker for a level of effort that is put in.

I see a lot of degree bashing on MN saying that a lot of degrees are useless. That might be the case for some content. However there are a lot of skills that you gain that aren't content related that are transferable and are a marker for quality.

Decor puts it much better than I have in my sleep deprived state :)

I strongly dislike the 'must have a degree' mindset for jobs that don't actually need them. Quite a few jobs I have seen when job hunting recently demanded a degree which was really frustrating. I had all the experience asked for in the role except a degree but apparently a degree was 'essential' and one even said the successful candidate must have a degree as they wanted someone 'like themselves who had been to a red brick'.

It depends hugely on the job. It's not a one size fits all. But I agree that, sometimes, people ask for a degree when it isn't necessary. It's usually used as a way to reduce the number of applicants or as a reassurance to the interviewer that someone is able to deal with certain tasks (writing in correct English, reporting etc)

Doesn’t matter what you think, in this case it is what a potential employer thinks that counts..

You are right. It is old-fashioned and also risks claims of age discrimination as older candidates are less likely to have degrees. It’s also poor business decision-making as it eliminates potentially brilliant candidates.

When I have clients who want to put “degree” in as an essential criterion, I ask them what they need the degree to be in. If it doesn’t matter, then they probably don’t genuinely need the person to have a degree at all, therefore it shouldn’t be an essential criterion.

If there is essential knowledge the person needs to do the job which can only have been gained via a degree course in a subject, fair enough.

I also didn't do an undergrad and have significant experience but to make my next move to director level I felt my lack of education will hold me back, so like @Onlysocks I went straight on to do an MSc part-time. I have thoroughly enjoyed it too.

This is definitely not my experience in my industry which is higher education (ironically!)
Management roles here are based on having a degree or relevant experience -one or the other!
I've been a manager for four years without a degree

I work at a university and when they recruit even they put in the advert that job experience can count if it specifies a degree needed. I don't have a degree, I do have a shit ton of experience. I got the job! If a university can see this, I don't know why an employer can't. Yes I could now do a degree at a very very reduced rate if I wanted to, no one has pushed this on me, and quite frankly I don't need to as I'm doing the job.

I agree. For jobs that don’t require a professional qualification there is no reason why years of experience should be viewed as less relevant than a degree.