To be irritated by religious views...

[Frume]

I know I'll get flamed here. Of course it goes without saying that you are entitled to believe whatever you believe. And I understand that sometimes people turn to 'God' because that's their last hope. But..

My example that prompted me to write this...

I was on Instagram and catching up with a poor girl that I follow. She is 19 and has battled cancer 3 times. The page is updated by her mum and she says things like:-

'In Him we trust to heal his child'

'This is all part of His plan'

'He knows what he is doing'

Something good happens & then it's, 'God is good' or 'Thank you to Our Father in Heaven for making our prayers come true and healing his child'

Ok. Sure, that was it.. or probably science

The general 'Thoughts and prayers' when there is any kind of disaster. Because obviously that's all that's needed in a time of crisis.

“There's HUGE differences between denominations.”

Of course there is. However, all denominations believe that there is a omniscient, omnipotent power that, to a greater or lesser extent has power and control over the universe as a whole and our lives in particular and has the choice to intervene or not in the working of the universe and our lives.

@Tavannach I'm an atheist. Can you explain how my life is lacking in 'structure and meaning'? I'll be honest, I hadn't really noticed....

'Imaginary friend' is an accurate term and has the advantage of making it clear that you are not distinguishing between the different myth systems but regard them all in the same light. They do all have the same roots, anyway - predominantly, the desire of men to have a magic justification for their ownership of women's bodies and the means of reproduction, and for those who invented the myth system to get special treatment and control everyone else.

The wars over religion thing always gets trotted out. Human beings have been horrific towards each other since we first appeared on here. Here are just a few of many atrocities that had nothing to do with religion. In the Communist cases, religion was actually banned!

economictimes.indiatimes.com/slideshows/people/10-most-ruthless-leaders-of-all-time/queen-mary-i-aka-bloody-mary/slideshow/52120231.cms

Vladimir Lenin
Reign: 1917-1924

In 1917, Lenin led the October Revolution to overturn the provisional government that had overthrown the czar. “During this period of revolution, war and famine, Lenin demonstrated a chilling disregard for the sufferings of his fellow countrymen and mercilessly crushed any opposition,” the BBC reported.

Joseph Stalin
Reign: 1922-1953

Stalin forced quick industrialisation and collectivisation in the 1930s that coincided with mass starvation, the imprisonment of millions of people in labour camps, and the ‘Great Purge’ of the intelligentsia, the government and the armed forces.

Adolf Hitler
Reign: 1933-1945

By the end of 1941, Hitler’s German Third Reich empire (and Axis) included almost every country in Europe plus a large part of North Africa. He devised a plan to create his ideal ‘master race’ by eliminating Jews, Slavs, gypsies, homosexuals and political opponents by forcefully sending them to concentration camps, where they were tortured to death. According to reports, the Nazis killed about 11 million people under Hitler’s regime.

Mao Zedong
Reign: 1949-1976

Under the communist leader, industry and agriculture was put under state control in China. Any opposition was swiftly suppressed. Mao’s supporters point out that he modernised China. Others point out that his policies led to the deaths of 40 million people through starvation, forced labour and executions.

Idi Amin
Reign: 1971-1979

General Amin overthrew an elected government in Uganda via a military coup and declared himself president. He then ruthlessly ruled for eight years, during which an estimated 3,00,000 civilians were massacred. He also drove out Uganda’s Asian population (mostly Indian and Pakistani citizens), and spent large amounts on the military, both of which led to the country’s economic decline.

Augusto Pinochet
Reign: 1973-1990

Pinochet overthrew Chile’s government in 1973 with the help of a US-backed coup. Reports say numerous people ‘disappeared’ under the regime and 35,000 were tortured. Pinochet died before he could stand trial on accusations of human-rights abuses. Note: All people on the list ruled prior to 1980. No living figures were included on the list.

Pol Pot in Cambodia 1975-1979 2,000,000 Deaths
(Another Communist regime where religion was banned).

*Human beings have been horrific towards each other since we first appeared on here - on EARTH, I meant,. not MN

@echtI think judging how one person reacts to such a struggle in their life is judgmental I kind of thought I said it was. To Judge is to be judgemental.

and lacking empathy Why should they empathise? They're being kind enough by not lambasting the person.

It's not up for her/him to decide if it is ridiculous or irritating when it is not bothering her/him

Not sure what you're referring to here.

I think the religious wars thing is a bit of a red herring too. But so is pointing out atrocities committed by non religious people. They didn’t, by and large commit their atrocities in the name of atheism when many atrocities have been committed in the name of religion.

I do see your point there, Bertrand

When my beautiful daughter was on life support and science was doing everything for her, did I get down on my knees and pray, fucking right I did. In that moment it gave me a bit of comfort, even though I don't really believe in god.

Sometimes in a horrific situation you cling onto any tiny little thing that you believe in to feel like you're doing something to help.

Is that so hard to understand.

What am I saying is that it not the OP's place to lay judgement on what she thinks are ridiculous beliefs. I think empathy is important here. I don't know what religion this poor mother follows but even if it another religion to my own, I wouldn't judge her as being ridiculous. I would have empathy that on some level, that gives her comfort even if I don't agree with her beliefs. I certainly wouldn't criticise it. The Op is lambasting this woman for her religious beliefs. Maybe not to her face but she has started this thread after all.

@ReanimatedSGB

Dress it up how you like but it is still derogatory and sneering at people with religious beliefs. Imaginary friends are usually associated with children or people with mental disorders. Use the term if you wish (I can hear 'religious people are mental ill and/or naive' already) but it don't state that it is universally an 'accurate' term.

I could call atheists lots of offensive terms but I don't as I respect their right to have different beliefs and/or no beliefs.

I would say I was agnostic ,I was brought up.as a Catholic ,people can hold religious beliefs and still accept medical treatment it's not either or, it's great this family get such comfort from their faith it must be very comforting to them even if you believe it's all.Bollocks ,my friend really believes aromatherapy oils help with ,pain ,sleep have calming affects,(we both have disabled children) personally I have tried them and can find no discernible difference if I use them or not but each to their own if she believes it helps her child good luck to her .

I got breast cancer. You're damn right I prayed to God. It had nothing to do with cure or diagnosis. I prayed and felt peace. If you've not been in that position then you don't understand.
And you can fuck off with all the 'sky fairies' bit.

YANBU Religion is fucking irritating

I’m with you OP. I can’t understand how quoting what to me seem like meaningless platitudes bring comfort. So it irritates me.

I don’t say this as obviously it’s not my business and has no effect on me but I just do not understand it.

Faith is the key that turns what appears to be meaningless platitudes into words of comfort. If you don't have faith it is impossible to understand.

I was an atheist until the age of 48 when I had what I believe to be a religious experience. Other people's religion had never irritated me, though.

Yep you’ve articulated my thoughts there!

I get what you’re saying OP.

I think it’s like when someone’s says things happen for a reason at a funeral to someone who has lost said person and even though the person saying it thinks they’re being comforting they’re really not. They’re saying what they would want to hear that would make them feel better in that situation vs what said person would rather hear.

I know some of my religious family members and friends complain about people mocking their chosen religion, yet I also know in the same breath they’ll be telling non-religious people they don’t know what they’re celebrating if said people are celebrating the non-religious parts of holidays or picking and choosing what beliefs and rules they want to follow and what they don’t and get upset when non-religious people call them out on it.

I have no issue with people believing or having faith, my issue comes in when they don’t get that I don’t want any part of it or think to do good things one needs to believe/follow some type of holy book.

I keep my thoughts to myself IRL. Only my DH knows about my experience and he is still an atheist but one who has encouraged me to explore my new-found spiritual life.

No-one could have given me faith before - I don't believe it works like that anyway. So in the same way, I cannot and would never push it on anyone else.

I am never on social media outside of MN either so I really fly under the radar

Many years ago I remember speaking with a young woman who had had frankly one of the most torturous and depraved childhoods imaginable. Subsequently became hooked on drugs and alcohol as an adult and ended up in rehab which is where I came across her as a recovery specialist in those days. She had found 'faith' and upon further discussions with her; she told me that faith was all she had as there had to be a better life out there for her. I'm very much a pragmatist and atheist - yes I know the two traits aren't mutually exclusive. But the point I'm rather disastrously trying to make is that live and let live. Whatever gives someone the courage and energy to wake up tomorrow and go out in the world to try to live is fine in my book. Call whatever you like be it religion or needing to pay the bills.

'Thoughts and Prayers' fucks me right off as it's usually used as a panacea in lieu of actually helping in any tangible way.

I've no problem with personal faith (not my bag, I think it's hokum, but whatever) but I agree with you re how ridiculous it is to attribute all good things happening to the works of a God and all bad things...?

I am somewhat religious. It's a personal thing to me so I don't push it on others, not that I believe this lady is pushing it, that's just her way of coping.

I know a Muslim lady who lost her teenage son to cancer and I wrote the Islamic term for prayers (duas) in respect of their faith. It means the same as a Christian and you couldn't meet a nicer family.

Religious fanatics are just that... fanatics and if it wasn't religion they'd be into something else destructive. People forget what religion gives the majority of people who practise it - hope and understanding.

So I'm sorry but I do think you are being you are BU, particularly in these horrific circumstances, but as long as you're not voicing this to this poor lady who is going through every parent's worst nightmare I don't think it matters.

My personal view point is that I agree with you. However I do not see why you would get irritated by them saying this. As someone else said they are not imposing their beliefs on you and asking you to also believe.

Had you put a comment saying science is amazing to be able to help people like this, and you got shot down then yes I would have a problem with it. But each to their own everyone has their thought, feelings and opinions, I just hate when people try to change mine by forcing things on me.

And just to add... yes science explains lots of things but to ridicule someone for their particular beliefs is unfair. People who do not know the first thing about science believe it on others say so. It's about being a good person and not slating others for what they believe, no matter how 'ridiculous' it sounds to you. If it doesn't harm you then let it go. Insulting remarks ir views harm others so people should be more concerned with that.

It annoys me too, because religion seems so silly to me. Sure, God loves you, he just let most of your family members die before their time and your daughter was abused by her dad etc but sure , sure, we love you God, as you love us.