Home swapping is ridiculous

[Aaliyah1990]

I’m more than frustrated with the fact that you could bid for years and not get anywhere. Then you think to yourself oh maybe house swap might help? Nope not at all!!! the housing system is a big joke if you ain’t got a garden you can forget it,the demands people are asking for just makes you feel worse and all your hopes are thrown out the window. It’s almost like doing the lottery and hoping you get lucky. I don’t know if somehow these so called serious swappers are getting a power buzz out of it cause that’s what it’s seem to me. In all reality we should all stop compiling to these ridiculous set ups, you waste so many of years being unhappy then you feel as you have to beg in a way to get a property you want. I think it’s all wrong and the council should be responsible if your over crowded etc and the bidding set up is more of a joke you’ll be on there for centuries 🙄. Until the day everyone stops compiling then that’s the day you’ll be able to get what you want but everyone seems to conform to things that are unrealistic,draining and upsetting. From today I’m not doing any of the guideline rules forget it!!! It doesn’t work out and it just makes their jobs easier while we suffer nope not anymore. So on that note I’ll get back to you guys. I’ll update to see that my situation will have improved. And I’ll let you what I did to get out of the flat/cage I’m in.

I agree that lots of people have every right to council housing. Lots of people work very hard but still don't have the means to rent privately as it's very expensive. We are four (two adults and two kids) privately renting a damp two-bed and still it's a struggle.

What I do believe, however, is that if a person is able to work then they should be doing whatever they can to find employment.

I do think some people (again absolutely not all) expect to be housed in what they feel is suitable accommodation but don't necessarily feel the need to contribute financially in any way to the rent payments.

Interestingly in Italy (well, the part I am familiar with) the norm is no more than two bedrooms. Generally the kids sleep in the sitting room and don't have any "personal space" for their toys or stuff when they get older. There is no issue with mixed gender sharing. People consider bedrooms a waste of space.

Anyway, I think the social housing situation is so difficult to solve. If tenancies are not lifelong, then that removes the incentive to keep a home nice. Why invest in the garden and the upkeep if you have to move on if your circumstances change? It doesn't make sense. Otoh why can some people win the jackpot (big house and garden) and others get stuck with the high-rise flat?

Actually most of the "jackpot" houses are no longer social housing. I live near a very large 1930s-50s social housing estate - all big semi-detached with generous gardens. I would say that no more than 10% are still rented (eg council windows/porches). The unfortunate thing is that often the council tenants don't seem to care: toys strewn around, and in one case nappies hurled into front garden.

I think all council properties should be on a maintaining lease, if there is such a thing, with an annual inspection and sanctions if it is not kept up to par. There may be a right to housing, but there should be no right to abuse that housing.

What I do believe, however, is that if a person is able to work then they should be doing whatever they can to find employment

I agree with this too, but...I think there needs to be more help for people to find work they can do. Things to build their confidence etc. I know someone who has a few health issues but could manage maybe something like admin with some adaptations/concessions. But the job market is tough, why is someone going to hire her when they could easily get someone who needs no support? Over the years she's become more depressed and now has zero confidence. She'll probably never work now. I think she would be so much happier if she did. Staying at home all day on benefits isn't the "holiday" people think it is. It is lonely and depressing.

There are some schemes out there that help people but it's not always easy to find out about them. Job Centres shouldn't be about sanctions and ticking boxes. People need properly trained staff who know how to access various opportunities. How to find something that the unemployed person can do. But that's not going to happen.

What I do believe, however, is that if a person is able to work then they should be doing whatever they can to find employment.

Non sequitur there

What I do believe, however, is that if a person is able to work then they should be doing whatever they can to find employment.

You are aware that plenty of jobs don't pay enough for renting a flat, let alone putting down a deposit? And that zero hours contracts are becoming increasingly common?

I do think some people (again absolutely not all) expect to be housed in what they feel is suitable accommodation but don't necessarily feel the need to contribute financially in any way to the rent payments.

Homeless shelters are increasingly reporting that their users are in employment.

Oh, and that people in council housing don't get their accommodation for free.

There- that's made pretty well your whole post redundant, then.

Just to @corythatwas comment about zero hour contracts. Hardly any letting agents will accept a prospective tenant on a zero hour contract and if they do then they're usually charged between 3-6 months rent in advance (avg. £600pcm/3bed) then application fees (£240upwards) then a deposit (months rent + £100) and THEN guarantor fees (£100+) and once you've paid all that you can still be issued with a section 21 notice after 4 months.
So secure.. Not.

What you're complaining about is the same thing people who buy or privately rent complain about. I'd like xyz but simply can't afford it. At least the state is picking up the tab in your case

The state is not picking up the cost.

Council housing more than pays for itself in the rent received, the majority of social housing properties have been paid for many times over and over again. For example, our house was built 60 years ago at a cost of £25,000 (or thereabouts). The rent coming in meant it was entirely paid for before I was even born and all it currently costs the council is maintenance/repairs and building insurance which the rent more than covers.

It’s not the case I’d like 🙄 It’s a need!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And oh because they’ve given it I should just seatel back with my life in risk and my sons no I don’t agree with Your stupid logic. You don’t know the half!!!! I’ve only given a little bit of information about my circumstances but for a dummy like you wouldn’t really get the picture though. To iboogy

@Frequency Why is it not safe and secure?

@PatricksRum

Section 21 notices. You can get them for any reason or no reason at all. As long as the LL follows the correct procedure he can evict you without reason with a section 21 notice. It doesn't matter if you're the best tenant in the world, scrupulously tidy, as quiet as a church mouse and pay your rent three days early every month. If the LL decides they want to sell their 'investment' aka your home all the need to do is serve a section 21 notice and you're out.

Private LL are unvetted. They could be literally anyone. I have rented from gangsters in the past. My former LL is currently serving time for weapons offenses. He was actually the best LL I have ever had, Repairs were done quickly. Inspections were none existent and he didn't keep a key to my house but I knew him. He was a friend of my father. He is in prison for threatening a tenant with a knife over unpaid rent. He still owns his properties. They're now managed by a lettings agency.

Which brings me to my next point. Lettings agents charge unreasonable and often illegal fees, they tend to, ime, over step your personal boundaries and believe the law is a set of guidelines they can adhere to if they so wish to. I had a letting agent try to do monthly inspections once. I was stuck with them because I couldn't afford to move and didn't dare refuse in case they served me with a section 21 notice. They would regularly complain about my housekeeping and once re-arranged an inspection because I had my clothes folded in a neat pile on my bed waiting to be put away. It had a massive impact on my mental health and my job as I kept having to take time off to accommodate their inspections.

And then there are the dangerous and squalid conditions some renters are forced to put up with because they can't afford anything better such as the person on here who mention mould and damp. I have asthma. Mould and damp could kill me.

How anyone can say that is a system that is safe and secure is beyond me.

100% spot on, Frequency.

Just because council/HA housing is sometimes cheaper than "market value" renting e.g. private lets, foesn't mean that the rent is subsidised. It just means that the council (or HA) isn't making a PROFIT on the property. Very few private LL would be in the business if they weren't getting a return on their money in excess of other reasonably secure income generators, so you need to consider that.

If the difference between council/HA rental and an identical privately owned house is 10%, you can be pretty sure that the difference is the LL profit.

You could argue that foregone profit is a subsidy.

You could argue that foregone profit is a subsidy

It always comes back to this on these threads. Over and over, but you and I both know that is not what people mean when they spew their ignorant bullshit about SH being subsidised by the taxpayer.

Except it isn't.

How exactly does the SH system work then in terms of paying rent? What would happen if say a couple were both unemployed, no intention of finding work and then decided to have more children? Would this effect others in SH?

Before I get shouted down I am absolutely NOT saying this is the case for the majority. We have rented privately a tiny two-bed for five years despite both working ft as it's all we can afford. We have two boys-9 and 11. House is mouldy and damp and LL won't do anything about it. My ex-husband earns over £105k pa but doesn't have to pay me a penny as 50:50 shared care.

How do you even qualify for SH?

"In terms of paying rent" renting is renting is renting.

No difference between private or social renting.

Tenants all work and pay their rent unless they don't, in which case they claim Housing Benefit or Universal Credit for their rent instead.

How do you even qualify for SH?

You can get an application form from your local council, fill it in and send it back, they'll assess your needs and priority level. Many councils now operate a choice-based lettings system where they advertise empty properties each week and you register your interest on the ones you would consider accepting (called bidding). As well as allocating a priority level, my local council also tells you what types of property you are eligible to "bid" for so if you were a single person you would not be allowed to bid for 2-3 bed properties, people with children under 10 aren't allowed to bid for flats higher than the second floor, to bid on bungalows one of you must be aged over 55 and/or have a qualifying medical condition, and so on.

How exactly does the SH system work then in terms of paying rent?

The same way a private letting works. Rent is £xxx and due on a specific day each week/month. The tenant either pays the full amount of rent themselves or - if they qualify for it - they claim Housing Benefit for some/all of it. Many tenants in social housing work and pay full rent, the situation in the South East is not indicative of the entire UK and in lots of areas there is little difference in rent levels between social housing and the private sector, there is also not the same social housing shortage.

What would happen if say a couple were both unemployed, no intention of finding work and then decided to have more children?

Depending on how many children they have they may become overcrowded. Councils have rules on how many people can occupy a property according to how many bedrooms it has so if they exceeded this they could apply to rejoin the housing register and start looking for another property. They wouldn't get one instantly as they'd have to wait for a suitable property to become available and may not be first in line for it when one does become available.

Would this effect others in SH?

It would have no affect on existing tenants and even after they were moved the family would only have one property, their old property would be let to someone else. For example, Family A is in a two bed with three children. My local council would class this as overcrowded and award a Band 2 priority level for it (they have five bandings - Priority, then Bands One through Four with Four being lowest priority). They register a "bid" on a three bed property nearby and are successful. They move in. Their two bed property is now empty and is readvertised, it is let to a couple with two children.

Thank you so much for explaining, really helpful.

So could we apply for SH even though we both work ft? As I say the situation with I'm us is that we are privately renting an unsuitable two-bed. I have two sons from an abusive ex-husband (who doesn't have to pay a penny) and my fiance doesn't have any children. We would love a child together but can't afford to rent anywhere bigger than a two-bed privately so we can't.

So if we did eventually get SH, say a two-bed like we're in now, what would happen if we had a child together?

@corythatwas

I understand some people in SH work very hard indeed, absolutely. And also that it isn't always possible to pay rent from earnings alone (believe me I know the struggle, I've been renting privately for five years and a single mum for three of those).

But what about the minority that choose not to work? What happens then? How can they pay any rent if they're not earning? Isn't that getting housing for free?

How do you even qualify for SH?

In reality, at least in London and the South East, most new tenants come via the homeless route, or extreme need tantamount to destitution. But it wasn't always that way and it isn't that way everywhere.

Social (council) housing was originally meant to house a broad section of society and provide regulated housing with good quality accommodation for the masses.

But what about the minority that choose not to work? What happens then? How can they pay any rent if they're not earning? Isn't that getting housing for free?

It's no different to "choosing not work", (or more likely, being unable to work) in the private sector. You'd "get housing for free" then too.

People can't really choose not to work Any more if people are fit and healthy and there is nothing preventing them from working than they would be claiming JSA and would have to be seen to be looking for work, of course there are the minority who choose to have children without being in work ,but times have changed they can't continue to have child after child and keep getting extra money for them. single parents are expected to look for work when their youngest child is five, as for qualifying for social housing ,it depends where you live,in my town anyone can apply I think the upper income level was £60,000+,the housing allocation system operates a choice based bidding system ,so as a family of four you can bid on2\3 bedroom houses ,3 bedroom houses w would be seen as higher than what you actually nee d depending on the age and sex of your children but as you both work and pay your own rent irrelevant for bedroom tax purposes so you would be eligible to apply , and than based on your circumstances you would have to bid every week and wait untill.you placed first for the bid and how long that would tak e is anyone's guess based on how many have bidded for the property ,priority need, how long you have been bidding etc.

@x2boys

Thank you, that's really helpful.

I guess it might be worth considering. Our current combined income is only £25k so paying rent for this little two-bed in a squeeze as it is! My boys are 8 and 11 and so a two-bed is not ideal but 3 beds privately renting are obviously way more expensive.

Our private LL has really let us down and I wonder if there would be more cover re mould and damp issues in SH?

It took him four years to get a bathroom window fixed and still waiting for leaky sink to be sorted 😢