To invite all Mumsnetters to the Brexit Rally in Parliament Square tomorrow afternoon/evening?

[SunnyInGrimsby]

OK, it's doubtful Brexit is going to happen any time soon but definitely worth coming along and standing up for what we voted for.

Very little coverage in the media - unfortunately no full page spreads in the Standard for us....

It will be going on until early evening so still worth turning up if you can't get the day off work. Lots of great speakers including Julia Hartley Brewer, Claire Fox, Kate Hoey et al.

So bed, you're so confident you made the right decision that you're ashamed to admit it publicly. Well done. If you find some standards to live by, do let us know.

maud that’s what I think too. It was a targeted organised campaign by an extremist minority to remove his voice and it succeeded. This is the awful legacy of the Conservative party having a tiny and unrepresentative membership, wide open to infiltration by the hard right and with so much power. Imagine how these people are going to behave when the members choose the next leader. It is very frightening.

The problem is its as a remainer I have yet to speak to one leaver who can give a sensible argument for leaving, not one. I have tried to understand and let’s face it Brexit has certainly had enough AirPlay. All I see are leavers fighting amongst themselves with neither putting the interests of my children’s future first. Nothing has been based on fact and they lied massively in the first place in order to further party politics.

When people are lied to and see personal gain put above the future of their children they become bitter. Alongside that e have to sit and watch the shit show that is the Tory attempt to run the country. I’m not sure what you expect.

As an aside I was staggered at the scenes last night. I went on the March last week with my children as did others . Over 1 million angry people able to express their views in a cordial way without any police presence, the contrast to last night was huge. Grim.

I was wondering about that, why on Earth they are not giving estimates of numbers in this tiny (by comparison) march? Keep the debate going?

People in the march are excusing the small numbers on being Friday but all their other ones were even smaller. Truth is... leave is a tiny side with some very vocal and stubborn politicians.

Leavers need to make a stand against that, otherwise you’re all going to be tarred with the same brush.

Yes. Why don't you get up a petition to say that the Tommy Robinson EDL types don't speak for Leavers? See if you can get that to anything like approaching six million signatures. Crowd fund your own Billboards as LedByDonkeys have done.

'By their friends ye shall know them''. There you have it, Leavers

Yep.

Sorry Leavers, you can't keep shifting the responsibility. ' Oh, it's just a tiny minority. Oh it's the BBC who are biased against us utter bollocks btw. Oh, it's those nasty Remainers being mean to us.'

Give me a break.

You keep saying you know what you voted for. You keep saying you did loads of research before you voted. You keep saying that you're horrified by the ugly, stupid, racist element of the vote to leave. And yet, despite all of this research and knowledge and understanding that you apparently have, it appears that every single one of you is utterly flabbergasted by the fact that the very nastiest elements of the far right voted the same way as you did. That you're sharing your vote with people who are happy to sieg heil in public, to intimidate and threaten journalists, to walk the streets with gallows and lists of MPs that deserve to be hung from them, to call ordinary people traitors, saboteurs, enemies of the people.

Does none of that give you any pause at all, you who have thought so long and hard about your vote? Does the fact that you are sharing your vote with the very worst dregs of our society tell you anything?

Or is it just more, nah, not me guv? Nothing to do with me. Someone else's responsibility, as per fucking usual.

Chardonnay - but these things are v important to me. It's massively important to me that democracy be upheld. It's massively important to me that all voices are heard and considered. We don't know actually, that everything will fall apart after brexit. It might not. In fact, it probably won't. But not listening to the people, not respecting the Democratic vote, that would not be a good thing at all. It has already fuelled Tommy Robinson and his friends and this will only get worse if we don't leave in two weeks, and much much worse if there is another referendum.

If you win something, you should not have the prize taken away from you because the other side didn't want you to win, and because the other side can use their power to take it from you. That will make you super super angry and yes, it will fuel hate and violence.

@ItsFinallyBedTime , you have a job to do. Quash these horrible voices or you will give No Brexit the excuse it needs to quash Brexit for you.

I am a leaver. I do not support Tommy robinson, or EDL or any other fascict, racist, intolerant or hateful organisation

This is exactly what the majority of Germans would have said during the Weimar republic/ rise of facism.

I think it's sad that I have to feel that way.

I think it's sad that it sounds as though your Leaver arguments aren't robust enough to counteract the Remainers viewpoints. Leavers invariably lose me when they e.g. start to argue that 80% of people voted for parties which supported Brexit, as though that 80% bought into a party's manifesto in toto. Or the "what about what they (the EU) did to Greece", not "what about what we in the UK helped to do to Greece as EU members". I really want to hear much stronger arguments than that.

Yes. Why don't you get up a petition to say that the Tommy Robinson EDL types don't speak for Leavers? See if you can get that to anything like approaching six million signatures. Crowd fund your own Billboards as LedByDonkeys have done

I've seen lots of suggestions like this and I agree with them. Stand up for your actual beliefs, don't allow your vote to be hijacked by scum like the EDL and the FLA. Don't let them speak for you.

But Leavers just say, we won, why should we have to bother? We put a cross in a box 3 years ago, now give us our prize and don't blame us if it goes to shit. It's an appalling dereliction of democratic duty.

How is it worth "standing up for what we voted for" when it is known that the Leave vote was riddled with fraud and electoral misconduct?

Oh come MullofKintire! This is quite different!

By voting leave I voted to leave the European Union. I didn't vote for a Nazi dictator!

If you win something, you should not have the prize taken away from you

This wasn't about winning a prize! This is the future of the entire county at stake. What a bizarre way to look at it.

@ItsFinallyBedTime , what are you going to do to wrest back control of Leave from these gits.
Pouting won't work.

If you win something, you should not have the prize taken away from you because the other side didn't want you to win, and because the other side can use their power to take it from you. That will make you super super angry and yes, it will fuel hate and violence

A cross-post which perfectly illustrates my point.

Tell me exactly how in your view democracy and trade will be better, I’m all ears. It never is explained in detail.

And re middle class power. You do realise the maj of the population middle class and otherwise are all under the thumbs of a few at the very top. The same few who are manipulating and making life worse for those at the bottom as we speak.They want carte Blanche to tighten the thumb screws even more. Chlorinated free chicken will only be the start, job protection will be high on the agenda. Great for those of us on crappy minimum wages.

Look at the difference between the atmosphere at the remain and the leave marches.

What a disgrace those people were yesterday. Where were the other leave voters countering this behaviour?

Who THE FUCK booked Tommy Robinson to speak to represent the POV of the leave side because that's the image that was portrayed to the rest of the country and indeed the world. Somebody sees him as some kind of figurehead.

And to bed you think the class divide is bad now? Wait and see what happens post Brexit. You think GB will suddenly become a great manufactoring nation again selling goods worldwide? Where are we going to get all these cheap materials from to make things with? We've got fuck all resources here.

This isn't the 60s. The world has moved on.

If you win something, you should not have the prize taken away from you because the other side didn't want you to win, and because the other side can use their power to take it from you.

You should have the prize taken away from you if your team won through fraud and driving a coach and horses through the rules. And how does your argument apply to Parliamentary elections? Why should May have had the chance to call an election in 2017 to try to change the vote from only two years previously?

It's not a bizzare way to look at it max.

The leavers are being treated as ignorant. Many of us placed our vote based on solid, well thought out arguments. We won the vote. We expected therefore that the UK would leave. We did not expect the other side would not accept the decision and try and get it over thrown. That is not Democratic and not fair and will inevitably lead to unpleasant places.

@ItsFinallyBedTime , if all Leavers can do is threaten me with Yaxley-Lennon, you are losing control of the thing you won.
I am no longer interested in whining about unfairness (like a No Deal would fix that ), it is all about jumping on these twats and putting them back down the sewer where they belong. Don't want to join that? Don't want to work for the common good and just want these twats to speak for you? Tells me a great deal about the true meaning of Leave.

Sorry, I am ducking out now for a while to get breakfast and get DCs to football! :) (Life carries on while all the craziness is happening!)

That is not Democratic

And democracy isnt about winning a vote based on lies. That in itself is good reason to not uphold it. The fact it will be so detrimental for the country and several who voted for it will no longer be with us or have changed their minds as now fully informed is neither here nor there.

Last weekend there were so many teens shouting for their say as they didn’t get to vote and will have to spend their working lives sorting out the mess. Ignoring them isnt democracy.

As a further aside can the gov keep having votes in the hoc until they get what they want on other issues or is it just Brexit?Seems incredibly unfair and undemocratic.

My life goes on too @ItsFinallyBedTime . We have breakfast to sort and sporty stuff to do. Only those twats are still there apparently not speaking in your name. And threatening my family and my "type" with every drunken yell.