To be livid with DD for hurting DDog

[HelenLaBloodyAnnoyed]

DD is 11. Tonight we were at the park with our dog. There's a slide that's on a hill so it doesn't have steps up to it. She was standing at the top and about to throw DDogs ball when DDog knocked it out of her hands and it rolled down the slide. DDog jumped on the slide without thinking and went sliding down after it, pretty gracefully actually. DD thought it was hilarious but I told her to keep DDog and the ball away from it as DDog had been lucky not to get hurt.

Half hour later I'm across the park pushing DS on the swings and I see DD drop the ball down the slide. DDog goes to run away from the top of the slide and down the hill alongside it but DD blocks DDog so DDog slips down backwards and twists halfway down (it's not a straight slide.) Again, DD is in hysterics.

When I tell her off she says she didn't mean to and that it was an accident. Her sister backs up what I saw - that she dropped it and blocked DDog deliberately. As I was putting the DC to bed I saw that DDog isn't bearing weight on one of her legs and told DD so. She said "fine, I'm sorry" and stroked DDog. AIBU to think that doesn't cut it and to be absolutely livid? She messaged her dad about it who messaged me saying she's done nothing wrong

Both incidents are quite....worrying. Does she have a lack of empathy generally? Any other issues with her behaviour at all?

That canal story is way worse than the dog story 😕 you need to come down like a tonne of bricks on her.

Your update is concerning and goes far beyond your OP. She deliberately took your younger DD towards the canal and wasn’t bothered when she fell in? I assume your younger DD can swim and was ok?

Is this a normal thing she does? Doesn’t understand danger and consequence?

This is worryingly similar to 'We need to tall about Kevin.'

Look it up.

Talk*

Did you tell her father about the canal incident?

You know the age of criminal responsibility in England is 10 right. A 10 year old is considered old enough to know right from wrong, and be able to be punished by the courts?

Unless there's a diagnosable issue with her this behaviour is at best misguided. There has to be consequences, because a drowned child and a spinal-injured dog as potential outcomes for her deliberate choices to ignore you are beyond acceptable.

Her father doesn't get to minimise this. She doesn't get to say 'fine, I'm sorry.' as a dragged out not-sorry.

She's willfully disobeying you.
She obviously can't be trusted on her own for even a couple of minutes even with you nearby. She needs to be on a tighter leash as it were.
ie. if you are at the swings with DS she needs to be there with dog, not at the slide with the dog.
Take her to the vet with you so she sees the consequences. Pocket money deduction to contribute towards the vet bill. No unsupervised playing with the dog until she can prove she can be trusted.

The update about her little sister is even more worrying. If you need to change a baby's nappy near water again both of the older children will have to sit next to you until you can supervise them again. That could have ended very tragically.

This is very poor behaviour for 11. The behaviour with her sister is even worse. Does she have form for lacking empathy? Or deliberately hurting others? Interesting that both times you mention have involved smaller/weaker creatures.

Her DF needs a kick up the backside. Or at least a good talking to.

YANBU - poor ddog

You might want to get some help otherwise we will be reading about your DD in newspapers in few years

WTF! I would be alarmed if my DD what seems deliberately hurt any of my dogs and a younger sibling.

Omg at first I thought oh poor dog but didn't think she intended to hurt it from your OP but now the canal update very worrying I would be looking into making an appointment with CAMHS to rule out any underlying issues.

As well as fuming, I'd be really unsettled by both events.
Lack of empathy is pretty scary..

Holy fuck, she led your 4yo to the water’s edge when she knew it wa sdangrous and 4yo fell into the canal?! She could have drowned! Did her father think she had done nothing wrong then either?!

Hurting animals deliberately is a known predictor of a life of antisocial behaviour, to use the polite expression.

Laughing about hurting children and animals is... well, you know.

Ton of bricks and lost privileges. See if that works. If not, get the school to recommend a proper psychiatrist (not a therapist, you need medical input) who has experience in dealing with the various relevant personality disorders.

There's mistakes for not realising consequences of actions (DD not to know that DDog would get hurt on slide) and then show emotion when you explain the consequences and why she must follow instruction. And then there's the canal incident where she is deliberately defiant and does not take responsibility for decisions she makes.

So as to avoid drip feed is there anything else about DD you need to share? How is she generally at home towards you and her siblings? How is she at school? Any other concerns over behaviour?

If you are at all concerned, contact the School Nurse or your own GP to discuss, and get advice.

I think this is worrying at 11. Is there anything else OP, a backstory? Is she having trouble at school? Does she have friends? Are you and her Dad together? When you say 11 is that 11 and at secondary or is she still in year 6?

This is worryingly similar to 'We need to tall about Kevin

I thought that too

YANBU to be livid. Your update is really worrying though. I don't think you can trust her to be unsupervised - even for very short periods of time - with your younger DD to be honest after that. It's her attitude afterwards that is troubling too. She seems to have no sense of responsibility for her own actions or for the consequences of them and zero remorse. Did her dad realise how serious the canal incident was when you spoke to him about that?

Jesus Christ. Together those two examples are a bit chilling.

I wouldn't be leaving her unsupervised with any sibling or animal and unless both of these incidents are entirely out of character I would be seeking some professional advice on how to deal with her, to be honest.

Your dd could have drowned. It's as serious as it gets. Sorry you're having to deal with this.

Her lack of remorse isn't good, OP.

Have you posted about your DD before? Does she have SN/ASD or am I getting you confused with someone else?

She isn't deliberately trying to hurt them, she looks shocked when things have gone wrong after she hasn't listened but then her concern is about herself and any reprimands more so than whoever she's caused to be hurt.

Her dad and I are separated and he backed her up after she told him about the canal incident too

How is she at other times, what is she generally like? What's her personality and her average day like? Because re the dog was bad enough but echoing others, what she caused to happen to her sibling could have ended in death.

I do think that depending on how she is the rest of the time, that you might want to talk to her GP. My eldest is 11 and has SEN, but even she wouldn't do things like this. I'd expect it from my youngest but my youngest CAN show empathy, shes just also very high spirited and petulant and typical of a child with attachment issues (look that up, cba to explain).

I hope dog is OK, and I would also insist dd stays by your side.