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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Dating Etiquette AIBU?

85 replies

flipertyflop · 19/03/2019 12:50

A bit of womanly wisdom needed for this one please, I haven't dated for years.
My colleague went on a first date last night. It didn't go well.
He held the door open for his date who sighed and said "that is a bit cringey". They waited for a table to become available and when they were shown to the table he said "after you" to which she rolled her eyes. Next, when they were sat at the table and the waiter came over and asked if they were ready to order, he gestured to his date and said "Ladies first". All in all very polite and inoffensive, or so I would have thought? She called him a dick!
Personally I would have got up and left at that point but being the gent he is, he persisted with the date.
She asked to go dutch at the beginning of the meal but when it came to it she was more than happy to let him pay the lot.
I'm all for equality but surely someone holding a door or letting you order first isn't a massive faux pas? Is that not just manners, whether it comes from the man or the woman? AIBU?

OP posts:

MRex · 19/03/2019 15:07

He should have left when she was first rude to him. She should have left instead of being rude to him. He certainly shouldn't have paid for her food. Clearly not a good match.

I hold doors for people and I expect them to also be held for me. Politeness is not the key thing to challenge in order that women may have equality, at best it's misplaced concern and in her case just plain nasty.

InnerCircle · 19/03/2019 15:16

matriarchy innit.

She was right to be offended. It's every woman's right. Of course he should pay too. Affirmative action.

youknowmedontyou · 19/03/2019 15:17

Is this a reverse?

Dieu · 19/03/2019 15:43

What an absolute cow!

Katiepoes · 19/03/2019 15:50

Ah that's fair enough Norniron, that indeed is just good manners. It's all about context isn't it?

Babycham1979 · 19/03/2019 15:50

Haha! The poor bloke should've turned around and walked out as soon as she called him a dick. I mean, he sounds a little gauche and 1970s, but she sounds like an out and out cuntlodger!

Isitsixoclockalready · 19/03/2019 15:52

MrsFionaCharming - how on earth would you know if you weren't there?

FrustratedTeddyLamp · 19/03/2019 15:54

Thing is wasnt everybody taught to open doors for people? We know men generally are, so arent women in general? I know i was.

How do you know its "benevolent sexism" rather than general manners?

Magenta82 · 19/03/2019 16:09

How do you know its "benevolent sexism" rather than general manners?

Because people don't tend to find general good manners "cringey".

FrustratedTeddyLamp · 19/03/2019 16:12

But if youve already preconceived the idea that the action is sexist then no matter the intention its more likely you'll look down at it.

Magenta82 · 19/03/2019 16:22

But if youve already preconceived the idea that the action is sexist then no matter the intention its more likely you'll look down at it.

Someone would have to be a bit sexist to come out with sexist phrases like "ladies first".

Beeziekn33ze · 19/03/2019 16:22

Wondering when I last heard a man under 60 say 'Ladies first'!

chestylarue52 · 19/03/2019 16:26

Well as the old story says about the chivalrous man shot down by a feminist: I didn't hold the door because you were a lady, it was because I am a gentleman. Tips his hat and moves on

Oh gosh my eyes rolled so hard they nearly rolled off down the road.

FrustratedTeddyLamp · 19/03/2019 16:34

Someone would have to be a bit sexist to come out with sexist phrases like "ladies first"*

Yet theres still millions of parents teaching young boys this to this day under the guise of manners.

NoooorthonerMum · 19/03/2019 16:58

This story sounds a fabricated to me. If she was such a stick up the arse about having the door held open for her why would he continue to do things like say 'ladies first'?

Magenta82 · 19/03/2019 17:17

Yet theres still millions of parents teaching young boys this to this day under the guise of manners.

They are being old fashioned and sexist, it is not good manners to treat people differently because of their gender.

jay55 · 19/03/2019 17:22

I think it is possible we're hearing about the date through the eyes of a 'But I'm a nice guy' type. Who thinks they are perfect and are really annoying.
Ladies first with a flourish and bow, rather than a simple after you.

I've no idea really as I wasn't there, just conjures up some cringe moments.

Sol44 · 19/03/2019 17:24

“Someone would have to be a bit sexist to come out with sexist phrases like "ladies first"

Meanwhile in the real world ....

What are you talking about? Both my boys know it’s “ladies first” as a basic rule. My daughters would expect nothing less either. What would you rather have - men who push you out if the bus queue? My kids were taught that at school. And yes, my DH might say “ladies first” in various scenarios - why wouldn’t he? This is basic stuff.

Magenta82 · 19/03/2019 17:28

Meanwhile in the real world ....

I think you mean "Meanwhile in the 1950s...."

Treating everyone with respect regardless of their gender is basic good manners. Treating people differently because of their gender is outdated discrimination.

It is polite for the first person to get to the door to hold it for the next, it is polite to get the door for someone with a physical disability or with their arms full of stuff, it is not polite to make a song and dance over treating an adult woman as incapable because of her gender.

FrustratedTeddyLamp · 19/03/2019 18:03

To be fair i open doors for whoever and get doors opened for me. Admittedly i dont know why it is done but i very much doubt its because men think women as a class are physically incapable of opening doors.

Elloduckie · 19/03/2019 18:23

This is what happens when a society looks down on anything 'Old fashioned', his date sounds like a poor product of twisted feminism mantra in addition to her having terrible manners.

I wouldne be surprised if your friend became quite scarred from this dating experience. Hopefully it will remain the terrible one off that it is.

feelingsinister · 19/03/2019 19:08

@Sol44 Why is it always 'ladies' first? Why is it important that women go through a door/get their coffee/sit down first?

I don't want that, I don't want special treatment because I'm a woman (I fucking hate being called a lady).

I couldn't give a shit if a man pays for my dinner on a date, I'm more worried about not being raped on the way home/being paid less than my male colleagues/being passed over for promotion etc etc

Original poster

flipertyflop · 19/03/2019 19:19

Sorry, crazy day. Wow, thanks for all the responses. I know I'm possibly a bit biased but I've known this guy years, he's genuinely one of the good guys, yes, gentlemanly but just polite. Probably too polite to tell her to just f*ck off which is what I would have done if I was called a dick quite frankly. I've no idea why he continued with the chivalry but he did. Bullet dodged. They won't be seeing each other again. Thanks for all the comments though, he's had a read through.

OP posts:

Ellisandra · 19/03/2019 19:29

I’d like to hear the other side!
Having already showed him clearly that she didn’t like gestures like that, he still came out with “ladies first” - so he was rude himself in not caring about what she had told him.
I’m happy with “after you” as I hear it / say it to both sexes. But “ladies first” would tell me this wasn’t my kind of guy.

Even the paying, I’d like to hear both sides. I’ve had first dates with men who like perceive themselves as gentlemen, who are uncomfortably aggressive about paying. I’ve still not allowed it, but it can be intimidating.

She does sound rude.

But I would still like to hear the other side!

Ellisandra · 19/03/2019 19:31

“Gentlemanly” means something different to me. Gentlemanly means caring that your date is uncomfortable with this kind of behaviour and making an effort not to come out with “ladies first”.

Did he offer to pay? Having already said she wanted to go Dutch, why did he not look at the bill and say “that’s £20 each”?

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