To expect DD to be considerate towards her sibling?

[HelenLaBloodyAnnoyed]

DD is 11 and DS is 14 months (there are two more siblings in between.) DS has been walking since he was 9 months old, so it's not new news. However, I constantly have to deal with situations that arise because of DDs thoughtlessness. She will leave Lego/sharpies/coins/batteries on the floor that I then have to prise off DS, usually resulting in tears. Despite repeated reminders she keeps leaving the stair gate open, meaning I always have to be on extra high alert and repeatedly remove him from the stairs - again causing tears. She has also left it open at the top and I only just managed to catch him before he fell.

She will chase him on paths despite me asking her to do it only on grass because he's likely to trip. She will be walking holding hands with him then decide to let go and cross the road, with no thought that he'll try and follow her. Pretty much every time she has a shower, she'll leave the bathroom before drying, getting all of the kitchen tiles soaking wet which then causes DS to slip and hurt himself. She just doesn't seem to give a shit that she causes him to get upset/hurt repeatedly and seems to think I should carry him 24/7 so she can continue to do whatever she likes.

She actually adores him and is always chatting to and playing with him but just can't seem to be considerate. AIBU to expect her to be?

It's not just the bathroom that she leaves wet; the bathroom is downstairs so she leaves the bathroom soaked, walks through the kitchen, dining room and hallway which have tiles and laminate to get to the front room meaning no one can walk anywhere besides the front room downstairs without slipping.

I do praise her when she shuts the gate or picks things up, but it's rare.

She's fine at remembering things if it's to benefit herself.

Stompy this isn't a post about her good points

HelenLaBloodyAnnoyed

Stompy this isn't a post about her good points

Maybe this is why you are getting it in the neck. Most posts complaining about children usually list some of their good points.

From what you have posted she seems to have none and if this is truly your feelings towards her then you are in for a long and difficult ride until she final leaves home (or you kick her out)

I do believe it’s fair to have general house rules, rather than baby-specific rules. It’s fair to say that she can’t leave the tiles soaking wet. It’s fair to say she can’t leave her things lying around. It’s fair to say the baby gate needs to remain closed. But wrap these in with other expectations/ chores.

It sounds like you need to reestablish house rules. What are the punishments/rewards for her behaviour now?

You seem to have let her get away with this kind of behaviour for years - where are the consequences?

Make her come back and wipe up the water every single time.

At 11 I would be telling her the severe consequences of her actions if your youngest child was to fall and knock themselves unconscious.

I definitely showed my 2 children 24 hours in A&E so they could see the aftermath of Fail videos, you know where someone messes up like falls off a skateboard at a good speed and you know they are going to need to have all the bits of gravel removed from their horrific grazes. And how long bodies take to recover from things.

The stair gate could mean your youngest child dies. It is that serious.

There has to be harsh consequences for it. For me I would tell her she isn't allowed to pass through the stair gate without you present. She has to wait for you so you can monitor her closing it. You need to inconvenience her.

OP you indicate you have other children - what chores do they each do? What rewards do they each get for good behaviour including consideration to one another? Instead of picking on just your 11 year old you need to rope them all in apart from the baby into standards of acceptable behaviour at home. (And yeah sticker/star charts etc do work.)

Oh if the bathroom is down stairs she has to get changed in the bathroom. She will then soon learn not to soak the bathroom. She will be hitting puberty soon and won't want to walk around the house naked so you may as well start now.

Stompy this isn't a post about her good points ouch clearly it isn't, do you feel she has any or is every tiny thing she does at the moment irritate you? We're you with the father of your other 3 children for long? I'm wondering if she is missing them?

Boney she has multiple good points but none are in relation to this issue so I don't see the relevance of listing them.

If she leaves things lying around, they're removed for a time. If she leaves the floor soaking I do get her to mop it up but still no one can walk around so it doesn't improve things for anyone else. If she nags to walk with him then acts irresponsibly, next time I say no which she hates.

I don't expect her to sit in silence when she is up later - I always get on with jobs and the younger ones sleep through it. But she'll do things like squeak the dogs toys to make him bark and keep calling him, slam doors, bounce a ball against the wall, sing at full volume. She isn't interested in reading or drawing and doesn't care if waking them interrupts our time.

Tomorrow and Thursday night she has activities that don't finish until 7.30pm meaning the little ones aren't in bed until 8.30pm (there are no lift sharing options available - I've tried) so I ask that she's considerate of their late night and lets them sleep in if they are doing so the following morning. Still, she'll be singing and crashing around by 6am.

At 11 she is either old enough to open and close the stairgate or not. If she's not old enough to remember to close it, then she's not allowed to open it either but has to wait for you to let her through.
In future, new rule, no getting dressed in the front room only the bathroom. Check the bathroom every time she uses it and call her back sort it out if she's left it wet. Every time.

11 year olds are a work in progress but you can have some ground rules. It will ne more work for you initially but it'll pay off.

GoGo if this were about a DH and I said "DH keeps thoughtlessly endangering our child's life but he's wonderful at the housework" I'd get told anything else is irrelevant, that he shouldn't be doing what he's doing. I don't see how DDs good points justify this one bad point I'm discussing?

Does she struggle to sit quietly, does she fidget? Is she similar at school, struggles to focus on a task, disruptive in class?

Because I would assume an adult DH to have a fully developed brain and have better forward planning skills/consequences thinking- as other posters have said. I really don't think you can equate your 11 yo child's actions with how you expect a partner to act.

But when she's up later isn't your time as you've said you're doing jobs. I think her being noisy when the others are in bed at night is clearly attention seeking. And you're not listening.

Cut her some slack, her hormones will be kicking in. Did you have baby brain? She will be getting it too.

If the younger ones can pick up then make it into a game with a reward for picking things up.

I also agree with toweling dressing gown, or just a towel on the kitchen floor, by the time she's walked on it her feet will be dry. Slippers might help too. Or even a onesie.

She's fine at remembering things if it's to benefit herself.

So make it a benefit to her? Does she get pocket money? Offer an increase for each week she remembers to pick up, close the gate, keep the floor dry. Put 200 1p pieces in a jar, every time she leaves the floor wet or the gate open take one out, at the end of the week she gets to keep what is in the jar.

You can make some small changes to manage the risk, so as a pp suggested put down 2 or even 3 bath mats, buy her a towelling robe if you can afford to.
Talk to her calmly about the risks and askingher what she thinks she can do, rather than you telling her , you could suggest making some reminder posters for example.
And finally get into the habit of using one word as a reminder, rather than a lecture, so say ‘ stairgate’ rather than launch into a rant or lecture about ,you’ve left the stairgate open again, how many times do I have to tell you, etc etc’

I disagree with a lot of these posts, I think it’s healthy to grow up I a largish family and learn skills of responsibility and care (yes I have experience, I was the oldest of 5 and did a LOT of housework and care).

I expect my ds 9 to contribute, I discuss it rather than dictate but he knows his jobs. He keeps a certain room in a better state, he folds clothes and does the bins. It’s give and take, his younger sister unloads and pegs out the washing sometimes as he hates it.

I’m grateful I left home with an idea of how to keep one. It’s helped in jobs to have skills of independence and organisation, it’s helped me travel and now I have my own 5 it helps me with a calm and happy house. I have one with significant special needs too, and I’m happy. The kids are happy.

I don’t think low expectations automatically lead to anymore happiness in the now, and don’t in the future. We are a team at home. We help each other and give breaks if someone is tired, we show care and we’re happy. I think it helps them in other tasks in life to, for example the confidence and kudos in cubs camp showing others how to make a bed or helping leaders with ease and getting reward. Generally feeling able in life gives you confidence. My oldest two have left home and started independent life at uni happily, and seem to be starting balanced relationships

Others will disagree but with the stair gate issue and floor being actively dangerous I’d have consequences to aid her memory. Her sibling can’t risk broken limbs on a daily basis. You’re doing a great job I’m sure, but I’d implement something to make her remember. Either something like giving the floor a full mop each times, I’d give her whatever task you are doing and going to watch your little one while she completes it. When my oldest was doing something careless I’d tell her I’d occupy her with chores like hoovering instead to remove the problem. It helped her memory

@junipergins
I agree, my kids all had chores and responsibility. At what point do parents stop treating kids like permanent toddlers? 11 is heading to high school more than old enough to be aware and be helpful, you can't keep excusing poor behaviour on age or they'll never grow up.

I have a 6, 7 and 9 year old and they all already know not to leave small objects lying around incase their 4 month old brother gets ahold of them. Not saying they don’t occasionally forget but as soon as I remind them they pick it up immediately and apologise. Don’t have a stair gate as yet but I’d imagine they will occasionally forget to close it because they’re children and children don’t always have the greatest memories...

I would suggest she takes her clothes into the bathroom so she doesn’t make the rest of the house wet and tell her to stand on the bath mat as she gets dried.

Her behaviour sounds rather typical of an 11 year old if I’m being honest but bear in mind it can be tough being the eldest child especially if your siblings are significantly younger than you. She may want more attention from you.

@Bookworm4 yes, I do wonder how the children will cope while had extended toddler hood.

Btw I’m not criticising the OP, 11 yr olds are like this. I’m commenting on the posters commenting along the lines of you chose to have a baby, not her.

I don't expect her to help - I just don't want her to put him in danger, which I don't think is too much to ask

Yes, it is. She’s not capable of risk assessment as an adult is. You are describing her as thoughtless in comparison to the level of thoughtfulness that is natural to you: a mother of 4 with strong maternal instincts for her own child.

How are the other younger children managing to be mindful? Or are you not judging them by these standards?

The OP has already stated the younger two, much younger, close the stair gate.

My 6 yr old can remember this

Also both my 6 and 8 yr old show pretty good awareness of the toddler near roads, in there too but if she strays they are sometimes quicker than me... let alone leading her over a road. They also don’t trail water... the OP is perfectly reasonable with these standards. It’s not like she’s asking daily new and complex risk assessments with variable factors, just a few very basic rules

Sounds like an angry lost little girl. Three young siblings with a single parent mother, other dad not involved. She’s angry at the world for her life and doesn’t know how to verbally get it out or handle it.

She gloats about having an involved dad, that’s not because she’s mean that’s because she feels lost, she doesn’t fit in at dads, she doesn’t fit in at home but at least she has a dad Unlike them haha in her mind.

Even adults some times forget All the things you’ve listed. She’s hitting puberty and it surrounded by little kids/babies and a mum who’s too busy for her.

Yes I thought she sounded angry to and thought she may be doing things deliberately to hurt her brother. Obviously at 11 she knows that actually hitting a baby would be a very big deal. But being careless can be passed off as an accident/forgetting.