AIBU to be frustrated by the sheer volume of bogus legal advice on Mumsnet?

[Ladyoftheloch]

I am ceaselessly amazed by the amount of absolute tripe people spout about the law on AIBU, from people who clearly do not know what they are talking about and have no justification for the ‘advice’ they give.

People state as factual certainties every vague, half-formed belief they hold as though they’re practicing lawyers working in the field every day. I truly think some posters believe that because their opinion seems sensible to them, it must be the true legal position.

It’s wildly irresponsible, and people do it without giving any thought to the potential harm they could be doing by giving someone bogus advice.

There is a reason lawyers have to have degrees and professional qualifications. There is a reason they have to do a minimum amount of CPD every year. There is a reason they have to carry hefty insurance in case of mistakes.

So please, stop this nonsense. Stop starting sentences with the word ‘Legally...’ if you aren’t actually a lawyer practicing in the relevant field. Stop telling people what they are doing is legal or illegal. Stop insisting that everyone is entitled to half an hour of free legal advice as though it’s a human right. Stop confidently making proclamations about property disputes, wills, divorce, court procedures or whatever else based on your woolly sense of what you think is right. You have no idea of the harm and confusion you might be causing.

I hate this as well. I have some professional knowledge and qualifications in housing, and benefits, but as my knowledge is out of date, I always qualify my comments with something like ' as far as I was aware' (and do a quick online check first).

But the amount of posters who confidently assert, e.g. if you are married you own half the assets, because they think, or would like it to be true, is astounding.

I agree. I sometimes comment on hr/maternity issues but only if they are straightforward / can be directed to you.gov etc or (as often the case) where someone has already said something out of date / incorrect. Very often with hr matters it depends on contracts / company practice as well.

It’s so annoying isn’t it!

It wouldn’t be so bad if people would even say ‘not sure but I think that...’ or ‘in my experience...’ but over and over again you see people making statements as though they’re verifiable facts.

Sometimes in the same thread you get two people totally confidently making claims that completely contradict each other!

My favourite this week (not in the sense of 'legal advice', but along the same lines) was that workers from the EU don't pay income tax in the UK .

There was clearly some confusion between "people who work for the EU as an entity" and "people from other EU countries who work here in the UK" but the idea that anyone actually believes that blows me away.

Oh god, so much misinformation about the EU!

@HumptyDoo can you pop in a link to it? 😂

Yes it’s odd isn’t it? There was a good one recently where someone stated absolutely confidently the a contract didn’t exist until a payment was made (because otherwise you lacked consideration). Quite a technical legal point really so especially weird that someone would just have a guess.

@oftenhangry gosh, it was somewhere in the mass of Brexit threads and running through the middle of a particularly long one, I wouldn't know where to find it! To be honest I think that going through those threads again would have a negative impact on my will to live

I have a pretty high up job in law but have never commented on any legal matter on any thread. The amount of misinformation is terrible - but I won't comment as the poster needs to be properly assessed, in person, by a real live expert.
I know it's come up before, but the amount of posters who trot out the "free half hour with a solicitor" is ridiculous, as is some of the advice on wills and inheritance.

On a relationships one recently a poster was adamant that a wife with DCs has an automatic right to remain in the family home until the DCs are adult. Hogwash. She was absolutely insistent and wouldn't let it go.

I think it depends actually. Im no lawyer but I feel perfectly qualified to give advice about the law surrounding dangerous trees, GCN and TPOs as I deal with these in my professional life. Likewise if its a planning matter then a LA planning officer could probably offer a poster sound, basic advice.

My experience of planning enquiries certainly leads me to believe that plenty of lawyers aren't such a much, or at least will argue any amount of crap in exchange for money.

This never ceases to amaze me. I am lawyer specialising in one particular area for the past 15 years, and I would never hold myself out as an expert on other matters - eg family law - as that’s simply not an area in which I have up-to-date practical knowledge and experience.

Posters on MN seeking advice are often in complex situations and are desperate for solutions, and are vulnerable to treating as gospel and acting upon the ‘legal advice’ so confidently given here.

Quite often I see advice being given over and over on the same thread by numerous posters which is completely inaccurate, and the sheer number of posters giving that incorrect information seems to lend it credence. There’s often much more background to a situation than has been included in an OP, so for anyone (legally qualified or not) to think they can give sound advice on that basis is ludicrous and irresponsible.

Don't forget they should log it with 101 first!

Its that old thing about how a little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing - people hear half a fact and extrapolate the rest, or assume that what happened in their specific circumstances is universal, or simply believe that what they consider the ‘common sense’ position to be must automatically be the legal one.

@RiddleyW that’s bizarre, what a niche point to be so adamant about!

The apocryphal Mumsnet ‘free half hour of legal advice’ deserves some kind of award for being the site’s most entrenched myth.

I work in law in Europe and have had some dealings with EU directives. I have just seen a post on another thread about an EU rule banning pizza cutters in restaurants. This isn't a TAAT, but do people really believe that?

@HumptyDoo I will try to find it. Really curious how to do it so I don't have to pay taxes.

Back to the thread. I though law professionals are not allowed to give legal advice on forums like this? Just to actual clients? Is that not the case?

There was a similar thread not so long ago and apparently, when people post answers, they're not actually giving advice, just idly musing, so posts may or may not be correct, and that we're all supposed to know this, so would obviously never act on advice posted on here.

If that's the case, fuck knows why anyone bothers asking.

Im no lawyer but I feel perfectly qualified to give advice about the law surrounding dangerous trees, GCN and TPOs as I deal with these in my professional life.

I think it’s a little different if you have totally relevant professional experience, but I also expect that as a professional you’re wary of giving advice based on the usually small amount of information available in a post on this site. Many of those without relevant professional experience seem to have no such qualms!

Um, I think you need to be absolutely sure the legal advice is bogus before you declare it so on a public forum. You can actually sue for damages if someone says that about what you've said and they're wrong.

I agree and have made a number of tetchy posts saying as much!

I am a lawyer. I'm an expert in my area. I know bugger all about other areas of law e.g. planning, so I wouldn't purport to advise on it.

The free half hour bollox winds me up as well.

@Mookatron 😂

My favourites are where incorrect legal advice is given, and when the poster is called out on it, rather than bothering to look it up (i.e. follow the links provided) they just engage caps lock and insist they are right. Not a great situation, but it explains an awful lot about where we're at currently.

The epitome is parking fines with people insisting that "they can't take you to court". There are a few replies (with links to Beavis) which get ignored. Then a few pages later, they pop up again "they can't take you to court".

That said, it's possibly a fair counterpoint that anyone who relies on legal advice from the internet pretty much deserves what they get. (See also medical advice ....)

@Mookatron That's libel. Or slander. It's different if you are a common law wife. Ask your solicitor in your free half hour.

Oh my god yes, parking fines! I actually just had a peep at that new thread about a parking ticket to see if anyone had trotted out ‘they can’t enforce payment!’. I’m sure it will only be a matter of time!