Lady begging on the tube

[UsedtobeFeckless]

Please all tell me in shouty capitals how it's a big wrong thing to give to beggers because l'm feeling bad about this.
Sitting on the tube and a lady comes along the carriage asking very quietly and politely for money. Everyone put their heads down and ignored her. I did too. If anyone else had put their hand in their pocket l would have done too but no-one did so l just sat there and l've been beating myself up for it ever since.
What would you have done?

Ok thanks. I still want to believe in my poor ex soldier with PTSD, he was so polite and articulate but not too smooth, if you know what I mean .

She had enough money to get on the tube! So no she wouldn’t have got money from me.

My son regularly buys food for homeless people but won't give them money. It really upsets me to see women on the streets and, rightly or wrongly, I sometimes find it impossible not to give them something.

Overground I get to work has the same 5 people on rotation giving their same speech nearly every day on the way there and back. I've seen it pretty much every day for three years. Feel bad but I give monthly to shelter instead as I can't give every day and rarely carry change anyone.

Although one of the guys who delivers his speech in his quavey, "about to cry" voice then agressively shoves past everyone after he's collected his money does get on my nerves.

I’d have given her something.

I can’t understand why you wouldn’t just because nobody else did.

I donate direct to shelter. I never gave to beggars on the street or on public transport. There are professional beggars everywhere now. Those that use the animals are awful the animals are badly abused and drugged giving them money is helping them continue to do that. There was a gorgeous fluffy dog being used for this on Westminster Bridge it was heartbreaking

There’s a guy who recites poertry on the tube then proffers his cup. He gets EXTREMELY rude and aggressive if you say no to him so it actually is easier to avoid eye contact and ignore. The insinuation that that makes you a bad person or means you think beggars are sub-human really pisses me off. I’m trying to get home after a long day. I’ve no time for professional hawkers asking for my money.

Giving food, drink, clothes, time and company is one thing. Giving a complete stranger cash because they claim to be in dire need, and then walking off, or watching them walk off, another. I don't want to give money to complete strangers in complete ignorance of what they will do with it (which could easily be just to hand it over to their boss, buy illegal drugs, gamble with it). Tbh, I think just handing over some spare change and not caring what is done with it is an estronomically long way from taking the moral high ground.

(Astronomically!)

I would have, because I've been homeless.

Please explain how politely saying no makes anyone rich. I would genuinly like to know. because the more you humanise these scammers the more they can play on people’s sympathies. None of the ones on the trains are genuine therefore they don’t need politeness. I wouldn’t be rude to them but I don’t need to smile and say no either. The less people who do the more obvious it becomes that people are on to their scam.

The only scammers I would engage with directly are ones who could do me harm. E.g. the Nottingham knockers who have called here telling their story about how they’re out of prison and selling their goods etc as part of their probation are scammers. I know this because I have a friend who is a parole officer who confirms that the probation service does not endorse anything of the sort. But the ones around here are generally polite so if they knock I say no because I have no cash and they go on their merry way. But I am polite because they know where I live and who knows what harm they might do to me if I were to antagonise them.

The prepared speech is depressingly common on the London suburban trains too. I get it at least twice a week, once I have the woman some crisps as she’d asked for food/money for a shelter. Crisps were left over from a picnic so not needed and I suspected it was a scam, but I was still annoyed when she got off at my station - where there are no homeless hostels in the vicinity.

I see a lot of rough sleepers on my way to work, who aren’t asking for money. I don’t give to beggars any more because it’s so hard to know if they’re genuine but donate to Crisis instead. Rough sleepers/beggars are two slightly different issues I think.

The Romanians I know personally (who are not Roma) wouldn’t beg or steal or cheat any more than I would
Most definitely agree, in fact I would never assume someone from Romania was roma unless they had a flounce skirt, sandles and winter and gold earrings.
DP works with a lovely guy from Romania, he tells people he is from Hungary to avoid judgement.
I do believe the ones with notes aren't homeless, lots live around here and beg in public areas.
You cannot deny the genuine cases though, especially men who end up on the street because of high rents, relationship breakdowns and substance abuse.
I never ignore any of them, I will say I've no change sorry.

Don't know why you'd ignore her, just say no.

But be very aware that these people are earning more than average wages tax free through begging. As well as claiming maximum benefits. They are professional beggars because it's lucrative. They are not homeless.

I will however, give money to complete strangers if it's a commercial transaction and I get a material benefit from it, too.... so I guess it is the fact I am being asked to "help" someone with money when I don't know what that "help" will be.

Slightly on a tangent but I used to drive to work in North London and along Upper Street where it crosses with City Road there was a busy junction and you'd be delayed at the lights in rush hour, people would jump out and start cleaning your car windows as you couldn't move then demand money. I did pay at first as I was daft and young and intimidated.

I really don’t think the beggars where I live are professional beggars. I see them sleeping outside in the cold and rain, I dont believe anyone would do that if they had a nice warm house to go to

If they go into hostels, where there are often places, they are off the streets and so won't get money. You have to be out to get the money. I was out with the police a while back and they said the local church which had converted rooms into hostel beds couldn't fill them in the warmer weather as no-one wanted to go inside as this would dry up their source of income. Also see multi-storey car parks for the same reason- heaps of people going through with cash and warm and dry- there's a brilliant documentary on BBC iPlayer about drugs in Bristol (I think, or it may be the one about women sleeping rough). The most sought after spot is the indoor car parks and there are turf wars over this.

That doesn't mean I don't feel desperately sorry for people who are so heavily into that lifestyle, either drug dependent or run through gangs, that that's their life, but I don't feel guilty about refusing to pay. I never give anything and I don't feel bad, plenty do and it keeps people on the streets as that's their best source of income whereas if they try to apply for jobs whilst inadequately housed, with mental health difficulties and so on, they are unlikely to get a job.

This is also a political situation- as addiction services have been cut by councils due to spending cuts from government. This means people with addictions and/or mental health services are likely to be more in crisis and not well-treated or can't access services like they used to, so there are people definitely living on the streets who are extremely vulnerable, just I'm not sure what giving them money when they are heavily drug dependent is doing for them.

I never give to beggars ever but I do support homeless charities. I'm not usually a fan of charities with a religious bent but the Salvation Army does amazing work where I live so I'm happy to donate to them.

Beggars should not be allowed to beg on the tube. I'd ignore someone who did.

Lots of the hostels are rampant with drug use, They had an undercover reporter stay in Dublin hostels, he was offered a smoke of hash oil, he refused and it was heroin the guy was going to give him, there was violence arguments and you had to be out by stupid am.
Sometimes the street doorway is safer than these hostels.

I don’t carry cash, haven’t done for years so it’s not an option for me. The only time I have cash on me is when I have drawn it out for a specific thing I.e school trip, to pay in a store that doesn’t accept cards (yes some still exist). I once told a beggar I had no cash on me which wasn’t a lie and he told me to fuck off and called me a selfish bitch. He was given money by someone behind me and shouted after me “see, there’s a real human being!”- twat.

Anyway, the issue in big cities like London is beggars are so common people dehumanise them. If you’re asked ten times in one day for money, it gets tiresome and you also can’t give to them all.

To be honest, if a drink or a fix makes their misery more bearable, who am I to judge?

Its a really hard choice as there are so many things to consider.
A lot of PP say (and have proof) that some are professional scammers/beggars.
Its known that the amount of homeless people have massively increased in recent years (so there are more genuine cases)
That charities have massive overheads and only a certain % of money will reach the homeless person or person in need.
I do give to homeless people (sometimes money, sometimes food) and this might seem silly but I nearly always pass, go into a shop/building to get money out, and then go back and give to them as I feel that I might be vulnerable by getting my purse out. There is a guy who gets on the train and gives a long spiel but I have always thought he was genuine as he looks, and smells so bad. I can't imagine how (or why you would want) to get that stinky without not washing for weeks.
When I was in my early 20s a girl came up to me with a sob story about how she had lost her purse and needed money for the train etc. I felt intimaded as she approached me in a quiet, uncrowded road. So I gave her some money and then watched her walk away in entirely the wrong direction for where she alleged she needed to go to.

I'm assuming that the bloke with no hands who used to be at Oxford Circus was genuine?

Was asked for money by a bloke dressed in head-to-toe Ralph Lauren
You realise people donate designer clothes? I volunteer for a charity which passes clothes on to families who can’t afford them. At least 1/3 of what we get is good quality designer gear.

If you give to a beggar who has paid for a train ticket then is stating they haven’t any money for food??? It doesn’t add up.
You have 5 quid. You can stay where you are, get another 20 quid begging in the cold and wet sitting on the street. Or you can spend the 5 quid, go somewhere warm, with a captive audience and get twice the money. Of course it adds up.