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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that the UK police have no right to "check our thinking"?

233 replies

HawayMan · 27/01/2019 10:31

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6636383/Twitter-user-investigated-police-posting-poem-social-media-site.html

Yes, its a DM link; however, the Guardian and BBC don't seem to be covering this story yet...

From the article...

A Twitter user is planning to complain to the Home Secretary after police investigated him for retweeting a poem which suggested transgender women are still men.

Harry Miller is furious at his ‘Orwellian’ treatment by an officer who rang to check his ‘thinking’ after he had ‘liked’ a limerick

In better news, I'm planning on moving to Humberside. Clearly, there must be no actual crime there!

OP posts:
CatsPawsAndWhiskers · 27/01/2019 19:51

Would you like to answer my earlier query of in a world with finite resources should police deal with actual violent crime or hurt feelings or Twitter?

I did answer, if you look back.

Datun · 27/01/2019 19:51

I'd be willing to bet a lot of money that most of those responding have a certain view on transgender issues.

So what?

It's pretty obvious what their views are. That's the whole point.

He liked a bloody tweet.

Women are getting threatened, doxxed and persecuted. But that's not considered of any interest to the police.

That limerick talks about male privilege. You're watching in action. And you're bloody defending it.

Bluestitch · 27/01/2019 19:52

So yes I think it should be a police matter if the person it is aimed at feels it should be.

Well I think there ought to be an objective criteria for police involvement otherwise two people saying the same thing could have entirely different outcomes, not to mention the potential for malicious reports (that are already happening). What you describe sounds like a dystopian nightmare.

Bluestitch · 27/01/2019 19:54

Also the poem didn't target any named person, it targeted an ideology. The idea that any ideology is beyond criticism under the threat of police involvement is a really scary prospect.

CatsPawsAndWhiskers · 27/01/2019 20:00

Well I think there ought to be an objective criteria for police involvement otherwise two people saying the same thing could have entirely different outcomes, not to mention the potential for malicious reports (that are already happening). What you describe sounds like a dystopian nightmare.

I don't know enough about it to know how and if they ensure consistency. There absolutely needs to be consistency. The investigation would hopefully weed out malicious reports but I'm sure police officers deal with those often in investigations.

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 27/01/2019 20:06

I’d say threatening someone’s ‘thoughta’ Is pretty much a hate crime. Someone call the po..... oh hang on.

RCohle · 27/01/2019 20:09

You seem to have a lot of faith in the police to behave in a sensible fashion. If PC Gul is anything to go by, I'm not sure I do.

RepealTheGRA · 27/01/2019 20:18

I did answer, if you look back.

No you didn’t which everybody reading the thread can see.

catkind · 27/01/2019 20:32

It's not hate though is it? There's no hate involved. It's using humour to try to reassert truth. As PP said, we don't hate transwomen, we just think they're men. We don't say that to upset them either, we say it to assert our own position and sound out who agrees with us (most people it turns out) and get the message out to those who don't realise what's going on. If you wanted to offend trans people you wouldn't do it on twitter, given the massive block lists people use.

Not mad keen on the "poem" itself, bit weak on the rhymes and scanning and the punchline wasn't very punchy. There were some better assembled one on the Twitter police thread. But I'll stand up for anyone's right to retweet bad poetry.

Datun · 27/01/2019 20:34

Well exactly. Few people would go around claiming silicon breasts and an inverted penis don't make you a woman, unless they were being pressured to say they do.

CatsPawsAndWhiskers · 27/01/2019 21:01

*Would you like to answer my earlier query of in a world with finite resources should police deal with actual violent crime or hurt feelings or Twitter?

No you didn’t which everybody reading the thread can see

I did write a reply but I must not have posted.

You mean violent crime or hate incidents.(you seem to have called them hurt feelings. Wink)

I think as some violent crimes result from hate incidents or hate crimes then the police should devote an amount of time trying to prevent them escalating.

Also just because there are murders doesn't mean other incidents or crimes should be ignored totally so some time should be given to them.

Anniegetyourgun · 27/01/2019 21:15

So yes I think it should be a police matter if the person it is aimed at feels it should be.

Someone in my local town the other day was angry at getting a parking ticket as they said they hadn't left the car (on a double yellow line with stripes across the kerb and a sign about 2 metres away saying "no stopping at any time") for long enough. They declared it fraud, and threatened to call the police. Should their beliefs have been indulged? Or are they just barkin'?

RepealTheGRA · 27/01/2019 21:17

Stating biological facts that someone doesn’t like is definitely hurt feelings and not a ‘hate incident’.

But thank you for confirming that yes you do wish to take resources away from violent crime to deal with people thinking about inconvenient facts. It’s nice to be absolutely clear about the country you’d like us to live in.

I am encouraged by the responses on this thread, on twitter and in all the real life conversations I’ve had about this that thought control is not the way the vast majority of the public wants to go, so that gives me hope.

CatsPawsAndWhiskers · 27/01/2019 21:23

Anniegetyourgun

My comment that you quoted
So yes I think it should be a police matter if the person it is aimed at feels it should be.
was about hate incidents and hate crimes so isn't applicable to your example.

CatsPawsAndWhiskers · 27/01/2019 21:30

But thank you for confirming that yes you do wish to take resources away from violent crime to deal with people thinking about inconvenient facts. It’s nice to be absolutely clear about the country you’d like us to live in.

But how would hate crimes be identified if they were never looked into? That's why they investigate to decide if a crime has been committed.

In the original case that OP posted about, I stated that I didn't know if it was a hate crime or not. It's up to the police to decide. They clearly felt it was worth looking into, there may be more to it than we know about, there may not.

Bluestitch · 27/01/2019 21:35

Again, the police themselves said it wasn't a crime and they knew there was no crime when they contacted him. They contacted him to tell him to check his thinking and that sometimes girl brains grow in boy bodies in the womb. Do you think that is acceptable action from a police force? Do you also think that criticism of ideologies should be policed in this way, in the absence of a crime? I'm asking you because I've been following this story for days, hundreds of online comments, various interviews, real life conversations, and you are the only one I've come across who thinks this is ok.

Bluestitch · 27/01/2019 21:37

But how would hate crimes be identified if they were never looked into?

So when the poem was reported and the PC in question read it and saw no crime was committed he should have said to the complainant no law has been broken so there's nothing I can do. Why did he need to call Harry at all?

Anniegetyourgun · 27/01/2019 21:53

They thought it was a hate crime (as well as fraud) because the traffic warden had "targeted" them Hmm

CatsPawsAndWhiskers · 27/01/2019 21:56

The transgender debate is a hot topic atm so that's probably why they are being 'on' it. The police officer said 'I warned him that if it escalates, we will take further action.’ So I suppose they were just giving some advice to stop it possibly escalating. Its impossible to say without all the details which I'm sure we aren't being given.

CatsPawsAndWhiskers · 27/01/2019 22:33

Oh dear, I think I've just found Harry's Twitter. What a charmer.

It looks like he's probably been waiting for his 5 minutes of fame so I imagine he's quite pleased with this outcome.

FactsAreNotMean · 27/01/2019 23:30

I don't care if he's a complete and utter dickhead. Liking a poem, however badly written, is not worthy of police attention. Our police are hideously under-resourced and struggling to cope with actual measurably definitely real crimes.

Hurt fee-fees are not something they should be spending time talking to people about.

And collecting stats on "hate incidents" when the definition is so subjective and woolly that it could be walking around a hillside baa-ing is pointless. Especially when you have a particular group who are being encouraged to report every statement of fact which they are offended by.

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 27/01/2019 23:31

Like the police have nothing better to do.

Datun · 28/01/2019 00:41

It looks like he's probably been waiting for his 5 minutes of fame so I imagine he's quite pleased with this outcome.

A publicly funded police officer informed him, quite insanely, that he can't take the piss out of women's brains that grow a male body.

Being 'pleased' isn't quite the reaction I would imagine.

Horrified comes closer.

Patroclus · 28/01/2019 00:46

If you are planning to move here, never call it Humberside unless you're heavily armed.

MouseUtopia · 28/01/2019 01:43

'Freedom is the ability to say 2 + 2 = 4'

'In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act'

George Orwell

When people start objecting to legalised paedophilia how many will be silenced by fear?

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