To think that the UK police have no right to "check our thinking"?

[HawayMan]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6636383/Twitter-user-investigated-police-posting-poem-social-media-site.html

Yes, its a DM link; however, the Guardian and BBC don't seem to be covering this story yet...

From the article...

A Twitter user is planning to complain to the Home Secretary after police investigated him for retweeting a poem which suggested transgender women are still men.

Harry Miller is furious at his ‘Orwellian’ treatment by an officer who rang to check his ‘thinking’ after he had ‘liked’ a limerick

In better news, I'm planning on moving to Humberside. Clearly, there must be no actual crime there!

@CatsPawsAndWhiskers

Everyone has the absolute right to say whatever they want, to use the words they deem appropriate to them. You can’t physically harm someone, or advise someone else to enact physical harm upon anyone, but we each have the inalienable right to speak as we see fit. Others have the choice whether to listen and take notice- or not. It’s up to the individual.

The police are there to prevent physical harm to people and property. I’d rather they spent their time and resources talking the endless stabbings and moped crime in London, as opposed to investigating whether someone like Boris Johnson has committed hate crimes by silly comments in a newspaper column.

If there is no crime then the definition of a hate incident is highly subjective.

There's lots of info if you google on what types of things can be a hate incident.

I find it hateful that men with penises say they are women (sex is a protected characteristic after all). Should the police be contacting people on twitter who offend me in this way

They are talking about themselves in the circumstances you describe not about others, so no.

Well it's done wonders for police relations with the public anyway.

mobile.twitter.com/Humberbeat/status/1088796896511037441

You can’t physically harm someone, or advise someone else to enact physical harm upon anyone, but we each have the inalienable right to speak as we see fit. Others have the choice whether to listen and take notice- or not. It’s up to the individual.

That's not true. Hate crimes don't have to be physical, they can be verbal abuse, bullying, harassment etc.

We don't live in a police state. The police rely on a collaborative relationship with the public, so that they will report crimes, give information etc. Turning themselves into an untrustworthy laughing stock helps nobody. Look at the twitter feed I linked. Nobody is co-operating with their enquiries, they are all mocking them.

catspaws So everyone who is over 50 is mature and sensible? Everyone who runs a business is mature and sensible? Every police officer is?

Those I know who are over 50 (and that is my age group) are mature and sensible. If the gentleman wasn't sensible presumably he wouldn't have a business to run. If police officers aren't mature and sensible, then they have no business being police officers.

If you can't see that being contacted by the police 'to check your thinking' is perhaps an encroachment of your freedoms, then perhaps in MN parlance, you need to give your head a wobble.

If the gentleman wasn't sensible presumably he wouldn't have a business to run

I know plenty of people who run businesses but have extreme views on things and aren't careful where they air those views. I wouldn't say they are mature and sensible.

If you can't see that being contacted by the police 'to check your thinking' is perhaps an encroachment of your freedoms, then perhaps in MN parlance, you need to give your head a wobble.

If they think it's a 'hate incident', it should be investigated.

Look at the twitter feed I linked. Nobody is co-operating with their enquiries, they are all mocking them.

You surely don't think this is an unbiased group of people who are responding to it, do you? I'd be willing to bet a lot of money that most of those responding have a certain view on transgender issues.

I've seen several local people questioning this, including a man who has been waiting 3 years for the next available unit after reporting a robbery in progress. The local papers all have people who are unhappy with the crime rates, this incident and the response of both the force and the PCC.

I defend people's right to say things that offend me, providing they aren't threats or an actual hate crime

• which the police admitted this wasn't

I would defend anyone's right to free speech - left, right or centre, religious or atheist

I would defend a man's right to tweet that he is a woman, without the police knocking on his door
Even though he would be telling a lie.
It's not a crime to lie, or to offend RadFems

It is certainly not a crime to state biological facts

A Transwoman is not a woman
There is no way to swap chromosones

By definition, women & girls are homogametic, i.e. with two of the same kind of sex chromosomes, XX,
whereas boys & men are heterogametic, i.e. with both X and Y chromosomes, typically XY but very occasionally XYY or XXY

(For birds, some reptiles & insects, the females are heterogametic with Z and W chromosones; however, this is not the case for mammals)

Bluestitch

There will always be people that are unhappy with the service they receive from the Police. Things get missed, mistakes are made. It not right but they do happen in all large organisations.

CatsPaws did you answer if you think I should be visited by the police if I say that God doesn't exist and religious people are stupid, if a Christian complained? I may have missed it.

And actually the poem was arguing about male privilege so they are policing feminist beliefs. Is this okay with you?

catspaw It's not a 'hate incident' though is it? Men who wish to be women don't have female hormones, chromosomes, breasts and neither do they have vaginas. A woman, is (as it says on the T shirt), an adult human female. Transwomen are not, and never can be, that. How is a statement of fact a hate incident?

*And actually the poem was arguing about male privilege so they are policing feminist beliefs. Is this okay with you

They 'investigated' what they thought could be a hate incident. I don't think the poem was the best way of highlighting the topics you mention and I think it's people with anti trans beliefs pretending it's not.

CatsPaws did you answer if you think I should be visited by the police if I say that God doesn't exist and religious people are stupid, if a Christian complained?

I think it's fine to say you do not think God exists. I don't think you should call religious people stupid. You would have to check with the police as to what their take would be on this. It's difficult for me to comment as I tend to brush other people's comments off. That's easy for me though as personally I don't care much for others opinion of me.

scaryteacher

I'm not going to get into a debate about what makes someone a woman. I've seen enough on here to know they never go well. I'm not going to change my views and I'm sure you won't either.

So how is it people waving extremist banners outside 10 Downing Street or ar repatriation ceremonies aren’t paid a visit by the PCs and their horses?

I don't think you should call religious people stupid

I don't either and it's not something I would ever do. The point is if I did should it be a police matter?

I don't either and it's not something I would ever do. The point is if I did should it be a police matter?

I've answered this. You would have to check with the police if it would officially come under 'hate incident'.

But the question wasn't would it be a hate crime, it was should it be. Consulting the police won't get you the answer to that.

Do YOU think it should be a police matter?

So, I should check with the police about my opinions in case they hurt someone's feelings and I am accused of a hate incident? I'm an atheist, I'll just sew my mouth shut, it'll be easier.

But the question wasn't would it be a hate crime, it was should it be. Consulting the police won't get you the answer to that.

Do YOU think it should be a police matter

I personally wouldn't be offended and call the police over something like that. But is it really ok to say someone is stupid because of their religion which is just as bad as saying someone is stupid because of their race. So yes I think it should be a police matter if the person it is aimed at feels it should be.

Wow. So to confirm Cats you think 1984 is a utopia we should all be aiming for?

Would you like to answer my earlier query of in a world with finite resources should police deal with actual violent crime or hurt feelings or Twitter?

What if I didn't say stupid? What if I said something more polite but inferred it? Like, what if I said, athiesm is the logical outcome of the rational mind?

Is that a hate incident?