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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think NHS gp's should work like NHS dentists

182 replies

Gaballout · 25/01/2019 15:19

It's so hard to get an appointment. Why don't GPS run like the NHS dentist to stop time wasters and people not showing up.

So charge people a small amount for an appointment and if you're poor you don't pay (just like NHS dentists).

The NHS is under funded and tax rises they just won't bring in. This could bring in millions a year and there's no outcry about NHS dentist costs.

OP posts:
Badbadbunny · 26/01/2019 14:49

Lots of medical/health areas are mostly financed by the NHS, but are private businesses, such as pharmacies, opticians, dentists, etc,, where the NHS pays for certain things, and the patient/customer pays for others. Absolutely no reason why that model can't be extended to other areas. Eg., Specsavers are now into NHS hearing aids and give a far superior service to the local hospital audiology dept. Perhaps it's time to move GP surgeries onto that same model and make it easier to change GP surgeries if you get crap service - that would soon make them improve if there was proper competition.

BlueJustice · 26/01/2019 15:03

Yeah, great idea.

Then I would probably die on top of having only three top teeth, five bottom ones, three random rotting stumps and a third set of false teeth that cost me over two hundred pounds and still don't fit in my mouth at all. That's on top of previously being charged over £200 for only a top set of partials although I needed bottom ones too. That's after being charged a full whack for one false front tooth on a scrap of denture when I needed a full top and bottom set of partials. We have scrimped and saved three times for absolutely nothing and I barely leave the house anymore. My DH won't put himself first and has to keep supergluing a broken top set of false teeth so his work mates don't stare. His bottom teeth are all rotting jagged stumps despite brushing his teeth religiously all his life. He hasn't been near a dentist since before 2000.

So yes, great idea to model GP services on dentist ones, at least if I was dead I wouldn't have to tolerate toothache for a change.

I fucking disgust myself, there are no mirrors on my walls. Thinking about it this should please the OPs because I actually won't go to the doctors until I percieve it to be life or death now because I can't afford any more NHS dentistry at the moment.

We get nothing in benefits because DH is just above minimum wage.

Gaballout · 26/01/2019 15:19

Thinking about it this should please the OPs because I actually won't go to the doctors until I percieve it to be life or death now because I can't afford any more NHS dentistry at the moment.

What a ridiculous and nasty comment to make about me!

Doctors don't charge so your post doesn't even make any sense.

I'm sorry about the state of your teeth, but ultimately was it all due to the nhs? Have you checked if you're entitled to free dentil if your finances are that bad?

OP posts:
Ucangourownwoo · 26/01/2019 15:29

Have you checked if you're entitled to free dentil if your finances are that bad?

Even with the subsidies nhs dental treatment for those above the threshold is hefty. 20 quid for a check up and scale isn't much but when you factor in bridges, false teeth etc it mounts up.

Bluelady · 26/01/2019 15:31

@racecar, I've paid 12% of my income in national insurance contributions for 47 years - and that's on top of my income tax - how is my NHS treatment free?

BlueJustice · 26/01/2019 16:42

What a ridiculous and nasty comment to make about me!

It's not personally about you, it's in reference for your apparent desired funding model of GP services, i.e charging for appointments and the goal of saying that must surely be to stop people going in their current numbers. It's only about you in the sense you are advocating a plan that would stop me, mine and a heck of a lot of people I know getting medical help from a GP, one hundred percent. We have no money left after bills for food some weeks, where do you think we'd find the charge from.

I have also applied for help with health care costs (can't remember what the form was called), not entitled to a single penny, like a hell of a lot of people just above the margin. Even subsidised NHS dental fees are to steep for a lot of people. At that point dental care becomes a luxury, a saved up for treat.

I'm sorry you took my comment more personally than it was actually intended but you wanting to put GP care into the the same category as dental care (i.e unaffordable to me) feels like a personal attack to my health and may have made upset enough to speak more harshly than I usually would.

starryeyed19 · 26/01/2019 16:48

The only time I have ever had a free dentist visit is when I was pregnant. Adults pay for dental treatment regardless of earnings, don't they?

Greyhound22 · 26/01/2019 17:18

Why should I have to be penalised for being unwell? I'm currently at the doctor 2/3 a week most weeks.

Like another poster said I miss all the cut offs for receiving help but I don't earn enough for it not to have an impact on my family.

I pay my NI and have done all my life so I'm not sure why I should be charged twice?

Ucangourownwoo · 26/01/2019 17:21

Adults pay for dental treatment regardless of earnings, don't they?

Its free for people on certain benefits.

NameChangeNugget · 26/01/2019 17:26

Good point & I mostly agree OP

HelenaDove · 26/01/2019 17:33

www.essexlive.news/patients-inadequate-braintree-gp-surgery-2438890?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=sharebar&fbclid=IwAR3QjpxqCwHznj3VmXNFSOsp8YyrJ-lS9S7w_pOSLWOEgXwMjLI8MnOkx4A

Patients at a GP practice dubbed 'one of the worst in Essex' have come forward to tell their horror stories.

Church Lane Surgery in Braintree was rated 'inadequate' by the Care Quality Commission (CQC) in August 2018, a rating many residents considered more than fair based on their experiences.

A review last month suggested improvements are now being made, however some patients feel a lot more needs to be done.
'I was told I had a migraine - but it was meningitis'

When Bryony Collett, 22, went to her GP with a headache she did not expect to almost lose her life days later.

In September 2017, the Braintree resident claims she was told that she had a migraine and just needed to take some tablets when she visited Church Lane surgery.

She explained: "I called the surgery at 8am and it took me 115 times to get through.

"When I did get through, I got an early appointment and saw the doctor who told me I had a migraine.

"They gave me some tablets and said if it was no better after the tablets I had to call them back.

"The tablets didn’t work so I called back the same day and they said call back tomorrow if I wasn't any better, but instead I called 999 and they got to me in minutes."

After being told less than 24 hours before that it was just a headache, Bryony found herself being rushed to hospital.

She was taken to the major emergency department where after some tests, things got very serious.

I had all sorts of drips put into me," Bryony said.

"I got taken to a CT scan where I went into cardiac arrest.

"I was rushed to intensive care where they found out I had meningitis.

"The doctors told my mum they didn’t know if I would be okay, but luckily I was so I was only in intensive care for 24 hours."

'My physical disabilities make it difficult to stand for extended periods'

Sharon Corrigan Wells, a mother-of-four from Braintree, has been a patient at Church Lane Surgery for 13 years.

She suffers from fibromyalgia, a condition that causes widespread pain throughout her entire body.

"I have had many experiences with this surgery over the years and they used to be the best surgery in Braintree," she explained.

"But over the past five or six years it has declined in its ability to care for and 'doctor' their patients in a sufficient, caring and dignified manner.

"In my opinion the rating of 'inadequate' is spot on. Myself and my children have gone without much needed medical attention due to the ongoing issues.

"I called the surgery at 8am as instructed by them to make an appointment only to be on hold for 30 plus minutes just to be told there are no appointments available.

"I have explained that after continuous days of going through this regime that it is impossible to get a much needed appointment

Sharon claims that the receptionists then told her the only way to make an appointment other than ringing is to go and wait in the queue at 7.30am.

She continued: "Whilst I can appreciate this may be suitable for some it is nearly impossible for me. I am a physically disabled mother who also has three children still living at home.

"You can imagine the great difficulty I would have getting my children ready to go to the surgery and wait in the freezing cold with disabilities which prevent me from standing for extended periods.

"There is a serious crisis at this surgery that needs to be thoroughly investigated as people are being put into dangerous situations with their health with no recourse to health care other than adding additional strain to the A&E departments at local hospitals."
'My young son's yearly jabs have been cancelled - three times'

Jessica Loren, from Braintree, has also had problems with the surgery regarding her young child's health.

The 33-year-old claims she has numerous complaints about the service, including her son having his yearly jabs cancelled on three occasions.

She said: "My son has had his yearly jabs cancelled three times; he's now 19-months-old and he still hasn't had them. He was poorly with croup and a doctor said he was fine

He had a high temperature but the doctor instead commented on how my son had a bruise on his head from falling over. He was only 14 months and it made me feel as if I had hurt him.

"I've suffered with anxiety since having him and I was worried in case they thought I was being dramatic, then to mention his bruises made me feel worse

"He was still coughing after four weeks and I was told to seek a doctor's advice, so I was annoyed by that. It could have been worse because it was a cough that was lasting longer than it should."

And Jessica's concerns with the surgery don't end there.

"My appointment was cancelled on another occasion because I was late although I'd been in the queue waiting as the check-in machine was out of action," she claimed.

"Sometimes doctors don't turn up, the receptionist just says a doctor hasn't arrived so they need to find out where they are and with no apology.

"I am also concerned by the fact that you are constantly on hold when trying to make an appointment, then when you get through there are no appointments, even for a regular blood test which I have to have.

I was misdiagnosed and given tablets that I was allergic to'

For Jasmine Sheridan, 28, treatment at Church Lane Surgery was too much to bear and she was forced to move to another practice.

In 2018 she was diagnosed with a chest infection, only for another doctor to tell her it was something completely different the following day.

The Braintree resident explained: "I was told I had a chest infection, even though the doctor only took my blood pressure. I was then prescribed antibiotics I’m allergic to.

"I had explained my symptoms of a really bad sore throat, ear ache and the change in the sound of voice I could hear.

"I had said I wasn’t coughing, just that I had a slight temperature, so they took my blood pressure and printed off the prescription.

"The doctor didn't say more than two words to me."

After taking the medication when she got home, Jessica started vomiting and has since claimed she was allergic to the antibiotics.

"I got home and thought that’s not okay," she continued.

"I asked for another appointment which was difficult to get and I requested I see someone else.

"I attended the next day to find I was booked in with the same doctor so I spoke to reception who were very quick to speak to another doctor to see if I could be seen and that was fine.

"She simply examined me properly and asked a series of questions and said your chest is clear.

"I actually had an inflamed trachea and all I could do was rest and drink plenty of fluids.

"It did clear up after around ten days which is what the second doctor said. She also told me that the antibiotics I was prescribed by the first doctor wouldn’t have worked anyway.

"We trust these people with our lives, quite literally. I'm so glad I moved surgeries.

Earlier this month, the surgery was told it had made improvements following its latest inspection.

It had previously been issued with a warning notice to ensure that improvements were made to the level of service provided by Virgin Health Care, who are in charge of the practice.

In response, bosses were happy to see that improvements had been recognised and say they are now setting their sights on achieving a 'good' CQC rating.

Chris Pearson, Virgin Care's Head of Primary Care, said: "We are pleased that the inspectors have acknowledged the improvements that have already been made by our hard working colleagues.

"We recognise there is still work to do to reach the standard we want for the practice and for our patients and we are committed to implementing our long-term improvement plan.

"We are determined to gain at least a 'good' rating for Church Lane Surgery or even, in time, 'outstanding'

While we cannot comment on individual cases, we would encourage people to contact us directly so that we can work with them to get the help they need from the service.

“The first CQC inspection was in August last year and the CQC has acknowledged that just four months later it had found a range of improvements.”

Xenia · 27/01/2019 08:19

You can counter that with lots of good GP practicers.Ours is open 365 days a year and is very good, lots of doctors, new premises etc (I have only had to go once in 12 years as luckily am never ill )

On dentists BlueJustice's teeth issues sounds horrible. When my mother was in her local hospital on a ward of other elderly women everyone except my mother had false teeth. In fact the nurse at bed time came round and insisted my mother take her teeth out - it was funny how my mother described i t - givvus your teeth love.... and she had to explained she had all her own. These women grew up before the NHS although my mother thought the absence of sugar and sweets in WWII did help and she never had sweets or caked or puddings ever . Also her cousin was a dentist so she was veyr hot on regular NHS check ups which I have alaways been for me and our children. Even then of course with no sugar and regular check ups people can need treatment. We are lucky around here thatthere are NHS dentists (one advantage of living in an area where a lot of parents want to push their children into being doctors and dentists I suspect - we probably have a glut).

hazeyjane · 27/01/2019 08:37

The gp practice HelenaDove linked to is run by Virgincare - I fear that the more services contracted out to Virgincare, the higher the likelihood of heading down a path of privatizing areas of the NHS (or charging 'minimal amounts). The Virgincare services in this area (not gp practices....yet) have been appalling.

JustAnotherPoster00 · 27/01/2019 11:42

There should be a charge for appointments.

NHS can no longer afford to be a fully free service. When it was founded in 1948, the health profile of the country was very different plus individuals are living longer.

Something needs to change with the NHS, and don't say tax Amazon more

This shit always gets trotted out on NHS threads, the current underfunding of the NHS is a political choice

No money for the NHS but our government can afford to pay the DUP £1 billion to keep themselves in power

No money for the NHS but we can afford to cut corporation tax to the multinationals that make billions in profit from our country every year

No money for the NHS even though our MP's and HOL members who could all afford to pay their way on the salary and wealth they have, get to have all their expenses paid

Yeah sure we cant afford the NHS Hmm

Badbadbunny · 27/01/2019 11:52

No money for the NHS

Labour trebled the NHS funding in their 13 years of office. How on Earth can you say "no money"??? They've had money thrown at it but without reform it's just a massive money pit.

MaisyPops · 27/01/2019 11:55

And so it begins, the thin end of the wedge people convincing people that free access to healthcare at the point of use should be eroded.

Bluelady · 27/01/2019 12:59

Labour increased the money going into the NHS and the Tories have spent the last nine years reversing that. Increases have been below inflation under this and the previous governments.

Badbadbunny · 27/01/2019 13:01

Increases have been below inflation under this and the previous governments

Maybe, but even today's spending is massively more than when Labour came to power, adjusted for inflation etc. Just where has those extra tens of billions PER YEAR gone??

Bluelady · 27/01/2019 13:54

Initially those millions went into reducing waiting times. Now, of course, they've gone up to the extent that Labour's targets have been scrapped because performance against them is so woeful. Thousands of hip and knee replacements and cataract ops that were done within 18 weeks ten years ago now have waits of over a year, leaving people in pain and with vision defects that constrain their lives. We also have a growing ageing population and massive increase in chronic conditions such as diabetes.

hazeyjane · 27/01/2019 16:13

Well, upwards of a billion (it is difficult to get exact fugures, but the Bath and NE Somerset contract is worth £700million, Surrey's contract was worth £450million) has gone to Virgincare to run 400+ services for the NHS....I am not sure if that is to actually run them or run them into the ground.

Tooldemont · 30/01/2019 09:17

Labour increased the money going into the NHS and the Tories have spent the last nine years reversing that.

Hmm
Fabaunt · 30/01/2019 09:28

I lived in Ireland for two years and the cost of each dr appointment was €60 or €100 if I needed to attend a&e

This is on top of paying social insurance and universal social charge

GreenTulips · 30/01/2019 09:38

I was reading about the amount of appointments people need to make that aren’t health related as such

For example requesting letters for housing or holiday insurance - things that other companies insist on for their records

All wasting doctors time

TheBigBangRocks · 30/01/2019 09:42

I think there should be a fee too, would stop the time wasters and ensure people were only going as a necessity. I'd also scrap free prescriptions. People will buy otc more then and stil wasting medication if they have to pay for it.

Yes lots pay NI but lots don't as well. Most people aren't net tax payers so won't cover their own costs so a top up service is easily justifiable.

Bluelady · 30/01/2019 10:15

So people who are too poor to pay tax should pay for their health care? Very logical.

Why the silly face @Tooldemont?