AIBU to ask if school can go through my son's phone?

[ejk10]

This hasn't happened to my son yet -but he thinks it might, and happened to some of his friends today.

Apparently a child has made a statement which the school is investigating (none of the boys have been told what the complaint is) and a teacher demanded to look through this boy's phone and deleted some information. My son has not been questioned but is friends with those who have been and is wondering if the school would ask to look at his phone.

I'm not sure of the legalities of this. Part of me thinks if he has nothing wrong why worry if they look - another part of me thinks it is a huge invasion of privacy. My son assures me he has done nothing wrong - regardless of whether he has or not I'm questioning if they have the right to look through private data.

Can anyone shed any light?

Can the boy work out what was offensive based on what was deleted? Your son will know what to delete or screenshot and email himself

I'd tell him to leave his phone at home for a few days.

I do find this odd.

If a child was being bullied or there was a safeguarding issue, of course you would want to comply.

Surely you wouldn't mind if your child's phone was searched. I think I'd prefer to be there when they did this?

But also, Surely teachers can't just scroll through a child's phone and delete stuff. Surely that gives any teacher too much power? That bit doesn't seem right. Why would they delete anything anyway? The fact its there is surely evidence.

I just don't get it.

“Hahahaha WhatsApp isn't fully encrypted.

If necessary if can be broken into.“

faq.whatsapp.com/en/android/28030015/

“Surely teachers can't just scroll through a child's phone and delete stuff. Surely that gives any teacher too much power? “

Indeed. To late for naughty teacher though. It’s in the cloud.

“Witchend

If he's bothered about teachers looking, and you are trying to make sure they can't that says pure and simple to me that he's got something to hide and you know it.”

And what is he has? We all have “something to hide”.

They may only search where the phone is prohibited by the school rules or where they reasonably suspect it has been, or is likely to be, used to commit an offence.

If your school allows mobile phones on the premises that is pretty narrow. Even then they can only search it if you volunteer a the pin code. They can't compel you to provide it.

My DC are permitted to have phones/iPads on site and I wouldn't be happy with a teacher going through my DCs phone without consent. They might be children but they're entitled to privacy and if the teachers have reasonable grounds for believing that the phone has or will be used to commit an offence then they should be calling me and the police.

StreetwiseHercules

Indeed. To late for naughty teacher though. It’s in the cloud.

to late for the bullied child, kits in the cloud.
to late for the sexually harassed child its in the cloud.

etc.etc. etc.

Yeah teachers have sooooo much time to sit and scroll through 13 year olds phones.

Birdie no schools don’t have to ask for your consent or presence.

I ve had this experience with my DS. He was asked to hand his phone over to his head of year in order for him to check the camera contents. He had two saved images of teaching staff from social media that had been messaged to him. Clearly this was inappropriate. The sender of these messages had told staff who he had shared them with. They had been posted on social media with derogatory captions which my DS had known about. The head of year then deleted the whole camera roll, hundreds of images. We supported the school in their intervention but I did feel deleting all of his pictures was inappropriate. We met with the head of year to discuss this. They said DS gave his consent. I have told DS to request our presence at school should anything like it ever occur again. I'd be very surprised if it did, he learnt a harsh lesson but I did feel the school over stepped the mark.

“to late for the bullied child, kits in the cloud.
to late for the sexually harassed child its in the cloud. ”

What point did you think you were making there?

“They said DS gave his consent. I have told DS to request our presence at school should anything like it ever occur again. I'd be very surprised if it did, he learnt a harsh lesson but I did feel the school over stepped the mark.”

They would wish they had never bothered if they did this with my child, particularly if the pictures were not backed up or recoverable.

Schools cannot demand that phones be unlocked. The police can try but they would be on very shaky ground legally

Police need a warrant to search a locked phone without consent.

We all have “something to hide”

Which is why children need to give parents unrestricted access to tech and why schools (in loco parentis) may need to check phones if there is a safeguarding risk, particularly.

Children are not equipped to deal with some of the utter shite in the world - encouraging a climate of openness around technology helps protect them from that.

Nope. WhatsApp is encrypted in transit.

Doesn't mean it's not accessible by security services if necessary.

Blimey it's owned by Facebook. We should all know by now what they are like.

Cauliflowersqueeze I didn't say they did.

I pointed out that if your school permits electronic devices onsite then there are extremely limited grounds on which teachers may search them:

• If an offence has been committed
• if an offence is likely to be committed.

Anything else would be wholly unacceptable from a legal perspective.

If there is an indecent picture of a minor (anyone under 18, not 16 which is the age of consent) then the bill payer (you?) could be charged with the possession of indecent images...

StreetwiseHercules

The point is that if we take your approach we might as well not do anything.

The right of your child usurps the right of the child that is being abused and bullied.

Schools need to think very carefully before deleting material that might be evidence needed at a later stage.

My DS was once the victim of an attack that was filmed by a charmless friend of the attacker. The school dealt with the whole thing really badly, and when I complained they said if I wanted to take it further I could go to the police. When I asked if I could have a copy of the recording for that purpose, the idiots told me they'd deleted it. I wasn't impressed.

They would wish they never bothered
?

Birdie - that’s not the legal guidance we have been given. It’s not solely about offences or potential offences. It’s anything which the school deems unacceptable to the smooth running of the school.

Have a look:

www.gov.uk/government/publications/searching-screening-and-confiscation

Schools have different powers than other institutions.

“Nope. WhatsApp is encrypted in transit.

Doesn't mean it's not accessible by security services if necessary. ”

How come the security services are constantly badgering WhatsApp and Facebook to allow them access then?

Yes schools absolutely have this right. More rights that the police in these cases. Refusal to cooperate would leave to permanent exclusion

They said DS gave his consent
Hes a child how could he give consent

His consent does not need to be sought.