To ask those who grew up in London if they think they had a good childhood

[wolive]

We are having the usual debate about whether to move out of London now that we have two young DC - for more space, fresh air etc. We love our part of London, but DH and I both grew up in small villages with plenty of space and freedom and I always imagined the same kind of childhood for my kids. I worry about them growing up too quickly.

If you grew up in London (or another big city), do you think you missed out as city kids? And would you raise your own kids in a city or did you escape to the countryside?

I grew up, and raised my kids, in a town with a half hour fast train connection to London. (Dh works in London).

Best of both worlds in my opinion - fresh air, walks in the countryside, cycling, with everything in London really accessible when you want it.

Plus I never have to worry when the kids are out at 9/10pm as there is zero violent crime here (just the occasional burglary).

Yes! I’m not raising my kids in the countryside and it feels like there is nothing to do.
London is so full of activities, parks, museums etc. The only thing I’ve found is better is typically all the kids friends live very close by, growing up my mates were often quite a ways away within the city.

I’m NOW raising my kids, not ‘not raising’

I grew up in London and absolutely loved it. I can see the advantages and disadvantages on both sides but I can’t think what I ‘missed out’ on and depending on circumstances I’d happily raise my hypothetical DCs here!

I can see the advantages of growing up in the country, but I was brought up in inner London and had a great childhood.

There was so much to do...so many parks, leisure centres, facilities, museums, things going on. It was hard to be bored!

I think when London really comes into its own is for teens. Despite the terrible press London gets re l: violent crime, it’s a pretty safe city and it’s fantastic to be able to travel cheaply and access all that the city has to offer once you’re a teenager.

Grew up in London (zone 3) and raising my child here now- love it!
The idea of London being the big smog with no outside space or greenery is just not the reality- grew up next to a large park, we always went on bike rides as children, visited farms, drove 15mins to kent to go fruit picking. I would hate to raise a child in a small village with nothing much to do: 1 leisure centre, 1 shopping centre, the same faces day in day out.
I also think those that grow up in a major city are more confident and shrewd.

grew up here, raisiing children here - it is so much better even than my day. So many opportunities. Would never leave.

I grew up in west London and had a great childhood .
Had lots of friends , was nice to play out till it got dark , didn’t worry about safety too much but if I’m honest our childhood and present children’s childhoods are not comparable.
It’s different now and I wouldn’t let my dd play out until it’s dark if we still lived in London

I think there are pros and cons to both. There are plenty of things to do in either setting if you have the right imagination! However saying there is so much to do in london - are all these kids really visiting museums and galleries every weekend?

I grew up in London and raising my child in another big city. Think it was an excellent place to grow up, mix of cultures, loads to do. Especially good for older kids and teens. I love the countryside too and chose the city I’m in now because it has the best of both

I grew up in London and I would say no: too much crime, feeling unsafe, sexual harrassment.

I still live in London and worry about my children here. It's especially bad for teenagers with the gangs, shootings, stabbing, sexual exploitation of girls by gangs.

Only Fools . You sound like you were in my area growing up

South East London per chance ?

I loved my London childhood for the reasons others have already posted.

Bear in mind that people who grew up in the city won't know any differently so they won't be able to make any comparisons with people who grew up outside the city.

There are advantages and disadvantages to both. Much more access to entertainment and activities in the city but statistically much more violent crime. Also, the closer to the centre and all the activities you are, the less likely you are to have your own outdoor space (unless you are super rich!). Public transport is excellent in London though.

Outside the city, the leisure opportunities are more limited - although plenty of small cities and large towns have their own museums/theatres etc. Crime is likely to be comparatively less, but not non-existent. There are so many variables depending on whereabouts you live.

I live in a small market town 20 miles outside London. It has advantages and disadvantages - I know most of the other people in town with kids the same age as mine, at least by sight. This can be a good or bad thing! We have forest on our doorstep for walks, it's peaceful at night and most importantly for us we can afford a house with a big garden, so in the spring/summer the kids come home from school and go straight out there while I can get on with dinner etc. However, there are no big shops or shopping centres - we have to travel for those. There is no theatre or cinema, the nearest ones are a 15 minute drive away. The local museums are not at all exciting, although we can get to the London ones within 45 minutes or so. I do worry about what my kids will do for entertainment when they are teens, as we don't live within walking distance of the station and public transport is not great. It suits us overall though, and I certainly wouldn't want to live in London as I don't personally like the crowds and noise. The air pollution would worry me a bit too.

It just depends what is important to you as a family.

Forgot to add, one big difference I notice as soon as we get a few tube stops down the line, is the multi-culturalism. My small town is still very white, although this is changing gradually with time.

WhentheRabbitsWentWild :) yep SE London! Absolutely loved it, probably why Ive never ventured too far from where i grew up.

Growing up in Inner London in the '60s and '70s was great: so many bomb sites to play on. Life was never dull. Kids could really make their own adventures and give free rein to their imaginations.

My children grew up in an Outer London suburb and have appreciated all the opportunities they have had: excellent transport; quality clubs and organisations which have allowed them to develop their talents. It has suited all of us very well.

I grew up in the suburbs of London and am raising my DC in inner city London.

There wasn't much to do in the burbs, but as a parent I have loved bringing DD up in London - there is so much to do here, and most of it free and within easy reach. So often on MN I have read about mums struggling at home with babies and toddlers and virtually always it transpires they are living somewhere with very few activities and amenities and shit public transport. I had undiagnosed PND and was so fucking anxious all the time, but the one thing that saved me was that there was always something to do and somewhere to go - even just sitting on a bus helped.

My only concern really, and it's a big one, is the pollution - every school in our borough fails on this score (as in all the schools, well, primary at any rate, have illegal (or whatever it is) levels of pollution). The traffic has certainly got worse. DD has atrocious hay fever (London's plane trees are the worst) and we do think about moving to the sea (or a moor!) a lot.

But I worry if we move out that everything else will be worse.

I grew up in Edmonton which was fine back in the 60s and 70s. Then moved south of the river in my 20s.
Im now in an unfashionable area of Herts on the borders of London and my dc have loved growing up here. Lea Valley for walks and watersports in walking distance and now they are older West End in less than hour door to door .
I would never pay London prices for a home, not worth it.

I can see the pros and cons but I grew up in London and loved it! We were in zone 3 so not in an area full of tourists or banks - it was suburbia really so plenty of parks and space for when we were young but so easy to get around, lots of shops and restaurants etc.

From age 11 I had so much independence and confidence. I really don’t understand how teens cope in the countryside! Nothing to do and no way of getting around apart from lifts from parents. I used to get the tube everywhere so from year 7 onwards my parents never had to do lifts and I could get a short bus or walk to cinema and local shops.

Sadly I don’t think I’ll be able to afford to stay when I have kids but I won’t be moving far - probably to a large commuter town.

I grew up in zone 5 - proper suburbia. As children that was quite good as it meant an easy 15 mins on the train into the centre of town for the museums, events etc. but also 15 mins drive into beautiful countryside for walks, farms, horse riding, pub lunches. We also had a few good local shopping centres and leisure centres. My parents were brilliant at taking us to places at weekends.

As a teen, I loved central London - I went out a lot and either stayed with friends who lived more centrally or got the awful night bus home that took nearly 1.5 hours... Then I wished I lived a few zones in and suburbia felt very dull!

I think London has changed though and I wouldn’t bring kids up there now. It’s so expensive, the suburbs have expanded so that lovely countryside I grew up visiting is now a mass of housing estates, and I’ve learnt that there are other cities that have plenty of perks that London doesn’t!
I love visiting London, and still have family there, but wouldn’t move back. My DN’s are in central London, and I don’t think they have a great childhood.

Grew up in Zone 1. Loved it and found when I got to university I was leaps and bounds more mature, sensible and street wise than a lot of people who weren’t brought up in cities.

Raising my 4 now in zone 2 and I don’t see us ever leaving. We’re next to a huge park, all their friends live ten minutes walk max. There is so so much to do just within our area. Packs of community, clubs, interesting places to eat and cool stuff going on.

That said, I do worry about when they are teenagers. I personally think it will be a more interesting place to be and they will be positively impacted in the long term. But in the immediate I do worry about them. Especially as one of them is v sensitive and different.

I think London then and London now are no longer comparable anyway. I am raising mine in London zone 2 and it feels like a village sometimes. But a very diverse one. Definitely know my neighbours, all the local shopkeepers know us, and always familiar faces from school around (even though we have about 6 primary schools within 10 mins walk from us.). And yes, we actually do go to museums. And always go to Kids Week theatre. And have 3 parks around us. On the negative, I do worry about acid attacks, gang violence and kids growing up faster on the one hand and more sheltered on the other hand than we did.

It’s so difficult for anyone to get on the ladder though. I’m guessing if your roots are in London and your family is around for childcare it must be easier to remain? They couples I know that have managed all lived with their parents until they were nearly 30 and managed to save a grand a month. It makes a massive difference. My best friend is having to move back to Scotland after her baby is born as, being nurses, they haven’t a hope in hell of buying somewhere or paying rent for a family home.

No I didn’t and I think it’s probably worse now. Even at state schools there is huge disparity between haves and have nots in London and people are incredibly conscious of wealth, status, lifestyle and display of these. There’s huge pressure to keep up with the latest fads and trends, and being in London there were many, many of these and they changed fast. People have I was certainly not at the bottom of that pile, I was well into the top half, but kids very much kicked down and there was a lot of snobbery from kids and parents. The disparities have grown hugely since then.

House prices usually mean two incomes and even people with reasonably well paid jobs can be living out in zones 5 & 6 with long commutes on unreliable services which limit time with family in the week a lot. And yes, there are lovely places to go, but if you’ve been commuting all week frequently the last thing you want to do is get back on trains and fight through crowds so you just end up going to park and softplay or local museums and events which aren’t much different outside London.

Plus it is extremely expensive and unless their parents are well off it is limiting, particularly for teenagers.

And London is not a nice or easy place to live unless you’re wealthy. There’s basically no available social housing left and the rest of the housing is so extortionate it leaves the less well off with very little disposable income and can leave you feeling a bit like you have your nose pressed up against the window watching other people have lovely lives while you struggle to keep the lights on.

Some people like it. My brother does, but it’s not for me.

The violence doesn’t bother me at all because in the main, if you don’t look for trouble, it won’t find you.

The one thing I did love about London has gone. There used to be a lot of different ideas about and subcultures and new ways of thinking. It’s become extremely conformist and there is a lot of social pressure to, at least publicly, conform to a narrow and prescribed set of views and opinions and the social backlash for stepping out of line can be tremendous and aggressive.

I don’t live in the country, I live in a northern city, I like cities. I enjoy visiting London. I don’t want to live there.

Bejam I agree with a lot of your post, the lack of social housing being built in London is absolutely atrocious.

But I completely disagree with your first paragraph and I think that must be very specific to certain areas. Whenever I read about the latest fad with kids' toys, for example, I am usually completely oblivious because certainly DD's school, by and large, doesn't seem to bother much - I had no idea what a Hatchimel was, and I think I might have seen one JoJo bow.