To email school AGAIN re religious assemblies

[pineapplepenthouse]

I have twins in year 4 both in different classes. I have expressed my feelings about not letting them be involved in religious assemblies or having anything to do with religion. My children are in different classes. Today for the third time my DDs has come home saying he has been included in the religious assembly.
I have strong feelings on this but other mums just say 'it's not a big deal' and 'it didn't do us any harm'.

AIBU?

What peeves me off is that all the kids in my dd’s class were talking about their faith it’s ok but when
one little boy said he doesn’t believe in god he was told off. I am agnostic and I think if it’s right that one has their beliefs then others should be allowed theirs no matter whether we agree or not. Surely all beliefs are valid even atheism.

In the US state schools there is a strict separation of church and state. You learn about religion in the context of world history and culture. In UK schools you seem to have parent volunteers telling kids about their own family’s beliefs and practices and a vicar coming in regularly for religious teachings. So from this outsider’s perspective it seems that one system frames religion in a more academic sense. The other is a mix of interesting cultural tourism and bible study. It can feel like it sets up Christianity as the superior, dominant religion even though there is a purality or beliefs and nonbelievers in the UK.

But what it comes down to is the family’s concerns aren’t being taken seriously and I can imagine it is frustrating to have concerns dismissed by 1 teacher and accepted by another.

Your sons teacher doesn’t have the right to ignore you and I’d be complaining.
My children all attend a non religious school - their school however does teach about different religions and they spend an entire week learning about said religion they do school trips etc and I’ve never removed any of my children, same as they learn about different cultures and spend a week learning about them they get to dress up in clothes related to that culture, eat foods etc and it’s made a fun experience whilst they learn. Personally I believe it’s a good thing children learning about other religions and cultures and having a small understanding of others beliefs. They find it really interesting and come home telling me about what they’ve learned.

Is there a specific reason you don’t want them taking part?

I’m a teacher at a primary school, and the problem in our school is that the staff do not always know what the theme in the assembly is. Also, in our school, the class teacher isn’t always present in the assembly to be able to send/take the child out.
Are your children primed to be able to raise a hand if they realise the content is something they are not supposed to be witnessing?
I teach reception/early years (4 year olds) through til year 2 (7/8 year olds) and have children in all those year groups who raise their hand when we do religious based content.
I get that it shouldn’t really be down to them, but it might help if they felt able to do that, as when there are hundreds of kids, or even kids you don’t see often in assembly you don’t always know to send them out.

Would you decline to go to a wedding, christening, funeral whereby there'll be a religous/Christian element involved? Even your child?
If you're a complete non believer of any religion ie Heathan, your children will no doubt have been fully informed by you of your beliefs? Or is it a stand of no real basis? Maybe your children don't want to be excluded from it?
Are you not a little spiritual which isn't religious but simply humanity? I'm not religious but as kids we used to love the singing out loud!

Actually, ktp100, I think it's still the law for English maintained community schools (ie LA schools without a religious affiliation) to have a daily act of collective worship, the majority of which acts of worship must be of a broadly Christian character. Parents can withdraw their children from this. I don't think it's the law in Scotland to have daily acts of worship, however.

Btw didn’t RTFT. But I really bristle at teachers telling parents how to think and bring up their children.

FWIW my experience is what happens at home is far more formative as to religious beliefs & moral values. That said, nobody can force their kids to share their views.

I’d be interested to hear what I’m the assembly is religious worship? As a teacher in Scotland I’ve never seen an assembly have worship during assembly.

I'd request to have a meeting to discuss. If you're not comfortable with it and it's not a faith school, then you have every right not to want them to be included. I don't know why some supposedly non-religious schools still insist on religious assemblies with hymns

When you say ‘hVe nothing to do with religion’ do you also want them excluded from RE lessons? Both RE and collective worship are actually compulsory for the school to provide. You do have the right to withdraw your child but in my many years of teaching it’s on the Jehova’s witnesses who have ever done that. My children currently attend catholic school as we are catholic. The school has recently taken a large cohort of Muslim children. They are recent refugees front Syria and this school was the only to accept them. They have taken part in church services and all the Christmas productions since they arrived. Last year their liturgy assembly was last thing on a Friday so their parents were allowed to collect them early each week at that time but when they’ve had assemblies or church services at other times the children have just attended.

If you feel so strongly about it then you need to go and speak to the school, not email them. Just out of interest too, what do you expect them to do during these assemblies? Are you able to provide them with an alternative activity to complete? Interestingly in Australia children can either attend RE lessons based on their religion (a variety are offered) or not attend anything. The alternative has been to sit and watch cartoons during this time. Another alternative has also been if there are parent volunteers who would run an ‘ethics’ class which they are required to be trained to lead so not always offered as it relies on volunteers. My sister in Australia felt so strongly about her child not attending a specific religious class and didn’t want her watching peppa pig (yet at her age that’s what was offered) so she did the training and now teaches the classes!!

@rededcator
I assumed the OP meant assemblies about different religious festivals. Christmas, divali, Hanukkah, eid etc.

No, so long as you don’t observe holidays at Christmas or Easter

Why, Odinia? They are bank holidays, why shouldn't OP take holidays in the same way as everyone else? If you're referring to the religious aspects of those particular holidays, bear in mind that both have origins that long predate Christianity.

nothing wrong with being ignorant to 1800 years of history I guess

1800? Your history must be a bit awry; more like approximately 2025, assuming you're referring to the history of Christianity. And why assume that OP and her children are ignorant of Christian history given that, as acknowledged in the post immediately above yours, her children go to RE lessons?

Can't people just read at least the OP's posts?
She doesn't want to exclude them from all assemblies, just the ones, about once a month, that are done by a local minister.
It's not a faith school.
She doesn't exclude them from RE.
She has another child (the twin of the one in question) who doesn't attend these assemblies so there is no issue of provision.

@Greensmurf1 I think in the UK schools may invite parents or members of religious communities to come and speak to children but the teacher is still responsible for teaching the curriculum and the school sets the curriculum which it follows. The use of community members is to bring it to real life what it’s like to be a member of a specific faith. Reading about it in books or listening to a teacher explain it using a worksheet can be very dry. The visitors can show items and objects and will come dressed in religious clothing. This is a lovely way for children to learn.

IF it's not a faith school then they will be teaching the highlights of all different belief systems.
YABU in not letting your children learn what others believe - its so very important to teach our children that friends and neighbours can hold religious belief different to that of their own family - it's not saying "This is the way it is and you should believe it" its just part of learning and acceptance of others. You need to demonstrate tolerance to the beliefs of others and teach your children tolerance.

Not only YABU but you are doing your children a dis-service by modelling such behaviour and not encouraging tolerance and acceptance of others no matter what their religious persuasions.

If they are in a faith school - suck it up! Your fault.

I'm a practicing Muslim and my children don't go to a faith school (although I used to go to a Catholic one as it was a brilliant school)
I remove my children from specific Christmas plays which depict Jesus as God as it is contradictory to our beliefs but I am happy for them to learn about all religions.
I agree with your frustrations and feel you should make an formal appointment with the head and take up the matter. Matters which are important to parents should not go overlooked. But I would advise you to be calm and speak softly as a person who comes across hot headed usually isn't taken seriously imo

@sima74, where on earth has OP said she does not want her children exposed to knowledge of religion? On the contrary, she's happy for them to have RE lessons. WTAF indeed.

To withdraw them from these assemblies you need to write a formal letter to the headteacher that you wish to withdraw them from religious education. You cannot cherry pick

Not true, @AnnieLouJ67. As has been repeatedly pointed out, there is a major difference which the law fully accepts between acts of worship and lessons; it's perfectly possible and consistent to withdraw your child from acts of worship whilst being happy for them to be educated about religions generally. You don't have to believe in a religion to do RE, just as you don't have to subscribe to the views of Nazism to learn about its tenets.

@urkidding, what do easter egg hunts have to do with religion?

@Catsinthecupboard, you've written a great long post based on the premise that OP keeps her children away from knowledge of religion. Just making the effort to read her posts would have saved you the trouble, as your assumption is totally incorrect.

@Sunflower1989, again where do you get the notion that OP wants to keep her children away from the concept of religion?

Whatis it with the total inability of people to take the basic step of reading OP's posts on this thread?

I’d be interested to hear what I’m the assembly is religious worship? As a teacher in Scotland I’ve never seen an assembly have worship during assembly
'
It's right there in OP's post, @rededucator:

"yes it's only the religious assemblies (about once a month with a minister) and the man that comes in with his guitar singing Jesus songs and playing religious themed games that I object to."

I find it quite worrying to see the number of teachers on this thread who don't seem to use basic skills around checking data.

Can't believe in 2019 that state schools are still forcing this guff down children's throats. What happened to church run Sunday schools if you wanted to indoctrinate your DC?

You can withdraw your child from actual worship, but they can still attend RE lessons Not quite true, if the worship is integrated into another lesson then you cannot withdraw them. It is not uncommon for the local priest to teach art, music, crafts etc which would include a lot of Jesus juice. Not to mention regular trips to the local church hall activity centre.

My DS was so happy to drop RE in Y9. It was a complete waste of time and would have been better used teaching anything else Maths or English.

Being in the same room as someone spouting religious beliefs isnt forcing stuff down anyone's throats. Jeez how do people cope attending a church wedding.

When you say ‘hVe nothing to do with religion’ do you also want them excluded from RE lessons?

OP has already answered that question, celticprincess. Another poster who could have saved herself a lot of trouble by reading, if not the thread, at least OP's posts.

Yes. Don't enrol them in faith schools and then moan.

It's not a faith school, @TomVeiga. Don't ignore OP's posts and then moan because you haven't understood the basics.

YABU in not letting your children learn what others believe

FFS, OP is letting her children learn this, @TigerTooth. Given that you couldn't be bothered to read her posts, the rest of your own sounds dreadfully pompous and self-righteous.

@Femaleassassin
Well I guess they could not go and wouldn’t be forced by someone else to attend against their wishes.

If they wanted

Jesus the stupidity of some people

If you walk in the building and it's pushed down your throat as gospel until you leave then fair enough. 1 hours assembly a week will not be indoctrinating kids. You are though and often kids rebel against such staunch views.
Stamp your feet it's your right
Or
Sit in on one bet it's fluffy nothingness

Schools are difficult places to run if parents get to choose which parts of the curriculum or activities kids do or don't do. Some families may not want their kids to learn about farming because they are vegetarian, some parents may not want their kids to learn about the Holocaust, some parents may not want their kids to learn about Global Warming because they believe it to be a natural phenomenon etc etc. We all have different views but once our kids go to school we have to accept they are being exposed to things we would rather they were not. I really wouldn't worry if your kid is exposed to Christian worship. Rethink in your mind as community and signing and tell your kid over the dinner table how you think it isn't true!