To want Gordon brown back as PM

[Gaballout]

Such an underrated politician that always speaks so much sense. He would be so much better than any of the current lot!

Yep tax credits to help the low paid or as it really should read, a government subsidy for businesses to pay below a living wage.

Margaret Thatcher Deindustrialisation and underinvestment of whole swaithes of the country with no alternative plans ....cozying up to various tinpot dictators - pinochet anyone ? and apartheid supporter.

Somebody else needs to read up. Deindustrialisation speeded up and was more comprehensively trashed under new Labour.

Thatcher was not pro-Apartheid. She resisted sanctions against SA because she (correctly) surmised that poor black South Africans would suffer the most because of them. She personally oversaw Nelson Mandela’s release and paid for his housing, security and protection when he was released. They developed a personal friendship and deep respect for each other and Mandela did not view her as a supporter of Apartheid.

Many campaigners for sanctions (of which my mother is one) admit that in retrospect the campaign for sanctions may have been somewhat misguided, because if they had been successful then they would have caused unnecessary suffering for the people they were trying to help. But with hindsight, it’s actually an occasion where the campaigners and Thatcher worked somewhat in concert. She could dangle the threat of sanctions and the popularity of the suggestion in the UK to exert a hell of a lot of political pressure on the SA government.

He made some pretty poor financial decisions knowing the he was screwing over the country in ten years time. Not exactly a brilliant politician. BUT. In comparison to some of the options st the moment he doesn’t seem that bad.

Blair did shaft him, I agree. He built a house of cards based on policies which would bring short term success and popularity, but he knew in the long term they would blow up and create great hardship and failures.

He waited until that was just about to happen and then dumped it all on Brown.

But Brown knew too. They both knew the boom years were an illusion based on debt and jiggery pokery and that even the slightest economic downturn would bring it all crashing down.

They knew it was coming and they had no plan to stop it or ameliorate it.

Brown lied. Remember Prudence and ‘No more boom and bust’? He knew they were only prolonging the boom by doing things which would make the bust absolutely catastrophic when it happened.

I’m sure that if Brown had been in Corbyn or May’s shoes now, he would have been just as crappy.

They knew it was coming and they had no plan to stop it or ameliorate it

Yep world wide financial crash was the fault of Gordon Brown.

Ffs

Yep world wide financial crash was the fault of Gordon Brown.

Yes, that’s the standard facile left wing answer. That the worldwide crash was of force of nature like a typhoon or tsunami which was entirely unpredictable and came out of nowhere leaving poor Brown as powerless and unprepared as a leaf in a hurricane.

The worldwide financial crash was the fault of multiple governments of which Blair and Brown’s has a special dishonourable mention for giving up government control of the BofE and therefore any power the British government had to reign in banks, and cutting back and abolishing regulation on the financial sector so that anything that could have been done to stop its excesses was destroyed. They actively encouraged a boom based on unsustainable debt.

Governments know that economic good times don’t last forever. Good governments don’t go for short termist gimmick economics which create illusory short term wealth which in the long term will cause catastrophic suffering in the case of a downturn.

Brown and Blair shared blame for the downturn. And they were completely responsible for the economic landscape in the UK being one which made the global crash not just tough, but catastrophic.

Yep world wide financial crash was the fault of Gordon Brown

Yep it was lucky Gordon Brown abolished Boom and BUST otherwise that world wide financial crash would have really screwed us. Oh wait.....

Sub prime mortgages in the US absolutely the fault of the British Chancellor.

I'm not saying he made no mistakes he did, but to claim he was responsible for the world wide financial crash - that started in the USA is risible.

It’s government’s job to be prepared for bad times when they come. Blair and Brown stunningly failed to do that, and even worse, lied and pretended they were (prudence).

It’s even worse that left wing supporters continually lie and mislead, pretending the Labour government shares no blame for the crash, could not have foreseen a downturn and could not have prepared.

You might genuinely believe it Mousse, but it’s lies. Outright lies.

Why do you think it was a reasonable position for the Labour government to assume (they didn’t, but their supporters will claim they did) that there would be constant economic growth and no recession ever again?

Bejam Nostalgia, thorough and readable posts well posted

Sub prime mortgages in the US absolutely the fault of the British Chancellor.

Oh, so that was the only single cause was it?

And one couldn’t reasonably expect the person in charge of our economy to monitor the biggest fucking economy in the world for any huge and blatantly obvious risks that several economists were openly ringing the alarm about is it? Or prepare the economy so it was cushioned by the effect of any downturn was it? It’s not like that’s the fucking job he’s paid to do now is it? It’s not like him and Blair introduced a shitload of short termist measures to create illusory prosperity to keep them in power for a few more years even though they knew in the long term it would cause great suffering would they? No, they’re great big cuddly teddy bears who would never deliberately make people suffer just to keep they’re cuddly mitts on power aren’t they? It’s not like they started two wars on sketchy grounds with dubiously legality that killed thousands of people in the ME and led to the rise of ISIS huge human displacement and caused terrorism and death across Europe is it?

Fuck it, they were great. Bring ‘em back tomorrow. Dictators for life. Go for it.

Dozey thank you.

I think the labour government did fail to prepare. I also think a Tory government would have been even less prepared. The U.K. was in total thrall to the finance industry and all parties share blame. Any attempt by any party to put the necessary measure in place would have been dismissed by all concerned.

In the context of systemic failings to blame one individual for the failure of a series of governments (in the U.K. and abroad) and institutions (in the U.K. and abroad) over a number of years is just silly.

Don't assume I am giving a knee jerk one sided response. That's your game not mine.

I loved Gordon Brown

Yabvu Gordon brown was the reason Lloyd’s bank was fucked over. Lloyd’s were one of our only banks not to have been struggling with subprime loans shit. GB cooked up an illegal dodge deal to ‘allow’ Lloyd’s to take on Halifax and all their dept.

He though spending was the only way to go and is the main reason there was no money when the Tories took over.

The reason we're leaving the EU is Brown.

Tax credits were primarily introduced to lure millions of low skilled Eastern Europeans into the UK in order to 'stimulate economic growth''.

In other words , to pump 'buy to let' property prices and supply business with an endless supply of cheap, subsidised labour.

We were the only country of note in the EU not to cap accession state immigration under Blair and Brown's watch.

I genuinely believe history will view Brown for the brilliant politician he is - curbed the worst of Blair and essentially saved the world during the financial crisis. I miss him.

Didn't he flog all our gold reserves when the price was low?

I also think a Tory government would have been even less prepared.

Given that in 18 years government neither Tory PM gave up control over the BofE that’s unlikely. Especially as the left wing who traditionally should have been protesting about that sort of stuff (and would have been apoplectic if the Tories has tried it) quietly waved it through with nary a ripple.

And didn't he leave a note for the next Government saying sorry, there is no money left in the coffers?! (I know, that's probably just a myth)

Gordon who raided everyone's pensions??

Goodness no! I thought he was a dreadful PM and Chancellor overall, though seemingly a very lovely human being and yes, Tax Credits are a wonderful thing that we can thank him for. Other than that, I see him as the beginning of the end...he’s the first Prime Minister I had no respect or trust for as a leader. Since then it’s just been downhill!

Gordon the gopher would be ace. Can we start a petition?

God no, Schofield would feel he had a right to be involved