Questioned under caution by TV licensing guy - I have a TV licence

[mainlymoderate]

TV licensing guy turned up on doorstep and was very aggressive. I was so frightened I just answered his questions.

We'd moved very recently and have a TV licence, just hadn't notifiied TVL. I checked with them and that's no problem. The guy found the licence but then didn't seem able to control himself and began to ask me questions and fill in what I now realise was a caution sheet. Thankfully two people who were quoting for works to the flat turned up otherwise he would have entered the property. He asked me all kinds of personal questions in front of them. I know it sounds pathetic but I was just so frightened and confused by the whole thing, I signed the sheet of paper which I didn't even know was a caution sheet. I called TV licensing and they said once he knew I had a licence he should have stopped.

I reported him to the Police and they were shocked I'd been questioned under caution when I'd committed no offence. I was in tears. I also feel such a fool for not having understood what was going on and allowing myself to be intimidated.

I read up on it afterwards and discovered that BBC outsource this to Capita. The DG of the BBC ordered an investigation into their tactics last year. But it looks as though they are still operating in same way and they actually target vulnerable people. I've always been a supporter of the BBC but this experience has shocked me. Should the BBC really be allowed to outsource to Capita knowing how they operate?

What you signed was a TVL 178 form. You WILL recieve a summons in the post, sorry, TVL goons are not police, they have no powers, they are just salesmen.

Never ever ever give them the time of day. A BBC ( capita salesman) TVL inspector has the same right to ask you about your tv licence as you have to walk up to my car and ask me about my drivers licence. Which is none at all.

You will gat a court summons, the 178 form will be full of lies. Make sure you attend court and check out "TVlicencetesistance" for more info on how to deal with the court.

Never ever ever ever ever ever give TVL scroungers the time of day. Ever.

the only relevance of PACE here is in relation to entry with a warrant (only) and on the rules of evidence gathering.

Indeed, to be interviewed under caution is the interviewer warning you that they intend to conduct the interview in a manner which allows any answers, or non-answers to be used as evidence.

My tone may not be the most patient, but I'm just making sure the poor OP won't be wrongfooted when she makes a complaint based on repeated false information that the interviewer had no rights to question her.

Exactly. It sets a serious tone designed to intimidate the average law abiding citizen- redolent of police powers. But of course the person on the receiving end of the 'under caution interview' can choose to tell them to stick it, just like they have the law on their side when they decline entry.

That was to iced ⬆️

The caution is simply a standard form of words setting out the rights of the person being interviewed "I must caution you that you are not obliged to say anything but it may harm your defence if you fail to mention when questioned anything you later really on in court ..."etc.

TVL use it to make it sound as if there's an equaivalence between the Police nicking you for speeding or something and them trying to get you to incriminate yourself - but TVL don't have anywhere like the same powers. Their own rules state that they must leave immediately when asked unless they have a warrant.

They did the same to me a couple of years ago but there was two of them, arseholes

I'm just making sure the poor OP won't be wrongfooted when she makes a complaint based on repeated false information that the interviewer had no rights to question her.

It's great that you're here to put us all to rights, but have you got any links stating that Capita employees have the right to interview individuals under caution? Preferably with an explanation as to how they, despite being private citizens, have such rights?

What with having an internet at your fingertips and all that.

that the interviewer had no rights to question her.

The interviewer's "rights" to question her are conferred solely by the OP - she was free to tell the interviewer to go away at any point.

Exactly. It sets a serious tone designed to intimidate the average law abiding citizen- redolent of police powers. But of course the person on the receiving end of the 'under caution interview' can choose to tell them to stick it, just like they have the law on their side when they decline entry.

Yup. Reality is they have no more right to enter my home than I have to enter theirs, though they do their level best to pretend otherwise.

Lushlemming, given that Capita has evidence that OP has a licence, she won't get a summons. Don't be alarmist.

@IcedPurple

It's an outdated funding model

That may well be the case, but it doesn't put the BBC in the wrong for operating the only system that is on offer. The alternative is likely to be a system of funding through taxation as happens in a number of countries, which would probably annoy people even more as it would mean funding by people who never watch TV at all.

@Jenny17, what has the availability of streaming services got to do with anything? OP isn't suggesting that she only watches TV that way.

Saturday.

She will. You're being incredibly naive.

@IcedPurple, you misunderstand how the UK law works. There's no law saying you specifically are allowed to post here, yet you can.

Everybody has a right to perform an interview under caution (if they do it properly, it may count as evidence, if not, it may not). What they don't have is a right to compel someone to answer, which I've never claimed they had. You said they had no right to interview OP under caution, and that was incorrect. OP should not be preparing a defence/complaint on that basis.

@Lushlemming

How so? If tthis guy was a genuine employee of Capita, once he goes back and checks their records he will find that the OP has a TV licence. She should then be issued with an apology, not a summons.

However I am doubtful that this person was a TV licence inspector at all. If he was/is, the OP should make a formal complaint to his employers.

@IcedPurple, you misunderstand how the UK law works.

Perhaps. That was why I was waiting for an expert like yourself to put me to rights.

Everybody has a right to perform an interview under caution (if they do it properly, it may count as evidence, if not, it may not).

Again, since you have an internet at your fingertips, I'd appreciate a link to support that claim.

Or are you just swiftly backpeddling to turn 'interview under caution' into something utterly meaningless? As in, if I phone Virgin Trains to ask about trains to London, I can tell them I'm questioning them 'under caution'? Since you say anyone can do it?

You could. It would be absolutely meaningless, but you could.

M3lon what a lovely post. Thank you, yes you are right he is going to be investigated. Even Capita/TVL staff have sounded ashamed about what happened when discussing it with me.

In the grand scheme of things in life I have to reflect, this isn't so bad. If there is any way my experience could result in any changes to the way Capita does this, I'd be very happy but I'm not hopeful about that.

You could. It would be absolutely meaningless, but you could.

No, I couldn't. Don't be daft.

In theory, you could, Iced. Like you said though, they are just a set of words anyone can utter. Pp makes it sounds like a 'right' enshrined in legislation like in the Human Rights Act 1998 or something!

@nauticant, have sent you a pm but thank you for suggesting I write to the CEO of Capita. I did and he just wrote straight back with a real response indicating he will look into this. Thank you so much.

No, I couldn't. Don't be daft.

What do you think would happen if you did? They might laugh at you or hang up, but no-one will come arrest you.

If anyone else has one of these people at the door simply say ,i do not wish to speak with you,and shut the door in their face, Id advise OP to sent a letter of complaint, headed COMPLAINT and highlight the behaviour of this bully and how he made you feel.

What do you think would happen if you did? They might laugh at you or hang up, but no-one will come arrest you.

By the same token, I could claim to be the Queen of China and nobody would arrest me either.

Anyway, glad that we've established that TV inspectors do not have the right to enter your home (at least not without going through the lenghty procedure of obtaining a warrant) and that they do not have the right to interview you under caution - or at least no more of a right than you have to interview them under caution.

Was getting a bit confusing there.

@saturdaynext

Streaming services is relevant because it shows that the technology is out there for a different revenue collection method.

The licence fee is an unfair tax. Non payment can result in prison time. There is no justification for their tactics or mandate.