A video that looks at both sides of dog bites

[Soubriquet]

Please do watch this. And if you have children, teach them how to read the signs of a dog who doesn’t want to be messed around with.

As an adult, learn the signs yourself and intervene as soon as you spot the dog starting to show signs

And never leave a dog and child alone together

link

**walking past and giving a little stroke to a dog eating

Loving that is what op is trying to get across, of course it is bad that a dog bites a child, but it is nearly always the owners fault, for not reading the signs, not training the dog, and letting their kids treat them like play things and of course not training their kids how to have a dog.

I think it’s a very good video.
It’s not saying this is a reason for all dog bites but it certainly is for some who let their kids treat pets like toys

Lots of people commenting and no one has mentioned the online resource so here it is;

www.thefamilydog.com/stop-the-77/

It includes information for children, and a training video on how to read a dogs body language.

Some kids are too young to read a dogs body language, so a dog owner and adult have to read the signs and keep a close eye on things.

@Soubriquet thank you for the video

Unfortunately there will always be so many people entrenched in their views it is probably not worth trying to teach them some common sense.

I can't read all these posts as responses are driving me nuts.

I do see your point doggy but also still disagree to an extent. Dogs should always have a space away from humans that they can escape and not be prodded or harrassed. If thats their bed then people should not go there. Its the human equivelent of being allowed to walk away from an argument.

However this thread disturbes me. So many people adamant that they and their children should never ever learn basic animal warning signs to reduce risk and aggitation of a dog because they believe a dog should have human thoughts and act impeccably at all times but their sprogs shouldnt have to behave around dogs.

@MyTeaMouse
Yes, obviously a dog is in the wrong if it bites a child, in any circumstances. If it is provoked, that may make the bite something that could be avoided, but it doesn't make it right!!!

Just because dogs are idiots, it doesn't mean they can do abhorrent things and those things are somehow 'not wrong'. They are dumb, they are amoral, they can't know some things are wrong. But they just are.

@Booboostwo
I agree the morality of dog's biting and humans attacking are completely different. Dogs are amoral.
The point is that it shouldn't happen, and nobody should have to behave defensively to avoid it. But it does happen, and it's just common sense to be careful.

I love dogs, I have dogs, I have had problem rescue dogs who needed careful handling around other dogs (e.g. walking at 5.00am to reduce the chances of meeting another dog who wouldn't respect their space/body language).

I could cheerfully throttle dog owners who let their badly-trained dog come bounding up to mine when mine is on the lead, under close control and wearing his fluorescent yellow NERVOUS coat. I am absolutely with you parents who don't want dogs with no training, manners or recall bouncing at your DCs while you're minding your own business on a walk or playing in the park. They're the ones who give responsible dog owners a bad name. You probably don't even notice the latter half the time or more, because their dogs are under control and not posing a potential threat to your DCs. Sadly it's the irresponsible ones who everyone notices because they're the ones whose dogs are (often literally) in your face.

What I have learned since starting to take on these dog-nervous rescues is that at least half the dog owners I've ever met don't understand canine body language or psychology (including some who have dogs and children) so the chances of non-dog owners doing so is slim to none.

I wish prospective dog owners had to take and pass a test before being allowed to take a dog home. For their dog's sake as much as everyone else's.

I’m not saying if a child gets bitten is their fault.

It’s the dog owners fault for not recognising the signs and stopping the child and dog interacting

My 3 year old doesn’t recognise the signs so I make sure he only interacts with our dogs when they are happy to and intervene when they are not.

My 5 year old is learning.

There are rules though. No going near them when they eat, and no putting your face in theirs when they are sleeping.

They are dogs. Not robots. They don’t want to be messed around with whilst eating and having someone stare at them close up when they are sleeping.

They deserve their own space just like people do.

All this you must be able to take toys off a dog, go around their bed and put your hand in their food is bullshit.

You wouldn’t like it. So why should your dog

And before you say it’s only a dog, then why are you expecting them to have a human like reaction when it comes to children messing with them?

Children’s safety is paramount. We teach them road safety. Why can’t we teach them safety around dogs too?

There may well be times you need to handle your dog when he’s eating or whatever.

Of course, but just because you as a dogs owner can do those things, doesn't mean the dog will tolerate a random child doing the same.

Grown adults are far more likely to be calm, to read body language and to be careful. They won't be too noisy, bound over, accidentally poke their fingers in the dogs mouth/eyes/ears, they won't loom over the dog or get right up in their face.

I can move my dog while he sleeps, touch him or his food while he eats and put my head in his crate while he's in there. But I wouldn't expect him to tolerate that invasion of space by a child (or anyone) he doesn't know!

I think it’s a great video. And boob a great post.

You will come across dogs in life, dogs have been mans companion for millions of years.

We don’t teach our kids road safety by saying “oh just cross the road” then blame the driver of a car that hits a child that just runs out.

We teach our kids to swim rather than demanding the sea and rivers are fenced off

We tell our kids to not talk to strangers, how to stay away from cliff edges.

Why are some people so insistent that it’s not their responsibility to teach their kids how to behave round animals - absolutely it is.

I have a nervous dog - brought about because some silly little girl ran up to her when she was a puppy and basically threw herself on top of her all whilst the parents looked on then gave me the evils when I pulled the girl off after ignoring me telling her to stop. I’ve had to undertake so much training to undo this damage to the extent I can, but it’s left her timid. I have a lead and harness saying nervous but so many people ignore it. My dog is not there for your kid to stroke.

A pp said you can’t always control a child teaching out for a dog but expects you to control an animal.

I think reading animals body language is a very important life skill, like learning to swim

I wholeheartedly agree that children over the age of 5 must be taught never to go near a dog without checking with the owner first.
However having had my 4yo in hospital because my idiot ex left dc alone with dog, who then snapped, I think a fair number of people aren’t fit to have dogs. Or children.

Especially parents who then blame their own 4yo.

When I am out with my son I always keep him out of arms and feet reach of dogs because I know he behaves unpredictably. I expect dog owners to do the same with their dogs

As a parent and a dog owner I like the video.

My dogs (labradors) love children. They are mother and daughter and have grown up playing with the kids.

However I have always been very strict with rules for both. No nipping, growling or dominance by the dogs is allowed at all. They are dogs, we are the pack leaders.
On the other hand, the children have been taught that they don’t go in the dogs beds or touch them at meal times or chase them. They need to learn respect as much as the dogs do.
It’s still a bit of a problem. Having labs and having children that love dogs and are confident with them means that they can be over boisterous in seeing other dogs, especially “cute” ones. Personally I would very much think it was my fault if my child went up to a dog on a lead and it bit them and I work hard on preventing this. However if my dog off the lead went up to a child and frightened them it would be my fault as an owner.

I will show my children the video. It is aimed at people who have dogs and allow their children to treat their dogs like dolls or playthings. It is not aimed at people whose children don’t like dogs or don’t play with them. All children should learn to respect animals as living things. But also, all owners should know their dog’s warning signs and remove the dog or child when they see these signs. This is a video for dog owners, especially those with children or those who have children over in their homes.

It's all very well saying teach your children how to behave around dogs but I struggle with this.

1. I have never had a dog so don't myself really know how to behave around them or what the signs are or anger or distress. As an adult this isn't a problem as I don't generally approach / bother dogs anyway.

1. DD Is 2.5 and it's almost impossible to give a child that age a set of rules to remember in future scenarios. Even if I follow her around when we are near dogs telling her to leave them alone she ignores me because she's a toddler so I end up having to pick her up, which never goes down well! Luckily our friends with dogs are extremely responsible and keep her safe.

I was playing in the garden when neighbours black lab ran in and bit me on the face . I had done nothing was literally sat playing. Remember the feeling of injustice to this day when the neighbour tried to say it was my fault!

Notso well of course you should allow your DCs to interact with unfamiliar dogs in the usual manner: you observe the dog as you approach, any signs of unease and you explain to your DCs what is happening and why you will now walk away, if all is well you ask the owner if the DCs can stroke the dog, if she says yes then the DCs ask the dog if it wants to be stroked by putting a hand out for the dog to sniff and stroking under the chin. You can also do Boorow My Doggie and take a class at your local dog training club. Like all things that you have to learn how to do, you have to practice.

Or I could do what I've done since I became a parent 18 years ago and avoid my children getting bitten by keeping them away from dogs. It's worked well so far, my children are respectful of all animals and they're not scared of dogs.

You can't compare dogs to traffic. It's impossible to live a normal life in the UK and not cross a road. It's perfectly possible to lead a normal life encountering a dog only very, very rarely. I've done it for 30 years since my Grandmas dog died.
If we or my parents or in-laws got a dog then it would be unavoidable and we would have to do more to educate the children.

Also we have had experience while out for walks of dogs running ahead of owners and circling and jumping up at DD, whilst their owners don't intervene and just say 'oh they're very friendly'. Meanwhile DD is whimpering and shrinking away from it, obviously frightened. So really dog owners need to take responsibility for keeping children safe and teaching them to respect dogs' boundaries

Bullshit eh.

First of all, there may well be a time when you need to approach your dog in such a situation.

Say he was chilling in his bed and you noticed that he had picked up a glass for example and carried it into his bed.
Would you still leave him alone?

What if the dog was eating dinner and you fancied a hot chocolate, went to get the powder but accidentally dropped it and a load of cocoa powder landed in your dogs food.
Would you take the bowl off him?

If you have never taught your dog to willingly accept intrusion you are potentially going to find yourself in a dangerous situation because that dog may feel inclined to guard what it feels is theirs.

We need to remember that lovely as they are dogs are predatory animals with considerable jaw strength, sharp teeth and far faster reflexes than us.
They can do severe damage if so inclined.

It is everyone’s best interests to teach our dogs that there is no need to be anxious/possessive of people around food, toys, beds etc.

Secondly, as a pp mentioned, most dog owners have little to no understanding of dog body language.

It isn’t taught in school.
It isn’t taught to new puppy owners when buying.
It isn’t taught to people adopting from a rescue.
It isn’t taught in most dog training classes.

So, while it would of course be great if everyone educated themselves that really isn’t likely to happen.

The responsibility for safety is going to fall on the dog owner and legally, the responsibility is on the dog owner aswell.

Thirdly, expecting a dog to tolerate having a toy removed or someone near its food or approaching its bed is not the same as expecting it to tolerate pestering and abuse.

There is a big difference between reacting to genuine threat/aggression like a child smacking it or bouncing on it and exhibiting possessive guarding behaviour in the absence of any real threat, like a child approaching its bed.

Presumably you wouldn’t exhibit aggression to your dog giving you ‘the eyes’ as you sit down to dinner nor would you exhibit aggression should your dog opt to sit next to you on the sofa, so why are you accepting it the other way round?

Chinesechicken someone upthread posted a good video about dog body language and how to behave round them. It’s a good to have this knowledge, 1 in 4 adults in this country own a dog so it’s likely you and DC will come across them.

It’s difficult as I’ve been around animals all my life and find it very easy to read their body language as it looks obvious but understand if you haven’t had much contact it would be more difficult at first.

Treat being round dogs as any other situation where your dd could get hurt if they acted inappropriately ie next to a busy road, near a drop, near electrics, near water. No is the only rule your DD needs to know at this stage.

I get that, Dead, I don't want you to think I've been letting DD run amuck whilst standing idly by I guess what I am saying is that our friend with dogs take responsibility for ensuring DD doesn't hassle them or bother them and I would expect that from other dog owners

But doggy those things would be emergencies so would Require invading that space. No one is saying to put up with a dog being aggressive round those things. Just to listen to it. I could take food out my dogs mouth (and do if she’s picked up something and in fact have just fished out something from the back of her mouth which turned out to be a crumb of dog biscuit) but wouldn’t take her tea out of her mouth. We have a rule that we don’t disturb her whilst sleeping but she would let me pick her up if I needed to move her urgently. But those rules are there to be respected generally, she has the right to expect to eat her tea in peace and to sleep in peace. I don’t like being disturbed whilst asleep but would be ok if it was to save me from a fire.

I think we expect our dogs to put up with so much shit because they are generally such loving and forgiving creatures.

Another one with scars here. I was attacked whilst minding my own business and walking in the park. I dont want to read their fucking body language, l want dogs to be kept under proper control. I now carry pepper spray, just in case.

Chinese chicken it’s your responsibility though to make sure you me DD is not hassling the dogs, it’s the dog owners responsibility to make sure the dogs don’t hassle DD.

To dog owners without kids, it might be equally difficult for them to understand the unpredictability of a child and how to control them as much as it is for someone with no dog experience to understand a dog