AIBU to think we can cancel Brexit and just pretend the entire embarassing spectacle never happened and carry on as before

[CaraCarbonara]

The European Court of Justice has ruled that we can revoke Article 50 without needing consent from the rest of the EU. The EU would love us to stay.

Lawyer David Allen Green tweets
"If Brexit is cancelled, the sensible majority will pretend, with relief, that the entire embarrassing spectalce never happened.

And the minority can have their 'treachery' narrative which, frankly, is all they ever really wanted anyway. Everyone is happy"

What do you think?

Yesterday, I wandered into this shop that has just opened nearby. Once inside, the owner greeted me eagerly and I realised that I was the only person in the shop. So I did that British thing where we idly browse around, pretending to be interested, realise there's nothing we want and try to sidle out without drawing too much attention to our change of heart.

Think that sums up Brexit for most Brits.

I don't believe anyone voted for this shit-shambles. People were given a lot of false info and promises over what leaving would mean. I doubt anyone envisaged this.

One MP mentioned yesterday in the debate that the devolution vote in the late 70's required a higher than 50% majority - this should have been the same - such a massive change should have an overwhelming majority not a tiny one.

The whole backstop business is scary and completely untenable.

The whole thing is a frightening disaster. Did anyone who voted leave actually really want what is happening now?

I hope (but doubt) we could just agree to cancel the whole thing. But I don't think that would be acceptable to the people who voted leave (however misguided I think they were). I think the only viable option is the People's vote.

What definitely isn't acceptable is Theresa May putting her career above all other considerations and playing brinkmanship with people's lives and livelihoods. Cynical despicable self interest.

it needs to go through in whatever way possible

That should only happen if there is a full enquiry into the criminal activity that was uncovered by the Electoral Commission and its impact, and into the level of Russian interference. A democracy founded upon lies, underpinned by criminal activity and vulnerable to foreign influence is no democracy.

If you want democratic validation there should be another referendum on the facts. If Leave can uphold their promises without lying or breaking the law, then they will win with an increased majority, so there should be nothing to worry about. Then it would be a fair win.

It’s going to be uncomfortable, but ultimately I think we will be okay

Uncomfortable? Bit of an understatement there, pumpkin! And what makes you think we will be okay? Honestly, I'd love to know because I fear the exact opposite.

YABU if you think people will forget this ever happened. Whether we Brexit, whether we cancel, whether it’s hard or soft, some will never get over the resentment

Does anyone actually understand what the backstop is? I don't.

*That would be great. I would like to get back to normal and confine this utter shit show to the history books.

I genuinely believe that in 100 years it would be discussed in history as the rise of the right/media manipulation.*

Completely agree! However I worry about real social unrest if we back track on the referendum now.

The problem I see is that everyone has a different view on Brexit. The vote was a stay/ leave but actually the issue is far more complex than that. No-one expected a leave result (even those that wanted to leave)!

It's a mess.

Since it was a manifesto promise to hold a referendum and, by implication, act on the outcome, I think not to leave would be so harmful to our democracy as to outweigh the other consequences

It was also a manifesto promise in the same manifesto that we would stay in the single market.

If we were watching this taking place in a different country, I really hope that we would be shocked by the acceptance of the sheer corruption of this referendum. Lies. Criminal Activity. Foreign Influence. It's astonishing the way we just sit back and accept that we appear to deserve no better.

Except the majority voted to leave not the minority.

And the scaremongering the anti brexiteers are now throwing about is not going to help the case for wanting to remain. If there were another referendum it’s highly possible, likely even that the majority would still vote leave and then what?

The electorate has spoken and voted to leave the EU. As much as I am a remainer, we will be leaving the EU.

Why are we so reluctant to say that sometimes the general public get it wrong and vote for the wrong thing!! Brexit is goingto decimate our country and we need the government to step in and out a stop to it. Civil rights in the US would not have been won by a public vote. Nor women’s suffrage in the U.K. A majority voted in Hitler and the Nazis. Just because the majority vote for something, it does not mean that we should blindly follow it regardless of all consequence!

I worry about real social unrest, once people are actually living with the consequences of Leave.
I don't think there would be much social unrest in the event of a People's Vote. Every so often militant leaders try to arrange a rally and the turnout it paltry.
In any country that actually understood how to conduct referendums properly, nobody would turn a hair at the idea of a referendum to validate a deal once it was established. I'm sick and tired of people spewing on about how Ireland was made to have a second referendum. I was living there at the time. They voted no to Lisbon, because there were elements they didn't like. The government negotiated with the EU and sorted the problem out. They went back to the people, who were happy and voted yes, because the deal was different. Had nothing changed, the vote would have been the same. And nobody I knew even really commented because it was all so sensible and unremarkable.

Completely agree op! Let’s dorget this whole, awful mess has happened, ago eating time and money on it and concentrate on issues that matter!

And the scaremongering the anti brexiteers are now throwing about is not going to help the case for wanting to remain. If there were another referendum it’s highly possible, likely even that the majority would still vote leave and then what?

Which parts do you think are scaremongering and which do you accept are the inevitable consequences of a decision to leave?

If leave win in a referendum that isn't based on lies and where the facts are known, then that is a fair win. That's a very different scenario to the one we are living with at the moment.

Completely agree! However I worry about real social unrest if we back track on the referendum now

There’s a good chance of social unrest either way.

If we leave with a no deal. The very short term consequences will be dire and the economy will be appalling for at least a decade = very good chance of social unrest.

If we leave with May’s deal, some hard core Brexiteers will be unhappy = good chance of social unrest.

If we decide to remain, some Brexiteers will be very unhappy = good chance of social unrest.

I personally think it’s disgusting that the threat of violence is being used. It’s terrorism plain and simple.

You lot who want No Deal do realise it isn't just going to be like it is now in terms of trade, etc?

YANBU except with so much water under the bridge I think perhaps Remainers and rEU should be careful what they wish for.

Do they really want a Hard Brexit Tory PM back in the tent pissing out with a Referendum mandate to do so and an agenda to make Leave look like the favourable option for the EU as well as us? MN doesn't normally advise taking back the serial cheater?

There’s a good chance of social unrest either way.

Nah. There aren't enough Leavers a) bothered enough or b) still alive.

I tend to agree with that David Allen Green tweet. And it would be very gratifyingly British, wouldn't it, if we just swept it quietly under the carpet while people averted their eyes, and then just Never Spoke Of It Again.

I would much rather have another 20+ years of Nigel Farage and crazy stories in the DM than Brexit which is steering us to disaster. The referendum was badly run - no independent analysis on the potential outcomes (just that ridiculous bus), and the vote is far to close to make such a huge change to the status quo.

Yanbu.
The result was manipulated by certain groups and hardly a majority.

YABU. We live in a democratic society.

Oh it wont be the remainers who riot if a no deal Brexit goes through, it'll be the leavers when the promised land of milk and honey doesnt materialise. Then waaah - it'll still be the nasty EUs fault.

I would love this to happen. I bored of thickos thinking they're experts on politics and international relations just because they've learnt a handful of mantras.

I'd be fine with this but I voted remain.

I'm surprised there's not been more emphasis on the leave campaign lies and dodgy finances - I think the electoral commission been investigating and found something off there.

Instead of all we’ll be betraying all those people who voted out if we don’t leave . That was the reason a second referendum with perhaps all the options - No Deal, May's Deal - Stay as is - stay in bits - was being ruled out yesterday.

There’s a good chance of social unrest either way

Unfortunately I agree.

We should never have had the referendum in the first place.

I think there are about 10-20% of leave voters who would genuinely make a fuss. Most of the rest are bored and just want it to all be over so would probably go with the traditionally British version of grumbling a bit then carrying on with their lives.

As for rioting on the streets - the most likely scenario for that is a no deal Brexit with food and medicine shortages. The government know that which is why they've released all the impact statments spelling out how shit no deal would be. That way, if they bend to the "will of the people" mantra and we crash out, at least they can turn the blame onto the public and say "This is what you wanted!" Most people who voted leave and have since being paying zero attention will be absolutely horrified by the outcomes of no deal.

TM's deal is rubbish and leaves us poorer with less influence but it is still better than no deal. It is the compromise option closest to what the harder Brexiters want.

Norway + would be another compromise that is closer to remaining in the EU and less economic damage.

Remain with our cushy deal is still far and away the most sensible option. I would almost like to be alive in 100 years so I could read the history books about this.