Something really strange just happened

[InSwamTiddler]

I’ve NC for this as I’m not sure what to make of it and I’m really confused.
Back story - I was raised Catholic, but I’m atheist now. I work in a science based field and for as long as I can remember I have believed in the factual, empirically provable reality of things. I don’t believe in God or the afterlife, or ghosts / paranormal stuff.

Nearly 9 years ago my dad died. He died very suddenly and unexpectedly at a young age in my childhood family home.

Due to some circumstantial things, I’m currently living back in my family home.
My mum has mentioned a few times over the years that she’s felt my dad’s presence here and I’ve always been openly kind to her about it, but thinking “nope. Your imagination is going crazy because you’re grieving”. She’s mentioned she’s felt pressure on the bed as if someone has sat down on it next to her for example.

Anyway, this morning DP has left for work and I was still in bed. I was listening to him brushing his teeth, then popping the kettle on so I was definitely awake, but a little drowsy.

I felt him get back into bed with me and thought “what’s he doing?”... it’s not unusual for him to pop back into the bedroom and give me a hug or kiss before leaving the house.

I felt the heaviness of him pressed against my back and his arms wrapped around me. There was a heat between my shoulder blades I have never felt before but I wasn’t scared but I knew it wasn’t DP then. I heard the front door open so DP was leaving the house. Then my whole back went tingly a bit like pins and needles but not in an unpleasant way.

When it was happened I felt calm and warm but I’m freaking out now and can’t stop crying. Sounds silly but I feel like it may have been my dad.

I was 100% awake, not dreaming. I leant over and flicked the lamp on straight after.

Does anyone believe in this stuff? I never have but now I’m questioning everything.

OP I'm similarly rational and atheist, but I've also read/heard a lot of "real-life" ghost stories and it's led me to think there may be something going on.

I've had sleep paralysis where someone came in and sat on my bed - the person in question was my ex who was still alive and just down the road, but I very much wanted him to be with me and I think my brain was behind it in that case.

But that doesn't mean it's always the only possible explanation, and there is a lot of anecdotal evidence of people being aware of another person's presence after they have died, especially small children, and of people seeing "ghosts" without realising that's what they were.

In scientific terms, I still think it is something to do with brain function, but not something we currently understand. Also I don't rule out some kind of "recording" effect, also yet to be explained.

Yes I'm an atheist and have a scientific outlook but a true scientific outlook doesn't rule things out that are hard to explain just because they don't fit with current understanding.

If you feel your dad comforted you, that could be because there is such a thing as a dead person's spirit visiting the living (least likely IMO), or such a thing as the surroundings influencing the brain to make you feel that (more likely) or some unexplained situation in between. It's OK not to know for sure.

Yes it is true. This has happened to me too...(and more!)
My husband had a conversation with his mother from our Living Room to The Hospice she was in. I started crying and saying how she was the best MIL ever...and she's came out with a phrase that was unique to her! Told me to stop crying too! Also, when I was younger-18 and living at home, I also experienced people sitting, lying on the bed and also had the covers pulled off me! Was so scared I refused to go to bed! Many other people inc mum and dad experienced things that you can't explain away. The bed shaking (whilst my mum was in it.. on her own!)
I also heard this in the room next to mine when it was empty. I was wide awake, reading. Asked mum in the morning where she slept and she said "in with your dad, why?" Told her and she said it had happened when she was in the bed! When you've experienced stuff like this (and lots more), nobody could convince you otherwise. There is life after death... of what sort I don't know, but people keep on turning up at funerals (even their own!) Explain that one!

OP my father died when I was quite young and I have lots of similar experiences. I am totally open to the idea that our souls live on and I don' t think that the idea of it conflicts with science or psychology, both of which are developing areas and change as new discoveries are made. I am completely of sound mind and I know when something is coming from me and something is coming from "other". It isn't a matter of taking comfort - I am not someone desperately in need of comfort and although I wish my father had not died, it happened a long time ago, and life moved on, so it isn't wishful thinking or grief. It isn't something I fully understand, but having been through it a few times I would try not to be upset, and just keep it in mind as something to think about as and when you want to. You don't need to come to hard and fast views on it quickly.

I would ignore bertrandrussell (sorry bertrand)

@bertrandrussell you feel the need to come on to every single thread about this subject matter to say the same thing - there is no proof. And there isn't, either way - why do you think we need to be informed of it by you over and over again? You can't prove that souls don't live on just as I can't prove they do. This is not about you and your desperate need for everyone to know what you think about proof. I think you should accept that there are many people out there with different ideas and belief systems to you, and it is not your duty to set people "right". Try a bit of humility and live and let live and be open to the fact that there is much you don't understand, so that you may one day get insights which take your understanding of life to a new level.

To me this is not at all strange. There is life after death, and our loved ones often comfort us from the other side, or try to send us messages.

Up to 60% of bereaved people have some sense of their loved one after death, whether it be seeing them, a smell, a presence or a 'sign' such as a flower, robin or something that seems magical.

It is extremely normal, and I don't think you will even know what it was, but that your Dad's presence was needed and you felt it- it doesn't matter whether it was in a 'dream' because his love for you was and is still real.

I have experienced something like this. I lived in my childhood home for 44 years. My dad died there. One night i was in the coming round from a sleep stage when i felt as if someone was tucking me up in bed. At that i was fully awake as i was on my own. I mentioned this to my mom the following day thinking she would laugh it off. But she said sometimes she has felt as if someone gets into her bed and cuddles her.

@olivertwistwantsmore thank feck I’m not the only one who was thinking that

Me too but I didn't want to be the first to say it!

But back to the OP, I have had similar experiences over the years. Part of me would love them to be something spiritual but then Google tells me differently - because there are genuine, scientific explanations as to why we experience these things, as others have mentioned above.

I have had a similar experience but not for some time. I do believe in it and I would take that as your dad letting you know he's around and loves you

I am always surprised by some peoples steadfast refusal to accept even the possibility of ghosts. You don't have to be card carrying 'woo', but its worth being open minded and humbly accepting that there are limits to human understanding

Honestly, Tiddler, it was a dream. It's incredible how real these things appear. And your mum talking about it got your subconscious all ready to produce this experience for you. You said yourself you were a little drowsy. Get yourself up and showered and dressed and go outside. Change the scene and it will start to put itself where it should be-a comforting dream about your dad.

This. I've had similar 'visitations' from my beloved grandfather, including startling vivid recurrent dreams where he explained his death had been a paperwork error , and pictures falling off the walls etc, but I know perfectly well they were a combination of wishful thinking and the fact that the people we love remain alive in our minds long after their deaths.

Be kind to yourself, OP. Loss is hard.

Agree Limit. I think some people who think of themselves as sciency and sensible don't understand science - that it's open to new evidence and doesn't just rule that all unexplained phenomena must therefore be scornfully written off as mumbo-jumbo.

There are scientists who investigate this stuff in an empirical way, which is what they should do given that it's something a lot of people experience and we don't have an empirical explanation for it.

I am also fascinated by sleep paralysis because it so often involves the sensation of someone sitting on your bed or climbing up onto you while you lie in bed. I had an extreme experience of this as a student, I was snoozing in my boyfriend's bed and he was across the room typing at his desk. I felt something that felt like a small, heavy human form climb slowly up my body and lean close to my face. I felt paralysed and unable to scream, but i could hear him typing and felt awake.

Now, I know that is what is classed as sleep paralysis and it has that scientific explanation. However that doesn't explain why it tends to involve this very specific experience of another "being" on your bed - a "presence". Why is that and why would our brains do that?

I'm not saying there definitely is some other presence there, but I would like to know why it feels like that, and I also think it's not at all surprising that many people feel they have experienced some kind of visitation when that is exactly what it feels like.

"You don't have to be card carrying 'woo', but its worth being open minded and humbly accepting that there are limits to human understanding"
There are no limits to human understanding. There are limits to what we know at the moment but we are discovering new things all the time. Quite recently we discovered about sleep paralysis and hypnagogic dreaming. Which explained a phenomenon which people have experienced since "records began" and earlier than that. We don't know everything-but we do know a lot of things.

(And I am as far from card-carrying woo as you can get. I get really frustrated by unquestioning woo believers... but people who blindly rule out any possibility of woo beliefs having a basis are also frustrating. All kinds of stuff was in the realms of woo before it turned out to be science. Like lightning, rainbows and radio waves.)

"All kinds of stuff was in the realms of woo before it turned out to be science"

Exactly. Like the sensation of someone sitting on your bed, or on your chest....

Bertrand we know what's happening to the brain when sleep paralysis happens, but have they explained the "old hag" effect - i.e. why do we experience the sensation of another person or thing? Not being goady - I'd like to know if you have the info.

@zzzz are you serious? It’s nothing like a seizure and that is a stupid and dangerous thing to suggest.

I suffer from sleep paralysis and it’s terrifying. Never warm and comforting.

I believe it was your dad OP. I have seen my cat who was killed in a car accident a year ago. A flash of tabby through my room when the other cats weren't there. My young cat sees things I can't and will paw at the wall.
By coincidence our house had a very heavy atmosphere on Friday night and EVP showed us things and trying to communicate with us. Burnt sage and sent them into the light.
Don't doubt yourself. We don't know what s out there.

I don't think it sounded like sleep paralysis.

I believe you OP.

The other week, I was awake but just lying there on my side, thinking about getting up and I felt the mattress go down, I thought it was my DP, but he'd just left for work. I didn't feel scared though.

Also, after my dear Nan died in 2014, I was sat up late one night sobbing my heart out for her. When I saw a bright flash of white light out of the corner of my eye, it was so bright amd quick that I stopped crying immediately, as I was shocked and distracted. The pitch in the room then changed and I felt a pair of arms wrap around me, with this incredible feeling of warmth. It was lovely.

Feeling slightly bonkers saying it aloud, I said "Nan? Is that you?" The minute that question left my lips, someone on the TV shouted out my Nan's name once. It's not even a common name.

I was gobsmacked. With that the hug went and the pitch in the room returned to normal.

I found it very comforting.

I've had sleep paralysis like that. I also had pins and needles, and my arms coming back to life afterwards, with blood rushing into them. It felt as real as anything else is.

I sometimes get a sensation like someone is plaiting or stroking my hair, which is something my nanny, great nana and great gran used to do. It feels cold and tingly but nice. I believe it’s my gran/nanny/nana letting me know they are there and watching over me. It’s a comforting feeling. I have epilepsy and the suggestion of it being seizure related is really upsetting.

Look at the circumstances:
You are in bed, and are drowsy.
You are in your family home.
You are reminded of your Dad there.
A big part of you loves your Dad.
The feeling of being loved by him remains with you.
You are partially drowsy and you are half asleep but your brain still hears the sounds in your house.
Your mind is confused about the man in the house being your DP/Your Dad.
It wouldn't have happened elsewhere because your mind wouldn't be confused/conflicted about the sounds it was hearing.

I'm not claiming that it was a seizure though I don't believe for a minute that it was a ghost but until a relative developed epilepsy I had no idea just how many types of seizure there are and what they can involve. It isn't 'just' the classic grand mal/tonic clinic, my relative experienced strange sensations, hallucinated dead people and bizarre sights, felt that they knew everyone wherever they went, had feelings of impdening doom, sensations of being lifted etc. It's amazing and terrible what a storm of electrical activity can induce in one's brain.

Bertrand we know what's happening to the brain when sleep paralysis happens, but have they explained the "old hag" effect - i.e. why do we experience the sensation of another person or thing? Not being goady - I'd like to know if you have the info.

Not Bertrand, but yes, they have -- and the interesting thing is that it's culturally-specific ie. whatever presence you hallucinate is with you/watching you/sitting on you during a sleep-paralysis episode depends on your culture of origin.

There's a study involving the University of Cairo which says that 71 per cent of Egyptians who experience sleep paralysis believe they are caused by jinn (Islamic supernatural beings) -- obviously few non-Muslims in the west would even know what jinn are, so would not 'see' them during an episode. Canadian Inuit think the 'attacks' are caused by shamanic activity and will 'see' a shapeless presence. Japanese people are more likely to report a vengeful spirit who suffocates people while sleeping. Nigerians apparently experience a female demon. During the height of anxiety about alien invasion and UFOs in the US, sleep paralysis episodes were likely to be experienced as alien abduction.

Our culture primes us both to 'see' particular things when we have a sleep paralysis episode, and to account for it a specific set of supernatural/alien/whatever circumstances.

If you google 'sleep paralysis and culture' you get quite a few links to studies.