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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Or is my 4 year old neurotypical?

113 replies

onemorestepalongtheworld · 29/11/2018 06:43

Hi everyone, this is a very long post so I do apologise, I have posted before about this under a different name, but a couple of months down the line and I'm starting to think I am reading into things that are just totally normal for a 4 year old. My son started school in September and they aren't concerned at all and haven't seen a lot of the things on my list, my husband, mum and best friend are the only ones who recognise there may be differences to the typical 4 year old. I am fully prepared for you all to tell me I am being unreasonable and need to get a grip!! Maybe it's what I need to hear. Ok here's my list;

Licks things (not all the time but more often than other children his age and younger)
Puts things in mouth
Eats inedible things (play dough, flour, glue)
Likes being squeezed/tickled/lots of pressure
Very ticklish
Seems to find touch on his face/neck painful
Asks people to repeat themselves when speaking (had a hearing test, all fine)
Upset by loud noises but happily makes very loud random noises (excitable screaming and shouting)
Distracted by slight noises/movement
Not dry at night
Pooing in sleep at times (when potty trained at 2.5 had fear of pooing so held it and used to go in his sleep every night, finally got rid of the fear but still sometimes going in his sleep and not always recognising the urge to go in the day)
Difficulty falling asleep (still awake at half 10 some nights just laying in his bed)
Says the bath is hot/burning him when it’s just warm
Sucking his skin/clothes at times

One sided conversations
Ignores questions and starts his own conversation
Won’t always look at/speak to even people he knows (does give very good eye contact when comfortable)
Can come across very rude ignoring people
Repetitive routines (started as a young baby, 11 months old would go upstairs to the same room every night to get the same book for months)
Can get very angry and lashes out if someone says something he disagrees with
Doesn’t show emotion when saying some things (‘you are going to die and I won’t have a mummy’)
Difficulty following new instructions, has to be shown what to do
Can take things very literally and has said things at school such as ‘you’re the adult I’m the child, you need to help me’ ‘I don’t need to do that I’m only 4’
Doesn’t like people looking at him and gets embarrassed
Strong emotional attachment to things such as a coat, random items of clothing.
Emotional attachment to anything linked to being a baby

Clumsy
Lack of spatial awareness
Messy eater
Struggles with fine motor skills
Forgets routine daily tasks
Random bursts of energy especially when in a new place or when someone comes to the house
Always on the go but can be totally absorbed in certain tasks
Fidgeting
Picking nails

Obsessed with certain books/characters
Intense role play, takes on the role very seriously
Very good long term memory
Doesn’t show a lot of emotion/affection towards people (but has recognised facial expressions in pictures since around 2 years old)
Very matter of fact
Doesn’t notice if someone is upset or try to help them unless prompted
Almost robotic with saying sorry/comforting people (learnt behaviour)
Sometimes laughing when told off
Can be very sensitive to change and people he’s not comfortable with (having said that he can adapt well to new situations, especially with a lot of preparation)
Would rather stay at home most of the time
Over the summer holidays he totally fell apart without the structure of going to preschool every day, all of these behaviours were exacerbated. *

He has a weighted blanket and meditation at bed time. I use visual cues and social stories to prepare him for things. He met all of his milestones at the average age.

OP posts:
Trumpetboysmum · 29/11/2018 07:04

Obviously it’s difficult to say without knowing how often each of these behaviours present themselves etc . Have you shown school the list ? Asked to talk to the Senco ? Many of these behaviours taken together could suggest many things that your ds might need support with at school and at home - weighted blankets and social stories sound like good ideas ( did someone suggest these things to you?)
the fact that you are aware that their might be issues that need help/ support moving forward is the most important thing ( much harder trying to convince parents that something isn’t right) . On the other hand all children develop at different rates and are all very individual with their own traits and quirks so time given that your ds is still young is also key . It also depends on how much the above are affecting his ability to live his life to the full and be happy, access school , learn and make friends- does that make sense ?

Birdsgottafly · 29/11/2018 07:15

I would continue to Parent according to his needs and see how he is at five.

He sounds a lot like my GD. I suspect there will be a diagnosis of something later on. Or she will just be as she is, with no issues at school and we respond to her needs at home.

I have two children with Additional needs.

Id read around developing empathy in children with ASD/Autism and use the advice, even without any diagnosis.

You are doing the right thing by going with his issues and responding as you should.

Building empathy, self confidence/worth anger management etc. The meditation is excellent. I think all children should be taught it.

Thesmallthings · 29/11/2018 07:24

I don't mean to sound patronising but you sound like a great mum, youv completely get him and help support him ( weighted blanket, pictures etc) have you spoke to the teacher?

Some of them things do seem normal but at the same time some could mean something else.
I would soeack to the go and ask for a referal and keep keeping notes.

Sockwomble · 29/11/2018 07:27

The things on your list are not unusual in young children but yes a typically developing 4 year old should be growing out of them. I would keep up a dialogue with the school about it and keep a watchful eye. If you are very concerned you could see your GP about it.

Tawdrylocalbrouhaha · 29/11/2018 07:43

How is he with friendships? How does he look when you stand back and watch him in a group of samw age peers? Often that is where you can see differences emerging.

Labradoodliedoodoo · 29/11/2018 07:46

Take the list to your GP. You’ve got an overview that school won’t have

Labradoodliedoodoo · 29/11/2018 07:47

Also make an appointment to see the Senco

TeenTimesTwo · 29/11/2018 07:50

That is a long list.
I can see that some behaviours in isolation are not unusual. However displaying all those behaviours is quite a lot.

School's can miss things because children can present differently and they have 29 others to watch too. In year 6 I presented DD1's primary with a list of issues that they fobbed off. Things became more pronounced in Secondary and we eventually go a diagnosis of dyspraxia. But looking back at the list of things aged 10 it was pretty obvious then had I been more informed.

I too would maybe watch and wait and see how things are in 6 months or a year. It seems to me that getting an assessment / help is easier if the school are on board so a delay to help issues become more clear (or go away) might work in your favour compared with pushing now?

onemorestepalongtheworld · 29/11/2018 07:55

Sorry everyone I should have added that I've shown the school the list, I've spoken to the senco, the school said he doesn't stand out among the other children. When I watch him with his peers he is very controlling in play and the game has to suit him, most of his friends go along with this. When I've watched him in activities where he doesn't know I'm watching and he's out of his comfort zone he will do things like spin in a circle, run around, move along the floor on his body and not really engage with what is going on! I went to the gp in September and am awaiting the appointment from the paed but I can't help thinking that I'm not going to get very far if he's fine at school (it's great that he's fine at school, not knocking that) he doesn't like school or want to go. They have a behaviour chart type thing and he often has to move his name down for making the wrong choice after being warned (minor things)

OP posts:
ClaireElizabethBeauchampFraser · 29/11/2018 07:57

Your ds sounds very like my autistic ds was at his age. You do realise that neurotypical means not autistic don’t you? As you are clearly helping your ds with weighted blankets etc which suggests that you believe your ds is on the spectrum.

My sons school refused to see any sign of autism in my ds, but they are not experts! It took an expert one hour in my sons company to tell us to research everything we could in autism! Our ds’spsychologist saw so many signs at school that ds was on the spectrum despite the school not recognising it. It took my sons psychologist explaining things to his teacher and head teacher and then an autism advocate from the NAS spending an inservice day training staff and later on parents on autism.

My advice is to write down as you have above all signs of autism and take it to your gp. Our gp was actually a paediatrician and was a fantastic support in getting our son referred to the local children and family mental health services and reaching diagnosis (his referral and observations of ds’s behaviour from various appointments really helped)

Inin · 29/11/2018 08:00

My child has dyspraxia and was showing a lot of what you have listed above at 4

ClaireElizabethBeauchampFraser · 29/11/2018 08:00

Cross posted- hopefully the paediatrician will be more supportive and help you reach a diagnosis. Have you contacted the National Autistic society for support?

Miscible · 29/11/2018 08:05

It is very normal for children on the autistic spectrum to mask in school, and the structured routine can help them to do so. I wouldn't take the fact that the school isn't seeing problems as any proof that they aren't there.

onemorestepalongtheworld · 29/11/2018 08:05

@ClaireElizabethBeauchampFraser when I've researched autism it doesn't add up, he does cope well in a lot of scenarios, he can deal with change with preparation, he can deal with new things, he doesn't have any stims. He would probably cope without the weighted blanket but I just feel it helps as he likes the feeling of pressure and 'squeezy cuddles' as we call them, he'll ask his brother to sit on him!

OP posts:
onemorestepalongtheworld · 29/11/2018 08:06

@Inin my brother has dyspraxia so I've always wondered about this. But his balance can be very good and he's pretty good at riding a bike, he was amazing on a balance bike. My brother struggled with these things but I'm aware that all children with dyspraxia will have different things they struggle with

OP posts:
SharesinClarks · 29/11/2018 08:07

Dyspraxia/DCD could also be a possibility. My son has Aspergers & dyspraxia and a lot of the issues overlap.

onemorestepalongtheworld · 29/11/2018 08:08

@ClaireElizabethBeauchampFraser what would I say to the national autistic society? Sorry that sounds really stupid but I have no idea what I'd say!!

OP posts:
averythinline · 29/11/2018 08:08

Your list could be signs of autism - but he is managing in school....so currently it is not an issue - quite a lot of those my ds did - he is not autistic but is dyspraxic ...lots of kids like routine and certainty and things on your list - he is only 4

what are you worrying about? what are you wanting to happen... there is onviusly something niggling you.....it maybe worth you thinking about what answer you are hoping for and what that is going to give you and or your son...
any help he will get at school will be based on his needs - not a diagnosis - you love him as he is thats not going to change..
You sound like a really caring mum but possibly slightly overthinking it all esp as school are saying he is ok - and he's not getting into trouble or falling behind at school..
maybe it will become clearer as he is older ....it maybe personality/character - he maybe on the spectrum -Enjoy him for who he is especially at this fab age! (i currently have smelly teenager so wistful for 4yr olds!)

onemorestepalongtheworld · 29/11/2018 08:09

Also in answer to a previous poster most things on the list are present most (if not every) day, but quite subtle as other people don't pick up on them!

OP posts:
Angharad07 · 29/11/2018 08:10

He sounds like quite a normal, intelligent and quirky little boy to me. Autistic children don’t normally engage in intensive role play, especially at only 4. He could have ADHD but a lot of what you have described is are behaviours normal children exhibit, eg getting excited when a new person visits the house.

He may have a sensory developmental issue or problems with motor control, perhaps dyspraxia. Nonetheless, I’d be unconvinced by your list, however, you’re his mother and obviously you are concerned about something.

TeenTimesTwo · 29/11/2018 08:10

Autism is a spectrum, so just because he doesn't show 'all' the signs doesn't mean you can rule it out.

I second the suggestion to look at dyspraxia, as it seems to me there can be a lot of overlap. (I keep going back to lists to rule out ASD in my dyspraxic teen.)

Angharad07 · 29/11/2018 08:11

*neuro-typical children not “normal” 🙄 bloody autocorrect

picklepost · 29/11/2018 08:13

From your descriptions he does sound to have sensory issues, might be worth researching sensory processing disorder and see if it rings any bells.

averythinline · 29/11/2018 08:15

cross posted with lots of dyspraxic relatives! - we have strong cuddles and a weighted blankets too! ds can play bat n ball sports and could ride a bike but not signal so failed his cycling proficiency !

I'm not saying not too worry about masking - just more as he is managing and keep an eye for now - not sure what the NAS will say/do that can help but they have some fantastic resources

where I live -if you want to pursue a diagnosis -its GP who then refers to peadiatric pathway....generally starting with any speach and language issues .....it is a massive waitlist (nearly 2 years) so maybe ask for a referral .....if he gets accepted on the pathway then they will assess at school as well as other situations.....

Sockwomble · 29/11/2018 08:18

The spinning in a circle could be a stim. It was one of ds's earliest stims used to try to cope with stressful situations.

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