to think that all GP's (Doctors) work part-time?

[popcornwizard]

Based on my tiny personal knowledge of 4 GP's that are friends, and a couple of others that are friends of friends etc, I'm coming to the conclusion that they all work part-time hours. Is this real? Or is it just the ones that I know. I have no idea whether any of the GP's at 'my' practice work full-time or not, but at least 3 of them work only two days/week.

So AIBU to think that they're a bunch of part-timers? And what causes this? Stress or lucrative locum contracts?

I know a few GPs and they work part time (full days but not 5 days a week, 3 or 4).

I also know one who, when the 'new' NHS contract came in (this was probably 10 years ago) got together with the other GPs in the practice and hired a locum (or two) so none of them needed to work full time but apparently no reduction of money. I have no idea what the situation is now though.

I'm currently only working 3 days a week (lawyer) having done crazy, crazy hours as a City M&A lawyer in the past - so I'm supportive of PT work and fully understand why some people want to step back from high pressure, long hours careers and progress in their career a different way.

Feel free to explain the correlation between my working hours and those of people in a completely unrelated profession. I have no absolutely no idea of the relevance.

That ^^ was to MrsStowman

MrsStrowman, sorry.

I work at a GP surgery and all the GPs there are part time including managing partners. Some have kids, some have other jobs (e.g. medical lecturer posts) or are studying. However, as others have said, the "part time" hours can easily add up to 40 hours a week because of the crazy work load and ridiculous amount of paperwork.

Walkingdeadfangirl yes I agree with you, it’s perfect economic sense to make flexible working very hard or inpossible.
Limit recruitment and retention problems further and reduce the amount of females willing to train as a gp (as let’s be honest it is usually still a female role to reduce working hours).
Let’s insist they all work a 60 hour week, and they are completely exhausted And haven’t seen their own children. I think that’s exactly what I’d be looking for in a gp, an exhausted and overworked mummy who hasn’t seen their dc for days would be ideal to treat my sick child

Or when you want to see a female gp about a sensitive issue, there won’t be one. They will have given up to see their kids once and a while.

Just think about all of the older gps who no longer feel as though they can work full time. No part time option they will leave when stress gets too much and their health fails.
Sickness rates will go up if no one has flexibility.
But, yes, sure, all of this makes perfect economic sense and would improve patient care drastically if we just insisted they all work full time

My son is a trainee GP, qualifying next year. His view is that if a GP works 5 days a week they will burn out in a few years. It is not just Dr-patient interface but lots of paperwork, chasing results from hospitals etc etc. 60+ hours is the norm. YABVVVU - but based on ignorance

My GP is part time, I see her arriving around 7am as I leave for work and she has been known to call me apologising for disturbing me so late ! With test results she's just got at 10pm at night, when I ask she admits to still being at the surgery till
1am in the morning. So I don't think part time is an accurate discription. Heroic ?

So you're telling me that your son says GP's should and do work part-time and you're also telling me that I'm unreasonable for thinking that a lot of GP's work part-time? Well that makes no sense at all yet you also call me ignorant? No words.

Any GP's reading this - thank you - I think you are amazing to do such a difficult, high pressured job.

From me, too! Thanks! I'm so sorry you have to treat judgy, sneery arseholes who imply you're workshy because you're not tethered to your job 24/7, please realise they don't represent all of us and plenty of us give not a flying fuck how many hours you work as long as you are doing your job well.

You are also not to blame for continual funding cuts to the NHS that make your job even more difficult and then cause others to point fingers at you for no 'continuity of care'. The blame lies with Tories and those eejits who continue to vote for them because they feel anyone who's not a cog in the machine deserves punished. Fuck them.

@popcornwizard I wanted to clarify your definition of part time as it seems to differ from my own. I am contracted for 39 hours per week, and that is considered full time in my industry, also public sector, so I'm not sure why a GP working 36-45 hours a week is considered part time, if you take out all of the responses where a GP works 'part time' but at that number of hours, you seem to be left with very very few who actually work hours that would be considered part time in most industries, thus answering your question about whether a lot of GPs work part time. To accurately answer your question, the term part time needs to be defined.

walking so how do you propose to fix the GP recruitment crisis?

Older GPs are retiring (many taking early retirement as they're so burned out) and there aren't anywhere near enough applicants to replace them, let alone deal with the increased patient demand. Fewer and fewer Drs are going into general practice, so how is your 'full time only' rule going to get more Drs becoming GPs?

Given there's an enormous recruitment crisis even with these supposedly cushty hours, removing the right to part time working might squeeze a few more days out of some existing GPs, but that's likely to be outweighed by the number of GPs who would leave the profession.

So Drs continuing to retire, plus more leaving medicine, and even fewer Drs opting to qualify as GPs. That sounds like it'll sort the problem. Oh.

so how do you propose to fix the GP recruitment crisis?

Well if they weren't allowed to routinely work part time, retire early or move into the private sector then there probably wouldn't be a crisis. GPs aren't the only profession where you work long hours and get very little thanks.

Walking give over the state dont own gps they can work where ever the hell they like and can work whatever hours they and the practice agree on.
I don’t think you are for real actually.
You are a wind up antagonistic poster looking for a bite.
You sound too silly to be taken seriously.

Most GPs work full time (or more) And that is 48 hours a week full time not 40 hours a week. They just get paid for part time hours. The ones who work more than that must be utterly knackered.
Don’t confuse part time with a 16 hour week- these are some hard core hours

Babycarrot There is no reason why the NHS cant employ GPs directly, so that they are not self employed. Its not a radical idea.

And there is no reason why a condition of having the tax payer train you to a very high level can't have conditions. e.g. you must spend x number of years working in the NHS and if you want to leave it you have to repay your tax payer funded training costs.

So, walkingdead, please help me out. I’m not a GP, I’m a hospital consultant in a speciality with a 25% vacancy rate. I’ve just gone down from 3 days to 2 because, due to a number of factors, including my own mental health, I’m really struggling to work more. But you think I should be forced to work full time? So then I become completely unable to cope and either get signed off with stress or leave completely (which I’m considering anyway)......because that’s beneficial to the NHS.

So if it goes on days worked rather than hours if I do an hour a day am I full time surely if they do 12 hours a day your full time just doing it over 3 days rather than 5

But you think I should be forced to work full time?
No that is not what I said. I assume you were on an NHS contract and your employers said is was ok for you to go part time. That is fair.

Completely different from GPs just deciding for themselves, I don't fancy working as much despite the high level of training I have been given, funded by tax payers.

I would much prefer to go to a GP who is ‘only’ working 48 hours or less. Less chance of them being overworked/tired/dehydrated/burnt out & making a mistake surely.

Another one who would like to say a big thanks to all the GPs out there!

@WalkingDead I fail to see what implementing restrictions on an already pressured, stressful & increasingly undesirable career would achieve. I’ve worked with GPs in a private setting & know that there is far more money to be earned privately for them, in much less stressful settings & that is never going to change.

I’ve worked with GPs in a private setting & know that there is far more money to be earned privately for them, in much less stressful settings & that is never going to change.

Completely agree MonsterTequila, so why should the state pay a fortune to train doctors to work in the private sector?

Well if they weren't allowed to routinely work part time, retire early or move into the private sector then there probably wouldn't be a crisis. GPs aren't the only profession where you work long hours and get very little thanks.

Hahaha

OK so no one can leave the profession

So those who are already GPs have to work till they die

The recruitment crisis is the number of GPs retiring because they're of retirement age (is this allowed? Or is general practice the only profession where you're not allowed to retire or leave the profession?) and the fact that mathematically there aren't enough doctors to replace them. Even if they were all working full time, there aren't enough GPs.

It's basic maths. Retention doesn't fix an acquisition problem

No of GPs retiring > no of Drs entering general practice

If GPs are then to never be allowed to retire or leave the profession (or work part time) then this is obviously going to encourage lots more Drs to go into general practice. Oh no, wait. That would make an already-undesirable profession even more undesirable.

You're obvs a wind up merchant but am sure the GP practices with multiple vacant positions who can't recruit because there aren't enough Drs would love a nice easy solution to the problem.

Well if they weren't allowed to routinely work part time, retire early or move into the private sector then there probably wouldn't be a crisis.

Bullshit. They'll just leave the profession or emigrate because you cannot force people to work all the hours you want them to or press gang them.

bananafish81 Perhaps you should read my posts before writing a long reply ranting at things I didn't say. Bias much?