To wonder if we’re doing the wrong thing by having 1 year old in nursery?

[ethelfleda]

I keep googling and reading differing opinions. Are nursery environments damaging to young children? I know MN are great at finding studies and research on this kind of thing!

Basically, DS started nursery recently - just two days a week. One day is a long day (8.30 to 5.15) and the second day is 8.30 until about half 2. We have been able to keep it down to 2 days as I’ve returned back after a year mat leave and accrued enough holiday to use 3 days a week.

Originally, the plan was for me to return full time next year. We’ve decided this will be too much for DS who will only be 15 months by then so we are negotiating reduced hours with work so we can both (DH and I) work from home one day each, and I can finish early the other days so I can pick him up by 4pm

But I’m worried this will still be too much. I keep reading about causes of mental health problems in later life and I’m terrified! And I hate leaving him!

Our only other option would be to remortgage the house and pay off debt to have more disposable income each month and we could just about afford for me to quit work completely. But I don’t think I want to be a full time SAHP - I don’t think it will do me any good... but is that selfish??

I’m looking for actual solid opinions on this - the good and bad.

You are right so right that everything you read will be extreme reports, mainly bad because that's what they focus on. There is a culture in the UK that overall, putting kids in childcare before the age of 3 is bad for them, yet its a very common things to do in countries like the USA or France.

My view is that it very much depend on the child and the nursery. My DD was in nursery ft from the age of 9 months, 8 to 4 with travel. Looking back, I can say with confidence that not only she thrived there but it was the best for her. She is a very sociable person and has always needed a lot of stimulation. Nursery setting was perfect for her and I really think she benefitted more than if she'd been at home with me. She is now at Uni studying for a very academic subject that requires her to be sociable and good with people.

DS though didnt fare as well as this led me to reduced my hours so he could be one day at home just with me before he started school. This was so much better for him and I wished I'd done it sooner. He still enjoyed going but he is more a 1to1 person.

In the end, listen to your child and the personality that shines through him. Don't let guilt decide, let alone what others tell you.

I manage a nursery and both my children went to the nursery 4 days a week from 6 months old. They loved it and were safe and happy. The days/hours you have described are perfect - not too much or too long. My eldest son is now 12 and is still best friends with a boy he met in the baby room of nursery at 6 months old!

Just to echo what others have said as well, working from home with a toddler would be near on impossible. Could you even do a half day at nursery for balance? I do wonder what the pay off would be for DC being at home not really understanding why you can't play with them etc Vs undivided attention and fun at nursery. Working from home with a child is not the comparison various studies were based on.

I would also question the guardian article that says children don’t play with each other until 3. Mine has been playing with another little girl at nursery from about 18-20m. They adore each other like sisters and quite clearly play with each other and not just alongside. Now they are 21/2 their games together are becoming more elaborate and imaginative. There is another pair of children in her room that have done the same thing. Staff have said they were earlier than normal to do this but the social interaction and developing friendship have been lovely to see.

@user you are so right. Some children do play with each other from an early age. My son and his friend were playing together at 12 months - nursery said it was unusual for such young babies to do this but not unheard of. Their little faces used to light up when they saw each other 😍
They're still best friends and just had a joint birthday party.
They've not been damaged by being in nursery. In fact it's been massively beneficial for both of them.

I’ve read the wfh comments and understand what some of you are saying. My boss and I have agreed to review on a regular basis and if it isn’t working (maybe especially when he gets older and is toddling around!) then I will reduce my pay and only work in the office.

He started his nursery mid October and they do seem like a good one. It did occur to me after that a childminder maybe would have been better but I think the nursery that he is in now will be better for when he is older - maybe 2.5 to 3.

However, I wonder if it is more damaging now to take him out and start with a childminder when he seems to have started settling in fairly well? He still gets marginally upset at drop off - but not as much as before. He was a happy boy when I picked him up yesterday and he has eaten more there than all week - so maybe nursery is right for him.

Thanks again for the advice.

From that Guardian article people keep posting:

/The research also showed that good-quality childcare had a positive effect on cognitive and language development.

Should these findings influence a parent considering nursery care for an under-two? Perhaps not, Belsky says. "Whether we are talking about the good news or the bad news, these are small effects," he says.

"When mothers come to me, and say, 'What should I do with my kid?' I say, 'The truth is these effects are small enough … I don't know if this is a decisive enough finding to tell you what to do with your kid. It's a probability not a certainty. The probability looks small, the effect is modest, not big. You might conclude therefore not to worry about it'."/

So even the guy who wrote the study admits that the negatives are as small as the positives and that an individual parent is unlikely to notice any difference. He does, however, think that high up decision-makers should take the findings into account considering more and more children are being put in childcare (largely due to government and societal pressures to have both parents working) that these small changes could in theory slowly lead to a more disobedient and aggressive population.

So don't worry so much. There are benefits too as long as you think your child is happy and well cared for.

You can't work from home with a child. It's not fair to work and not fair to dc.

At nursery dc will be with others, building relationships, doing activities, working within the early years framework and getting lots of exposure to other things as well as learning how to be sociable etc.

What can you possibly do when you are wfh with a child? Put them in front of the tv/leave to play on their own.

I think - with the best will in the world - you need to rethink this. It's not going to work op.

I honestly don't see the issue with nursery - ds had a great time there, set him up well for school, friends and loads of different experiences.

Lizzy RTFT!!

Conversely I know parents who have waited until their child was 2 to put them in nursery. The children found it very difficult to settle at that age - because of the stage. Both sets of parents said they regretted not putting them into nursery earlier. It’s much easier for a child to start nursery at 1 than 2. I don’t know about age 3.

OP I know you’re probably fed up with everyone’s views on WFH, but in case it helps - I wfh with 15 month old DD. I’m self-employed. I do some work the evening before. I may wake up early to work. Her dad takes her for an hour in the morning. She’ll nap between 1.5 and 3 hours daily. I may then work again in the evening if needed - so it’s not a case of her spaced out in front of Hey Duggee while I’m ignoring her.

Obviously some people would look at that schedule and prefer working from an office, but it works for me and is doable. The key thing is trying to avoid things becoming urgent, to allow yourself some slack.

Thank you hummus

My ‘wfh’ day will probably be Monday and the tasks I will do mean that I can spend a little time on Saturday and Sunday on them too. And if it doesn’t work I’ll change it!

Whatever you decide to do with children is not going to be damaging - whether that be care only at home, childminder or nursery.

What is damaging is hitting your child, constant neglect and lack of care.

So please get out of the “is this going to damage my child” mindset. The anxiety will only damage you!

sorry - whatever you decide to do with childcare not children*

A post like this will always get positive and negative comments...
However, my Ds was in nursery at 8m (I worked there but not in same room) he left when he was 27m when I went on mat leave with dd. She's 11m now and currently not in nursery. Feel kind of guilty that the both of them are currently not in nursery. It's nice for them to ha e other social interaction with other children the same ages

I worried about similar with my first op. I think 'studies' have tended to focus on full time nursery care though? And I think most concluded that it was the quality of childcare, and a secure attachment to the primary carers, that was the most important thing.

Anyway, for the reasons described I decided I wanted a smaller ratio of children to carer, if possible a lot of one to one. So we chose a cm solely for the first 3 years and sent ds to nursery 1.5 days a week from age 3 to get used to larger groups prior to school. This worked well for us and we're doing the same with dd (same cm, she's brilliant). But again, it only works because of the quality of cm we've chosen and the availability of family nearby - she's never off sick, very flexible and we have family close by who help us when she takes holiday.

There are all kinds of variables involved in a child's life chances, and childcare is just one. If you have a good, close relationship with your child and choose excellent childcare it'll be fine.

I know you don't want to hear it but my personal experience of working from home with dc around is that it's very, very difficult for all kinds of reasons. Many people who do this end up doing neither their paid role or their role as a parent very well and the guilt and the stress eats away at them. But I appreciate it depends on the job. Most do not lend themselves to this kind of working, but you might have one that does. Just a word of caution more than anything, having been there myself. Its hard. But then I suppose your employer will have built in a review period to check it's working well for you both. Good luck.

I understand this is a really emotive topic and a lot of people have no choice and have to work. I also get that for a lot of parent’s mental health it’s better that they work.
However I have yet to find a nursery where I would consider sending my dcs. I had some experience of working in a few in my gap year at university and honestly it was really depressing. Most of the toddlers spent the day crying and fighting and just bored off their heads going around the same room. They were sick all the time, it was just constant. A lot of places didn’t take them outside enough. Nap times were enforced ( I get that they had to be as the nursery needed structure), there was no cuddling to sleep. Babies were put into cots whether they were crying or not. I always hear about parents saying how well the nursery gets their children to sleep....
I worked in 4 and I never, ever saw a child being comforted to sleep despite parents requesting it. I don’t believe it when I hear that they are rocking kids in buggies etc, they don’t have time.
It was all so structured which I get but was boring for the kids. Some of the staff were ok and I know I’ll get flamed but I found a common theme amongst younger nursery workers of being impatient, bored and genuinely not comprehending that the children couldn’t concentrate at story time etc. They are on very low wages and it’s very hard work. (I reported things that I saw to the manager but I was temporary d don’t know if things were resolved)
Bottom line is they don’t love your dcs, fine in playschool/school, not great for under 3’s. I get that people need to put a roof over their heads etc and maybe lots of people here know of fantastic nurseries but I haven’t come across them unfortunately. I think a lot of nurseries operate in a similar way.
I fully support mothers working as much as men post children and progressing in their career but I feel our childcare is sub-standard and needs to be addressed.
I think a lot of parents are being sold a lie.
One thing I would be a big advocate is of cameras in nurseries but pretty sad that we need them.

Most kids in continental europe go to childcare from about 16 weeks. they tend to turn out fine

My DP has the classic 9-5 Monday-Friday job and I’m a teacher so generally work 7-5. My mat leave expires in September when DS will be ten months old so will need to go into a nursery. It’s far from ideal but we have relatively young parents who still work FT so we have no relatives to help with it.

I have a lot of anxiety about it, worrying I’m going to drastically mess him up for life or cause awful separation anxiety and I have no idea how I’ll feel leaving him after spending ten months at home with him. It’s filling with dread but I worked very hard for my career and I’m not giving it up. If I struggle too much I’ll consider going part time for a while. I’m lucky I teach FE so part time is always an option.

Toothless

I really really wish I could look at a webcam to see if he was ok all day!
I know they don’t structure nap times in his nursery - they fill in a book with how much he has slept during the day. And when I picked him up yesterday, he was asleep on one of the nursery workers (and the comment on how he gives good hugs!) but he is always SHATTERED after nursery and only seems to get 20minutes here and there and the occasional hour!

I just don’t know - if I pulled him out to look for a childminder would that be more unsettling than leaving him there?? I really wish I could be a fly on the wall when he is in there!

Toothless you do realise that nurseries are all regulated and inspected by OFSTED, don’t you? I can’t argue with what you say is first hand evidence, but I really do doubt that it is how the majority of nurseries are run. What you describe bears no resemblance whatsoever to my son’s nursery and I say that with confidence despite of course not having seen it as a fly on the wall. We do get regular video updates via the Tapestry app though.

They get clingy about 18 months, so that's a ad time for changes if you can avoid it.
Talk to staff, they'll tell you how he is, follow your gut feeling

*bad time, doh

I don't recognise @Toothlessgrin s description at all. I am sad that that is her experience but bears no resemblance to either of my DSs nurseries. (Two nurseries as we moved house both I would have used for both of them if I could)
Both of them spend / spent loads of time outside either in the garden or on walks/trips, have good nap arrangements & a lot of the carers at both nursery's have kids themselves so know exactly what small kids are like.
I can drop in at anytime (and have due to varied pickups) and find DS playing well with friends, staff or on his own. He is happy and can tell me what he's done in a day, which is usually loads of different activities due to the fact that 2yos have the attention spans of gnats.
No crying, boredom or neglect. Staff are good at cuddles, attention and knowing the kids as individuals.
I know not all nurseries are equal but both of the ones I have experienced have been good.

My DS was in nursery 2 long days from 9-14 months when I left my job for unrelated reasons. I'm actually going back to work 2 days a week mainly because i want him to go back to nursery - the socialisation and stimulation is good for them and it gets them ready for school.