To think that you can pass on MH issues to children?

[plumprincess]

Please bear with me on this one. I'm looking for genuine advice. I'm not stupid but I'm also not massively intelligent and so reading up and researching articles and theories doesn't seem to go in for me.

My entire family suffer from some form of MH issue. My grandma was the worst, I aren't actually sure what she had but let's just say she was batshit crazy. I have 2 aunties both with BPD, 2 uncles both diagnosed psychopaths an auntie with schizophrenia. That's my mums side. My dads side I have 3 aunties all of whom suffer from BPD and my dad is also schizophrenic. Luckily my mother, my siblings and my generation of cousins all seem to have 'skipped' having any form of MH issues.
I myself suffered a trauma during childhood which let me to being under the MH services for the majority of my teenage years and early adult life. I went through a lot of therapy and am no longer under a MH team.

Because of this I have never had my own children, I am absolutely petrified that I would pass on some kind of mental health issue to them and their lives would be misery. Is this possible? Is it a genetic or is it just luck of the draw?

My partner is desperate for children and has always wanted to have a big family. Over the last couple of years I have found a million excuses to keep putting him off, it's not the right time, we can't afford it, we're still young etc. The thing is it's breaking my heart because I've always wanted my own family too. I've dreamt of having my own kids for as long as I can remember. I feel that I'm at a time in my life where the maternal pull is happening more and more. I sometimes just ache inside thinking about being pregnant and how happy it would make me and my partner.
The only issue I have is that I really am torn because I have convinced myself that should I choose to go ahead and have children then it would be my fault if they do end up suffering from MH issues. It would break my heart and I would forever feel guilty that I chose to bring them into this world knowing there was a chance that they would suffer.

Please can someone just give me some advice, even if it's to confirm what I believe or to go against me and tell me I'm being absolutely ridiculous.
If it is true and MH issues are genetic then how do people manage? How do they help their children to cope?

I feel so worried about all of this and it hasn't even happened yet. It's just delaying me and my partner from having a family and each day that passes I worry he will end up leaving and finding someone that does want to have a family with him without any issues.

airyfairy I hear you.

Great post OP. I'm also grappling with thus horrendous issue.

I think it's a combination of genetics, nuture and what shit you get. (Adverse Childhood Experiences).

My ex's family, the males have a ling history of severe depression and anxiety. Ex now has Bipolar diagnosis, but there has been a lot of toxic parenting in the last two generations that we know of. My mum, long history of depression and anxiety stemming from an abusive childhood.

My ex's bad mental health has had a devastating impact on our family. Being sectioned twice, plus three close family deaths in 2.5 years and parents separation has left my lovely ds10 with ptsd which 4 weeks ago literally paralysed him. No support from CAMHS for 6 months. Dd has ASD diagnosis, struggling. I think ex also ASD.

I'm now signed off with depression anxiety caused by 8 years of chronic stress.

I sooo wanted kids. If I knew then what I know now, I wouldn't ( depressed mind talking). My kids are however totally amazing, very much loved.

But as others have said, my life for the last six years has been a nightmare and for my Ds I'm very worried about his future mental health.

@Pollaidh - good post!

Someone can be born a psychopath but if brought up in a loving environment then can become a determined often successful individual - many people in banking etc would register high on psychopathy scale but can be family men/women.
We have a lot of bipolar on one side of family (Inc me) and an axe murderer on other (joys!). None of the offspring of myself, siblings, cousins etc have shown any signs of potential issues (babies to 20s). I did bring it up early on at docs when discussing family history and in fact had myself assessed for BP before conceiving as heard could be linked to postpartum psychosis. It was a real fear for me but docs were lovely, told me signs to look out for and what could advise DH to do so as well. Never had any issues or depression, it seemed to really help my BP bizarrely and couldn't be happier.
That's my experience, I totally get the fears of others and I feel so much for anyone going through that with their children. It's no difference to any physical illness and must be heartbreaking.
But one thing I always remember the first doc saying to me - the fact you are aware of it, concerned about it and activily doing something about it means that you are much less likely to experience it.

If I'm completely honest @Fettuccinecarbonara adoption is not something that I have previously considered until you just said that.
How would that go down though? Me and my partner are both physically fit and well, healthy, no infertility issues that we know of, both able to have our own children can provide for them and support them. Would this not be looked upon as strange to adopt because I worry about my biological child suffering from MH issues?
I'm not asking you specifically but you have posed a great question.
For what it's worth I highly doubt my partner would want to adopt when he's been so set on starting a family of his own. I think if circumstances were different and we were unable to conceive a child ourselves that would obviously be an option I'm guessing.

AnyFairy and MrsCarmody- thank you both for your bravery and honesty in sharing what must be incredibly raw emotions . What parent would want their children to be in constant suffering and pain, of whatever kind? But somehow, mental pain is something that doesn't seem real to everyone.

I remember begging a psych to let me die, saying, "You'd be prosecuted if you allowed an animal to suffer like this". I don't discuss this with my parents - what's the point in upsetting them, after all? - but I am certain, in their imperfectly expressed way, it is horrendous to know that your daughter is in mental agony, and possibly even more distressing than to see her in acute physical pain. I wouldn't blame either of them if, in their heart of hearts, they wish I hadn't been born, for my sake if not theirs.

That would make three of us

Gallows humour aside, had I not made my mind up so young, I still would never have had children: I wouldn't wish my mh problems on my worst enemy (and believe me, I used to plot the demise of one of my senior colleagues in quite uncomfortable detail... At least, according to my colleagues: personally, I was extremelycomfortable with it!) let alone someone I loved with all my heart. It's far from a certainty, but in my case, any risk at all was just too high.

But OP does sound incredibly self-aware and thoughtful: from the outside, there's no reason to suppose at this stage there's any automatic likelihood that her children would go on to develop problems. And as a pp said, far from all rapists and murderers are psychopaths - in fact, they are far more likely to become successful business people, statistically, than incarcerated for terrible crimes.

Ah, x post again.

Carpet I love that idea - a pre-disposition and not a destiny: thank you

I do find some of the advice on here extremely sad. You never fully know what you’re going to get when you have a child. From the OPs post there is no indication that she couldn’t provide a happy and loving home and there is every chance she won’t have a child with mental health problems. Yes she might but so might someone with no genetic history.

I do think that MH issues can be genetic - my DF and all his siblings have various issues, and I have suffered with anxiety and depression.
BUT I think with regards to your DC being affected, I strongly believe that it's the way in which you parent, and how you handle your illness, that determines the extent of it.
For example, my DF was always a slave to his MH issues - had several long spells off work, slightest little thing would set him off ranting, and we all walked on eggshells all the time. I think that contributed massively to my MH issues, but I recognise it so I am different with my DC.

Sorry, that was longer than intended! in short, if you are in a happy relationship and both want DC, don't let worries about future MH issues stop you. It sounds like you'll be lovely parents

It sounds like a donor egg might be the answer for you, OP. Have you considered this?

No I haven't @HollowTalk but it's a very good suggestion. Something I would of course need to look into thoroughly but it's a nice thought to think all hope is not lost. That I have options as have been suggested with other posts is really starting to help me feel a lot better about my situation. Thank you.

I believe some of it is learned behaviour . My dad , mum and siblings have MH issues but I don't despite me having delay with more trauma than any of them . I don't really know why I'm ok except that I have always been able to accept how things are and not fight against them . If you are stable and secure your children should Well be too. Of course simply the act of worrying about them could cause you problems and create problems with those children .. nothing is guaranteed

I think there are two separate issues here. The first is the inherited MH issue. The second is the behaviour that results from it. You see, I am convinced that it's the first that is hereditary, not the second. As far as I am aware, there is not a MH issue called being a murderer or being a rapist. Different conditions may be associated with poor impulse control or difficulties with empathy. But what you do with those tendencies may still be influenced by your upbringing and your surroundings.

In my family, apart from a physical disability, we also have a tendency to high anxiety, depression and sudden mood swings. It doesn't affect absolutely everyone but it affects a lot of us. On the other hand, we also have a family tradition, going back for generations, of looking after children well, providing a supportive home environment, and being very strictly honest. This is learnt behaviour, passed down through the generations. This seems to keep us more or less safe: the mood swings that could lead to violence under other circumstances are kept under some control by the existence of a very strong support network.

My 22yo dd is one of the worst affected: her anxiety is such that she can become completely disorientated and unable to make her way home. But otoh she knows that she can ring home at any time of night or day and I will talk her through the situation and help her to come down. If it had not been for the support network, I believe she would have killed herself by now. But there is a balance there and she in turn has learnt how to be supportive of the people in her generation.

OP please don't listen to the people pushing you about adoption Every time a fertility issue is mentioned on here ignorant, ill informed people start whinging on about adoption even though they know nothing about the adoption system and still think it's stuck in 1950s.

The adoption system these days is totally different, it's no longer a service to give childless couples children, it's about finding the best family for the children. These days most younger children are not adopted by childless couples, SS usually prefer experienced parents who already have children as they are able to deal with challenges better and already know what having a child is like and can cope better.

It's not like the 1950s where unmarried mothers were forced into homes to give birth and their babies taken away straight away and given to adopters. There is no line of healthy, white babies waiting to be adopted these days.. Children who are being adopted are rarely given up willingly or orphaned. As few as sixty babies per year have been adopted here recently. Most of them will have gone to parents who already have children, many are ethnic minority children who aren't matched with white parents. And absolutely all of them would be coming from horrendously chaotic backgrounds with mental illness, addiction and violence.

If you were honest with SS (I hope you would be) and told them that you were worried about children having a genetic MH issue, you would be instantly rejected from adopting as children who are adopted are massively likely to have the genetic disposition anyway, so your anxieties about that would make you an unsuitable parent for them. A lot of the older children would already have MH issues, somebody with anxiety about children having MH issues would not be suitable for them. Plus they go through your whole background. Somebody with serious criminal convictions, lots of MH in the family and a background of abuse would not be passed. You have to jump through loads of hoops: housing, debt, finances, familial support, references - and the majority of the people who go through it never get a child.

The people who scream 'adopt' every time would probably be interested to know that they would likely not be approved to adopt themselves.

Egg donation is unlikely to be possible for you. Priority for donor eggs goes to those who do not have their own eggs, or have conditions with a provable genetic links and cause extreme disabilities and short life expectancy. A family history of MH wouldn't get you an egg off a clinic. Your best option for that is a friend donating an egg as they would not have your families genetics, a big ask, most people who source their own eggs get them from family, but that probably isn't an option too.

I hope you manage to find a plan you're both happy with, but realistically, having a baby the traditional way is likely to be your only option.

Apologies for my mini rant, the 'Why don' t you just adopt' idiots on here grind my gears.

There's absolutely no guarantee a donor egg wouldn't have a predisposition to MH anyway. And they wouldn't be able to tell from embryo screening either.

Sorry OP, you're family have serious convictions, not you!

Your family, YOUR. FFS., I need to go to bed.

Wow thank you @Gingerrogered for such a lovely and extremely sensible post. You are very well informed (or perhaps just speak common sense) and it was so refreshing to read. This is why I love MN, there is always so many different opinions and advice given. For every bit of advice there is someone to offer the other side of it. As I mentioned in my opening post, I'm not stupid but I'm not highly intelligent neither and so I wouldn't have even thought of all of the points you made. Thank you again 😊

As an idea, if you feel strongly about this have you considered IVF using donor eggs?

That way you still get motherhood and your husband is a father but the “dicey genes” are removed from the equation.

Thanks OP, I also agree with other posters that you sound like you would make a lovely, unselfish mother. The fact your thinking about a child's welfare up and beyond your own desire for a baby makes it pretty clear you are able to put a child's needs before your own, that's a hallmark for a good mother.

@Gingerrogered please do your research-psychopaths are born and sociopaths are made
Please don't tell people wrong in formation and claim it to be true

🤦‍♀️ I’m late to the party on the donor egg
Sorry.

Also what ginger wrote about adoption is spot on. It is not for the faint of heart

lyndar, I've done my research, from, like proper research papers. You don't have a scooby what you are talking about. There has been some research done in recent years which suggests there is a biological basis for psychopathy, possibly a brain abnormality, but that doesn't mean everybody with that abnormality will be a psychopath, nor that it is the only factor which causes it. It's pretty much unanimously accepted it is a combination of nature and nurture.

Besides, anybody who is prepared to say such an ignorant, foul and offensive thing to the OP is making it perfectly obvious their opinions are worthless.

Threadastaire
How dare you say I'm cruel.
I have decades of experience of this.
Lives have been destroyed.
Living it every day.
Advice about these types of illness needs straight talking and honesty which is not cruelty.
You studied it a bit a uni ??? Ha ha.