Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To not understand this? From a school? Giving bad reviews is illegal isn't it..

126 replies

Momasita · 02/11/2018 23:04

So my dd needs a head teachers reference to help with grammar school application and the head doesn't give them?
She or her staff mark the tick box stuff, Wright numbers... On how eligible dd is but the part of the form where she needs words.. Is blank?

How is this legal?
People warned me about this... And I thought to myself.. Dd has such glowing reports our head couldn't possibly leave her box blank!!

Now other parents come out of woodwork to nervously say... She doesn't belive in grammars and she won't help. She has been over heard sneering at parents who tutor etc.

I'm just astounded. How is this even legal??
My dd form teacher... Who also happens to be the heads daughter ShockHmm has told us she hopes the form helps??

I'm thinking.... No! Of course leaving heads comments blank hasn't helped.the review panel will have minuets to sift through hundreds of applications and they will be full of in depth heads glowing reports!

I can't get my head round it. I also rang the office and got a nervous... We don't know much about these forms....

OP posts:
PurpleDaisies · 02/11/2018 23:38

It isn’t your job as a head to assist in getting your pupils into grammar schools. Confused

Practically, references take time that could be better spent on actual school matters.

It would have been nice if she’d done it as a favour but she wasn’t under any obligation to fill the form in.

multivac · 02/11/2018 23:39

Perhaps she was working under the premise that, 'if you can't say anything nice, say nothing at all'?

She's not a hairdresser, or a florist; your daughter's suitability for grammar school isn't something you can purchase or demand.

PurpleDaisies · 02/11/2018 23:39

And I’m a teacher. My students and their parents certainly don’t automatically get what they want. It’s totally different to the paying client relationships you’ve written about above.

jelliebelly · 02/11/2018 23:43

You are not a paying client you cannot demand a particular service!

WhatToDoAboutWailmerGoneRogue · 02/11/2018 23:47

Neither you nor your daughter are clients. She has done you a favour by filling in the form; it is not her job to include additional comments.

GrandmaSharksDentures · 02/11/2018 23:48

Log it with 101

Original poster
Momasita · 02/11/2018 23:54

Sand snake I have vague views on grammar really. We just looked at lots of local schools without prejudice thinking what best school for her would be. It came down to two and one she can't get into.

OP posts:
GabsAlot · 02/11/2018 23:55

one does not owe another a review

its like asking a doctor to do your pasport form for free theyve got better things to do

multivac · 02/11/2018 23:58

She failed the exam. She didn't jump through that particular hoop on that particular day (or rather, one of her peers jumped through it a bit more efficiently than she did), so she's ruled out. This is the system you want to buy into; don't throw your toys out of the pram when it bites you on the arse.

Original poster
Momasita · 03/11/2018 00:00

Wow so purple your saying you won't support pupils when that doesn't fit in with your personal views?

Yes we are clients. Just like NHS isn't actually free. We pay for schools.

I suppose she has done us a favour by being our head Grin

I don't belive personal politics has a place in schools. Or personal views to a degree.

The school is there to serve and educate our children to the absolute best of its ability.

They can't start to curtail, disadvantage dc due to own beliefs.

OP posts:
spicedemerald · 03/11/2018 00:02

It’s not part of a head’s job to fill in grammar school references!

The schools in my LEA aren’t supposed to promote them in any way so our heads wouldn’t even fill the numbers in on a form let alone fill in a text box.

WhatToDoAboutWailmerGoneRogue · 03/11/2018 00:06

No, you are not clients. Don’t be ridiculous.

Considering what an arduous and thankless career teaching is (especially when dealing with parents like you), she has done you a favour by accepting the head teacher job. You should be grateful.

People are leaving the profession in droves and new recruits are hard to come by. Nobody wants to do it because of attitudes like yours, OP.

Original poster
Momasita · 03/11/2018 00:08

One of her peers jumped through it because they were tutored for years before.

It's not a system we have brought into.
Sadly we didn't buy into it.

Had we known this position, the process and the importance of a heads review we would have reviewed our situation.

It's placed us in a very tricky situation.

I'm in education myself but working with very disadvantaged students. The irony is I wasn't far off what some of them have experienced aside from those with health or learning issues.

I see all of them as individuals with individual needs. It's part of my job to support them in reaching their goals whatever they may be.

They are my clients. It's my job to support them.

OP posts:
prh47bridge · 03/11/2018 00:08

The head is not obliged to give a reference for a grammar school local review.

I doubt the appeal panel will have to sift through hundreds of applications. Most of those who fail the 11+ do not apply for review.

Whether the head failing to give a reference will matter is impossible to tell. The review panel, faced with loads of glowing references, may simply ignore the references and concentrate on other information.

Theyprobablywill · 03/11/2018 00:09

If you asked your hairdresser to give you a Brazilian wax she'd probably tell you to fuck off, because you may be her client but it isn't her job.
The headteacher's job is to deliver an education to her students, not to write references for your daughter.

multivac · 03/11/2018 00:11

'Supporting them' doesn't mean making up stuff for a grammar school application. Sorry.

superram · 03/11/2018 00:13

I’m with spice’s head-I wouldn’t fill in the form at all as it’s not my job. Hey would a reference help when she failed the test? She failed (or not as the head of the grammer on the bbc programme says) so therefore no place. Not sure what a primary head could say to help. She has a school to run, you aren’t a client (and you using that term has really pissed me off). The ethos of grammars is that you pass a test-your child didn’t (neither would mine) suck it up.

PurpleDaisies · 03/11/2018 00:15

Wow so purple your saying you won't support pupils when that doesn't fit in with your personal views?

She has supported the application by filling in the quick part of the form. I bend over backwards to do the best for my pupils. Sometimes that means saying no to parents.

Yes we are clients. Just like NHS isn't actually free. We pay for schools.

You are one of those parents. It’s all about you and your rights because you pay my salary. I know your type. I’m surprised you work in education with that attitude.

LittleBittyKitty · 03/11/2018 00:29

And I'm surprised you work in education with your poor spelling...

SilverySurfer · 03/11/2018 00:31

The headteacher ticked the boxes and I think YABU to assume she should be writing further for every student. Companies' references have for a longtime been mostly factual statements, ie Fred Bloggs worked for the Company from A to B etc.

I don't understand why it has placed you in a very tricky situation.

As your DD failed the exam or was borderline are you sure the grammar is the best school for her? She may find the work rather hard.

Marmalady75 · 03/11/2018 00:40

So would you want the headteacher to write lies in the box to keep you happy or state that since your dd failed her exams she is unsuitable for a grammar?
If you work in education you might want to check how to use “your” and “you’re” correctly.

RadicalFern · 03/11/2018 00:40

The Headteacher is not employed by you, you are not their client. That is not how that relationship works. The Headteacher is employed by the LEA to run the school, which your child just happens to attend. She is not required to write references for your child. You paying your taxes has nothing to do with it. I pay mine too.

Also, in that the amount that you would "pay to the school" if you were earning £25,000 a year would be around £4 per teaching day, I don't think that you could be considered to be paying the head teacher enough to deviate from the parameters of her job.

FennyBridges · 03/11/2018 00:45

Love some of these replies. Good advice op.

Poloshot · 03/11/2018 00:45

Unfortunately if your child failed the exam why would she go over and above to try and get her into the school. I think the grammar school system is fantastic and went to one myself, but if you don't pass you don't pass everyone can have excuses they have to draw a line surely and it can only be done on the merits of the exam otherwise all sorts of things come into the equation.

KumquatQuince · 03/11/2018 00:56

OP we had the same with our DD, she didn’t pass and we managed to get her through on selection review which I assume is what you are going through (we are in Bucks). You can pm me if you want, I can try and help.

I agree with you that what the head thinks about the grammar school system should not influence her doing the best for your DD in getting her into the school that suits her best. And if she has rated her as a 1 then she believes she should be in a grammar school.

Presumably you get to write a piece - our head advised us to do 3 sections: (1) an outline of our DD and how wonderful (!) she is at absolutely everything, (2) how shocked we were that she didn’t pass, and (3) any mitigating circumstances we could think of as to why she hadn’t done as well as she could. In this note you could mention that the head hasn’t written anything as she doesn’t support the system. You had better check with her first that this is actually the case. I think you should ask anyway why she hasn’t filled that part in. We also enclosed a copy of DD’s latest report and a copy of some evidence supporting (3). I would advise you also say she hasn’t had tuition, as nearly everyone that passes has had it IME.

I personally don’t agree with grammmar schools (despite having been to one myself) but would never project that and let my feelings affect me doing the best for my own child. Your head should think about that too.

I really feel for you OP, it is a very stressful time. I hope you are successful.

Swipe left for the next trending thread