to be really surprised that the school assumed these things?

[JessieMcJessie]

I emailed a local school to ask about visiting because we are thinking of sending our son there. My email didn’t state my title and referred to “we” and “our son” but didn’t say explicitly that his other parent was male, or that we were married.

The email came back “Dear Mrs McJessie” and asked me to give my husband’s full name if he was joining me on the visit.

AIBU to be very surprised that they just assumed that I (a) went by “Mrs” (b) was married and (c) was heterosexual? In actual fact they were correct on all three counts, but that’s not the point- I thought that people were a bit more careful to assume nothing in this day and age.

Can I ask why the people who are so.....emphatic.... about this are so emphatic?
What is it about "Dear Bertrand Russell. I am looking forward to meeting you on Monday. Please could you let me know the names of anybody who is coming with you. Thank you. Best wishes Wackford Squeers" that makes you so cross?

I would be very cross that Wackford Squeers is still working in education Bertrand - is it an academy?

Against the grain but I think YANBU. I don't actually think it's a 'political correctness' issue - I just think it's bizarre to assume something they don't know.

It’s one of the few business jargon cliches that I think is actually worth bearing in mind
“Never assume because it makes an ass of u and me. “

" would be very cross that Wackford Squeers is still working in education Bertrand - is it an academy?"

Yes. That's how they have a budget to pay me as a peripatetic philosophy teacher.

Also, never assume when you have a 36% chance of being wrong is a good one too.

Yanbu. Close to 50% of children are now born to unmarried parents. The idea that every woman with a child has a husband is hopelessly outdated.

I'd say get used to it.

I have 3 children. On the application form for child number 1, I wrote my name under mother and dh's name (different) under father. All communications from the school were addressed to Mr and Mrs dhsSurname. I asked for it to be corrected and communications for ds came to DhName and MyName, so I thought all good.

I filled in application form for child number 2, same names. Child listed as sibling to child number 1 so they were connected in the database. All communications for child number 2 addressed to Mr and Mrs DhSurname. I corrected it.

Child number 3, same thing. After banging my head on the table, I again corrected it. Finally, all communications addressed to DhName and MyName.

I had children's names down for multiple secondary schools, probably 6 in total. All but 1 addressed communication to Mr and Mrs DhSurname despite me clearly writing my name and dh's name on the application forms.

In my DC's school the teachers/TAs address all parents as "Mr or Mrs Child's Surname" when speaking to us, which I think is fine as it's much easier for them. I think they have enough to do without having to sit down and learn all the parents' names/titles/how they like to be addressed.

In my DC's school the teachers/TAs address all parents as "Mr or Mrs Child's Surname" when speaking to us, which I think is fine as it's much easier for them.

This reminds me of the old practice of calling servants traveling with their employers by the employer's surname.

My surname is different from my husband's and my children's. In all their days of schooling, never once did I experience a teacher getting my name wrong. I really don't think it's that hard. It's basic respect and worth a bit of extra effort.

Yep. So much easier to assume all women are married. It's nicer anyway. And kinder not to draw attention to their living in sin status and their bastard children. Fuck me, what century are we in?

@nicebitofquiche - I think dear parent/carer is perfectly adequate in most cases for administrative correspondence, it’s commonly used in my school too. I think you might underestimate how annoying it can be to be wrongly refferred to though, just cos it doesn’t bother you doesn’t mean it’s not a problem. What’s especially annoying is when, as PPs have said, you actually correct someone and they carry I getting it wrong. It’s rude.

The time when it's difficult isn't when replying to emails which have been signed with a name (reply to full name, sign with full name - though someone will still get humphy about no title).

Its tricky when doing those annoying parent-child-teacher consultation days, when as a core subject secondary teacher you sit on a plastic chair for 10 straight hours, and parent plus child after parent plus child comes in to talk to you for 10 minute slots.

You have to establish what to call each adult. Obviously some aren't actually parents, so carer plus child (grandparent, sibling, dad's new girlfriend, foster carer ...)

I messed up the first year and made a performance of asking the child to introduce me from the second year, but of course they said "this is my mum/ sister/ Geraldine..." and I still didn't actually know how to address them. It takes up 1/10th of the time slot to establish introductions and dance about hoping they'll respond to your introducing yourself by actually telling you their name, and then you'll refer to them as Mr or Ms but they might be Dr or Professor or Rev, or want to be called Miss or Mrs...

Not to say it shouldn't be done, it should. Sometimes slipping up is excusable though!

I now realised we should have done a little lesson on formal introductions with every class - "Good afternoon, Ms Forests, this is my mum, Reverend Green, Mum, this is Ms Forests" ...

Bertrand I hope you aren't a pilot for a new initiative to triple the teaching retirement age?

“Hello, I’m Bertrand Russell, Hermione’s teacher. What’s your name? Thank you. Now, Ms Grainger, I am very pleased with Hermione’s progress....”

This is still going!? Wowser!
This: living in sin status and bastard dc Bertrand

We have preferred correspondance names on our database at school so we know to address to Mr X and Ms Y or whatever people's preference. I do agree it is annoying if staff can't be bothered to check that.

Having said that, it is infuriating when parents want us to be on first name terms. I am not your friend! I have the same feeling when Natwest or similar ask if they can call me by my first name. So if you were a parent I did not know, I would have to guess at a Mr or Ms + surname based on your email address I suppose.

Mummyoflittledragon who ever signs emails from two people.

I do it rarely for official correspondence and only when ccing dh.

I began the email by saying “we are thinking of applying for DS to attend X school”.

If you start with “we” instead of “my partner and I”, you are indicating the correspondence is from more than one person. As this is your initial contact with the school, it would be prudent to sign off from the relevant parties even over email.

Had you started “my partner and I”...... “we” this and “we” that and signed off as just yourself, not ambiguous.

Instead of admitting your correspondence lacked clarity, you started a thread about how you thought the world had moved on and your surprise that the admissions officer assumed you are married and in a heterosexual relationship. Yes it was presumptuous of them. It doesn’t mean they’re a bigot. It probably means they’re busy, receive lots of similar correspondence and more obviously the majority of parents, whose dcs attend fee paying schools have 2 heterosexual married parents.

As for having a standard template, where no one can be offended. I don’t think that will work. Someone will always be offended.

"As for having a standard template, where no one can be offended. I don’t think that will work. Someone will always be offended."
Nobody has been "offended" on this thread!

I think I AM starting to get offended now Bert at the way people are refusing to believe me when I say that !

I never said you were offended. I was thinking about people like your lesbian friend, who may be offended for being assumed to be in a hetero relationship. Or the devout, who think they can “pray the gay away”, who would be offended for any assumption of them being in anything other than a hetero marriage.

"I never said you were offended. I was thinking about people like your lesbian friend, who may be offended for being assumed to be in a hetero relationship. Or the devout, who think they can “pray the gay away”, who would be offended for any assumption of them being in anything other than a hetero marriage."

So don't assume any of those things. It's really easy.

I agree with you OP.

I work in a school and I never assume parents' names and marital situations. So many times I've been glad that I didn't assume Mr/Mrs + same name as child! So many different family situations and different cultures that don't follow the trad English pattern.

It costs me nothing and saves me from looking old fashioned, closed minded and thoughtless. Win win.

Yanbu op. How incredibly clunky and old fashioned of the school.

I think that when you’re dealing with schools you have to remember this: it’s about your children and you not important here. Schools are the last bastion of formality; it’s really important to (a lot of) teachers to maintain their status as Mr Smith or Mrs Brown. So they make a point of addressing parents in the same way as to do otherwise would imply a lack of equal status and would be seen as rude. Nobody cares if you’re Miss Smith or Mrs Brown; nobody cares if you’re gay or straight or married or not. She’ll have addressed you as “Mrs McJessie” solely to ram home the point that you need to call her Mrs Jones and the head Mr Bloggs.

I agree Natalia. If only the same prevailed in the NHS where everyone calls the Dr Miss, Ms, Mrs, Dr or Mr. Funny how there seems to be no difficultly using the title of choice for a woman in those circumstances . But every HCP seems to think it appropriate to call the patient first name at best and love, dear, darling or mum as a matter of routine. It isn't friendly or informal. It is reductive and subliminally passive aggressive. The subliminal message is that the patient is su bordinate. For an organisation that has whole committees considering equality, it is simply gobsmacking.

For what it's worth at my dc's private schools both heads asked us to use their first names as did most senior staff. In those circs absolutely no issue with them using our first names. By 6th form the dc called many teachers by their first names.