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647 replies

travelinterest · 12/10/2018 08:59

After a conversation with friends, and with obesity (especially in young people) becoming a bigger crisis than smoking in our society, am I unreasonable to think that as we villanise smoking and drinking, should we fat shame more to encourage people to change their lifestyles. It's certainly worked with reducing smoking rates. Don't attack me (I've lost 2 stone). Just wondering why we target smoking more than fast food?

OP posts:
BumDisease · 12/10/2018 10:36

"We've definitely gone too far in celebrating obesity

Hairspray for example"

😂😂😂😂 fuck off!!!

SchadenfreudePersonified · 12/10/2018 10:36

Because if you smoke you poison the air for everyone around you.

If you overeat, you only affect yourself (and the poor bugger who has to sit next to you on a plane.)

Cakemonger · 12/10/2018 10:36

I can't even

ShamelesslyPlacemarking · 12/10/2018 10:38

as we villanise smoking and drinking

I can only assume that you haven’t watched Netflix, TV or a movie in the last decade.

GreenLantern53 · 12/10/2018 10:38

People DO fat shame. I have been on the receiving end. Hasnt made me lose weight though!

BumDisease · 12/10/2018 10:41

Got to love the weekly fat shaming thread.

Guess what, OP, I've lost more than your two stone, but guess what? I'm still fat! So obviously you'd feel entitled to shame me despite the fact I've lost more weight than you? Don't bother, you can't make me feel any worse about myself than I already do myself.

Also anyone that genuinely thinks that being overweight is somehow "accepted" or "celebrated" then you have never been overweight.

Is having a token overweight character in a musical or being able to buy a size 20 in Primark so threatening?

Tinkobell · 12/10/2018 10:42

I've been obese and i lost all the weight. I don't agree with a burgeoning "Plus sized" clothing industry which normalises being overweight. I believe that food education at life stages is what is needed. A lot of people asked me "how come you got fat in the first place". The answer is that I did nothing different at 47 years of age as I was doing at 21 years of age. I ate the same amounts of the same foods and I did the same amount of limited exercise. What changed was my ageing metabolism and I failed to make the appropriate adjustments.
With dogs with give a measured puppy diet, adult diet and finally a lower calorie senior diet. Why don't be human beings make the same life-stage based dietary adjustments ffs? I honestly think this is the heart of the obesity crisis in the developed west and it is so fixable.

missbattenburg · 12/10/2018 10:42

Christ... how intolerant have we become as a society that all we ever think when faced with an issue is "why should I be impacted by this and how can I punish the person at the heart of it?"

You should be impacted because we a society and the one single characteristic that determines which animals can live successfully together is the idea of compromise. If a dog can figure this out (or a deer, or a starling) then surely humans can?

Punishment does not and never is as affective as reward. Ever.

Besides, shame away once you have studied biology and understand the impact of dopamine, serotonin, melatonin, ghrelin and leptin on hunger, metabolism and impulse control. There's probably a ton more but even understanding those will make it painfully obvious that weight and food moderation is more than just a test of how disciplined a person you are. Even something as basic as the stress your mother experienced while you were in utero has a large impact on whether or not you find it easy or hard to avoid things you like but are bad for you.

Helperout · 12/10/2018 10:44

I don't think fatshaming will help but I think we need to stop being so pc and pussy footing around obesity. I notice that many overweight people will get very defensive about their weight and will use excuses for it like mental health issues, illness, disability, emotional issues. Once someone says they are fat because they suffer from anxiety we all feel like we are supposed to back off immediately instead of telling them the obvious - that exercise will not only help them lose weight but has been proven to help mental health issues. Many people who have disabilities can exercise in some form but its used as a catch all excuse for doing no exercise.

We all have the ability to change our lifestyles but I think there is a large (no pun intended) proportion of the population who take the lazy way out.

Tomatoesrock · 12/10/2018 10:45

I do not agree with fatshaming or any shaming, though drastic action is needed. Obviously people are aware if they are over weight, ignoring it is NOT going to work.

I purposely try to avoid looking when a really big person is walking toward me, I hear larger people put themselves down or make reference negative to their weight. It is hard to lose the weight and I get emotional eating. It has to stop as acceptable too, it is really bad. Every little helps and people really need to try for their DC and their future.

WhiteCat1704 · 12/10/2018 10:46

In UK the awareness of what an average body should look like is gone..People are fat but because there is so many they think it's normal.
Don't know if fat shaming is the answer but from my observations overweight women and girls definitely aren't ashemed of their rolls of fat judging by outfits they wear on nights out..It doesn't look good but seems to be normalised..

BumDisease · 12/10/2018 10:47

". Once someone says they are fat because they suffer from anxiety we all feel like we are supposed to back off immediately instead of telling them the obvious - that exercise will not only help them lose weight but has been proven to help mental health issues."

Wow! What a revolutionary concept! I bet they'll have never, ever heard that before.

CherryPavlova · 12/10/2018 10:50

The idea of a daily mile is better than nothing but it’s not going to give children enough exercise. Your average 4/5 year old should be able to run a mile and walk 5 without too much trouble. Exercise that raises the heartbeat is needed and pottering a mile isn’t going to do it.

As for no parking zones around schools. Parking permits. If you live closer all well and good - it won’t benefit everyone but will benefit many from more exercise and less pollution. Working parents just have to adapt and make changes for the greater good - as has always happened. More walking bus drop offs, more trusting children to walk on their own ( after about 7/8 years given current neurosis about risks), more shared walking between neighbours and friends. Campaigning for employer adaptations too.

AuntyJackiesBrothersSistersBoy · 12/10/2018 10:51

Bad idea. As with other addictions, there’s a reason people overeat.

pacer142 · 12/10/2018 10:54

I think they should put VAT all on convenience foods,

There's already VAT on sweets, crisps, fizzy drinks, takeaways, fast food, etc.

There was an outcry when Osborne tried to add VAT to sausage rolls and pasties - the public clearly didn't want it to happen and he had to back down - the fiasco blighted Osborne's future years.

Trouble with tax is that everyone wants everyone else to pay it, not themselves.

newdocket · 12/10/2018 10:57

I don't think fat-shaming is effective, nor is it kind.

Responsibility for being fat lies on a continuum from the social to the individual. There is always SOME individual responsibility but sometimes this can be a very small part of the picture. Look at the way that fast food outlets dominate the city streets in some areas for example, and the way supermarkets operate and manipulate. I think we need systemic change but it's difficult, the food/sugar industry is v powerful...

bumblingbovine49 · 12/10/2018 10:58

ffs I get so so pissed off with this. It is such lazy lazy thinking.

Smoking is an ACTION. The result of which is crap horrible lungs and illness/death. Once you have stopped smoking, people think you are fine and stop shaming you. Just imagine if people's lungs were actually visible and we only stopped shaming people when their lungs were perfectly healthy again (like never or at least a very very long time after quitting smoking!!)

The action associated with being overweight is overeating/low activity. People can be overweight and have stopped over eating and be exercising. This is because they may have changed their ACTIONS . It is just that the damaged caused to their body is visible (ie excess fat) and sometimes not completey reversible.

Shaming people for being overweight is like shaming people

I personally think it is a very good idea to stop people who are generally a normal weight from becoming over weight in the first place, so mentioning if someone who is a normal weight seems to be getting bigger is not a bad idea as people can tackle it early before it gets too bad. Sometimes people don't always notice if they are putting on weight in the early days, especially if weight goes on evenly all over your body.

However once people are really overweight though, this is counter productive as they are past the point of just being a bit careful for a few weeks to get back to normal. The damage to their body has been done. So being critical and shaming has no value at all in this example.

Instead of fat shaming overweight people who may well be tacking their actions anyways, it just might not be obvious from their weigh yet. I have been fat shamed after losing 4 stone over 8 months as I was still very overweight despite not overeating and exercising regularly for 8 months. Try that for being suicidal after that effort.

What ex smoker would be shamed, 8 months after quitting because their lungs were still damaged!!?

We need to stop people getting overweight in the first place. That is the time for a bit of tough love. One the damage is done, people need help and support to minimise the damage they have already done to their bodies, not demonising for it.

noeffingidea · 12/10/2018 11:00

I don't think we should have 'fat shaming' in the sense of insulting obese people or attacking them on a personal level, but there does need to be an adjustment of attitude on a societal level. It does work for smoking, in that smoking has gone from being as cool and glamourous, to something that is uncool. Obviously the passive smoking affects more people than just the smoking individual, but there is a personal element too.
I do believe we will see a mass government campaign along these lines, but it will have to be done in a more nuanced and positive way. Something has to change, because no country can afford for their population to become increasingly obese.

Daisymalone · 12/10/2018 11:00

To all the people saying "fat people know they're fat".. Do they? Obviously very obese people know but the amount of people you see on here saying that they're not fat- they are only a size 16. Come on, unless you're all 5'10 and broad boned most people are overweight at that size. I think modern perceptions of healthy weights have been majorly skewed by 'average' sizes going up. Yes you might be average sized in society, but unfortunately the average size person is now overweight so all perspective has been lost.

SpongeBobJudgeyPants · 12/10/2018 11:02

The OP was so goady, I wondered if there was a journo on the loose here. But it seems the OP has a posting history. Nevertheless has lit the blue touch-paper, and is now nowhere to be seen.

Gwenhwyfar · 12/10/2018 11:03

"To all the people saying "fat people know they're fat".. Do they? Obviously very obese people know but the amount of people you see on here saying that they're not fat- they are only a size 16."

This very discussion is going on on another thread now with loads of women claiming BMI doesn't apply to them for various reasons.
There were also people claiming you couldn't be fat and a size 12. You can.

BumDisease · 12/10/2018 11:03

"However once people are really overweight though, this is counter productive as they are past the point of just being a bit careful for a few weeks to get back to normal. The damage to their body has been done. So being critical and shaming has no value at all in this example"


It's well documented than once someone gets to a particular point of being morbidly obese that their chances of getting back to a "normal" (I fucking hate that) weight are practically zero, and the best way to help them is with bariatric surgery. But heaven forbid that was done on the NHS...

Elasticity · 12/10/2018 11:04

Don't fat shame. It makes them feel worse and they take comfort by eating more. It's a vicious cycle.

On the other hand I 100% do not support obese body positivity. Especially in instances where said, medically-categorised, obesity is not due to one of the small number of medical conditions that genuinely influences your weight.

This body positivity movement is effectively telling a millions of unhealthy people (who will down the line cost the NHS billions in diabetes treatments, heart conditions, hip replacements etc) that they are fine and can continue with life as they are.

pacer142 · 12/10/2018 11:06

That means that 6 in 10 cancers aren't classed as preventable. So people giving messages that obesity will lead to cancer are not telling the whole story.

Which is exactly why I was appalled at the Cancer Research publicity - so much so, I cancelled my standing order to them and moved it to a different cancer charity that hasn't turned political. It was a horrible lazy publicity stunt. I think it shows they've run out of ideas/interest in actually curing cancer or helping people to deal with it and have turned to victim shaming instead.

Someone very close to me has been diagnosed with terminal cancer at the age of 50 - never smoked, never drank, not overweight, active, healthy eating, done all tests, etc. Consultants have confirmed there are no risk factors for that specific type of cancer and no reasons - they simply don't know why people get it. How about cancer research spending their donations on research for treating/curing that type of cancer or research into the causes of it???

Tomatoesrock · 12/10/2018 11:12

I totally disagree that it is easier for a smoker in comparison, Yes they can give it up go through life never smoking again, but they do not want too, the same as larger people do not want to give him crappie food, it is down to choice in the end.

The vape proves this, how many smokers would never have stopped smoking without the vape as an alternative? So the still have familiar habits 1000s have put out fags to vape. My Dsis done both with slimming world and a vape, she said changing eating habits was much easier.

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