Children stuck between a rock and a hard place

[sef23]

Recently moved from a small quanit welsh village to the local city (Cardiff). DS (8) & DD (5) both taught welsh first language. 3 of their cousins were in the same school. Grandparents live nearby, and whole family got on well and saw each other daily. Kids were doing good in school.

Decided to move to a more multicultural area and english school, (kids are mixed race) old welsh school had 5/6 ethnic minorities out of 400 kids, but it makes no difference at that age, no bullying or racism at all. Idea was that when they are older they wont feel isolated by race, or any other 'tag'. I grew up in said village, primary was a dream, comprehensive was a nightmare.

Kids have now been crying daily for 5 weeks, they want to go 'home' hate new school. New school is great, highly estyn rated and multicultural and leads to a great secondary (highest rated), faught for 2 years to get them in, in that time they grew on and up in their welsh school more deeply immersed in the welsh language. DS is finding adjustment difficult from education viewpoint as well being taught solely in welsh, tutors and effort from us is helping, but he's still daily saying he wants to go back, as is DD as grandparents and cousins/aunts had more of a hand in their care than us, their parents who were working too much, DH especially so they feel they have been ripped from their 'safe and stable place'. They miss thier cosuins who they think of as siblongs and grandparents immensley.

DD has attended 10 days in 4 weeks , DS is going daily and despite immediately making new friends misses his old friends.

Their old school has agreed to take them back.

Do we stay or go? We dont want to prolong their agony further kids happiness is paramount but so is there future schooling which they will not think about now, also in the city much more things to do - eg swimming, tennis, etc which in the village we cant but have to drive to said city to do.

Is it more important that they are with family, or not? once cousins grow up they all go their separate ways, and their grand parents are in their 70's we want them to spend as much time with them as possible. Weekends we go back, kids dont want to leave. Cousins are out so they dont really get to see them.

Is welsh to english at year 4 too much of an adjustment to make, learning verbs, adjectives, pronounication, spelling etc all over again in english is proving hard, we dont want teachers to think they arent bright as in welsh school they were in top sets.

So confused, any advice would help.

I would not return so frequently, ask gp, cousins etc over to yours or find fun activities they can share.

You need to pull out all the stops to make your home feel like a loving and safe place for you all to settle as a family.
Get family to visit you in Cardiff.
Be calm and consistent parents.
Stop allowing the DC to see you and their DF rowing, discussing moving, dithering.

That is a lot of change for them!

How is their written & spoken English-are they likely to be finding lessons hard to understand?

As a pp puts though, if your marriage is rocky & they no longer have the stability of cousins/GPs-isn't that the biggest problem?

I would expect it to take a few months for children to adjust, so you sound like you're ready to reverse your decision very early on. We moved countries when DD was 5, with no easy way back and just had to grit our teeth and ride it out. DD went to school no matter what (unless ill). You spent years planning this move and making a decision, but now you're willing to just change everything after a very short time. Is this just because the children are crying (and they will continue to cry if you keep giving in over things), or are you also unhappy?

It sounds like you can spend weekends visiting family, seeing old friends etc so you haven't cut them off from their past life at all. You haven't moved very far. You also need to start showing them some positives of the new place - places to go, friends to have over etc so that they can settle in.

I would wait until the new year at the earliest before even beginning to think about a change of plans. You thought about this long and hard and made your decision for good reasons. Why are you so willing to change back again?

They are picking up on your and DH uncertainty you need to stop discussing that going back is an option. The communication with the DC should be about how you know change is difficult and scary and it's ok to miss "Home" but things will get better etc.

It’s hard moving children. We moved back to uk from Budapest when DS was 10. No language issues as he had been at a British international school. He hated it here. Popped up in my Facebook memories last month that on day two he said he would rather be homeless in Budapest than go to school here! He really took time to settle. Months.

But there was no talk of going back. No dithering. It was what it was.

I agree with others that you are sending mixed messages. The children need to see a united front from you and DH. Although I think it’s concerning that you say the extended family has provided familiarity and support when things are ‘fraught’ in your relationship with DH.

Stop travelling back every weekend. Start showing them the benefits of being in the city.

btw - one thing that really helped DD was having people over to our house so that it felt more like home. Can the cousins come to you for a sleepover? Make it a positive that they get to show off their new home to their family, and form that emotional link between old & new so that they see they can have both in the new place.

Stay. Your DD is 5, she can't make reasoned judgements about what is good for her. She needs her Mum and Dad to make sensible decisions about her short and long-term welfare. She's 5! She is behaving is a perfectly reasonable way to show her distress at the upheaval of her little world, and what she needs is for her Mum and her Dad, her teachers and her extended family to be like calm, solid rocks that she can cling to, beat against and yes, be dragged from, where necessary, that say "It's ok, we know it all feels wrong and super scary. We know it doesn't feel comfy and 'safe' yet. But we are here and we will still be here when you are calm. This is your safe place. This is the right place. This is 'home' now. This is 'school' now. We are your 'safe' people and it doesn't matter how much you kick and scream, this is where you come to learn.

Is it the move or the particular school?

TBH - I'd have looked at welsh medium primary schools then looked into Welsh/Englih medium options at secondary.

But it could be the schools not be very welcoming – we certainly got a vibe that might be case at one we looked at – they had spaces but didn’t seem keen – something borne out by other parents experiences who eventually ended up at the school my children ended up at.

Also how much selling of the new place have you done?

We had to move for work - no going back - still spent a lot of time selling the place - doing the exciting new things at the weekend - finding groups and activities they’d wanted to do but couldn't in old location.

Another family we knew moved across city and the children found it hard – but I pointed out the mother did nothing but hark back to how wonderful the council flat had been – she wasn’t focusing them on the bigger house and new garden.

Try getting DGP to visit you and do some of the exciting stuff and I’d cut the visits back for a while.

I’d give it a proper go 6 – 12 months before moving back as it can take longer to settle than you think. Though pro and con list mentioned by pp is a good idea as well.

Rosehip10 this may well be the case in rural areas but in Cardiff, the majority of children at Welsh medium schools come from English speaking households, or households where one parent speaks Welsh and so the main spoken language is still English. There is such a thing as bilingualism (and beyond).

I would move them back in a heartbeat. Too much change and seemingly without their input. Your dd is losing masses of education time, you could end up in court for non attendance with a rate of 50%.

Are you preempting a racist element that may not actually happen? Or are the incidents real and often and known about locally?

We had just one indian girl in our school all the way through and she was never ever treated any differently to anyone else, why would she be? I don't think your children will necessarily identify or feel more comfortable in a more diverse setting. It could be that they are loved and treasured and popular where they are, and feel most comfortable where they are.

Diverse settings are only important if you see skin colour, and most children don't and wouldn't think anything of it.

Your families have been a huge part of your children's lives and it will feel like a huge loss to them.

Why not have everyone give it a year and then decide?

Stick to your guns. Only commit to another move if it’s absolutely necessary for the children. Look at the bigger picture here. Regarding your marriage if this is true I recommend seeing a therapist or counsellor in the area.
There’s no point in basically moving back if you don’t want to. What are the local schools in the area like? Stop letting them influence your decision making skills because you may eventually regret it take my advice for it.
No more dithering either. DD should be at school more often now. I’ve always believed in stability irregardless of family dynamics. Make the most of the opportunity. Find activities to do together as a family. Be positive and try distraction techniques too. Honestly if divorce is being considered a therapist is also advised. Don’t be nervous about putting your foot down on this one. Get your partner to essentially agree with you.
Children need stability. I moved around a lot as a child and one thing that helped me cope well with it was the opportunity to ask questions and emotional support from both of my parents. Make friends.

If you had a nightmare at your secondary school it is not automatic that your dc will have the same experience. Don't allow this to colour your view and uproot your entire family. Things have moved on a lot since you were young, and what was acceptable then thankfully would never be acceptable now.

I am concerned you have moved for the wrong reasons. You have moved to avoid a racist experience that may never happen. You describe your family as providing stability as your marriage is fraught and now that has been taken away and they were in the top sets for everything before but now don't even want to go to school...

I think personally you have made a mistake.

I wouldn’t consider moving back. When we moved when I was little - from one London borough to another - it was further than 40 mins away. It’s madness that you’re considering moving back.

I totally get why they feel unsettled. But I agree with everyone else, you and DH need to present a united front and make them understand that moving back is not an option and will not be happening.

If it took you 2 years to get them in to the English speaking school, were they speaking/learning English in that time? It seems very odd to want to move them for so long and not think that it might be hard for them if they didn't have a good working knowledge of the new school's language!

That is a lot of change for them so I am not surprised that they are struggling tbh.

I'd some sympathy till you went on about your and dhs fraught relationship. So you pulled your children from home, school and family, family who you admit provided stability they don't get at home, and youre surprised it doesn't work?

I'd move back, I'd work on providing stability at home if that's possible, and if not I'd deal with that.

You need to deal with today not what might or might not happen in 5 years...

thanks again for more feedback, essentially yes a lot of this has been for the wrong reasons, but some for the right, eg more to do, also if the children arent academic, then in a village/town, job opportunities are low/small at least in a city, most of the friends they make will remain, so they will have socila contacts probabbly for life, in most villages ppl move away or stay and not do much, i know we should give it longer but how the kids have got through the weeks so far is counting down the days until they go 'home' for the weekend.

and also saoirsee31 i agree with that sentiment as well which is why im going slightly potty, do i live in the here and now, like you have mentioned as tmw is another day, or as others have rightly said and is something behind the move think long term for the kids future? either way i see positives

Honestly I think stay. It could take a year but you made this decision for good reasons

I think the going "home" for the weekend is a big problem especially if you use the language of calling a place you don't live as home.

If the DC call it home then they need correcting and I would not be going back quite so many times.

Along side the dithering between you and your dh the DC are smelling a split and working on that.

I can understand why you left the small village. You are thinking of their future.

I am in no way meaning to be critical or implying that you didn't consider the move for a long time. It strikes me that perhaps you haven't been able to foresee the pain of the move, nor just how important their network of family members means to your dc. Maybe the very reason why they have done so well is this very thing.

I live nowhere near my family, and even I can see that your situation is different.

I'd go back, but then I don't really like change much anyway.

If your relationship with your DH is rocky then perhaps the children feel more insecure now that they no longer have the safety net of grandparents and cousins around too.

Would you do better with family support closer to hand? Would the children? As they grow into teenagers will they really like life in a small, quaint village or will they want the greater social opportunities of living in a city?

All this is stuff to weigh up when making the final decision. There will be pros and cons to whatever you decide.

You as the adults made the decision for good reasons. You should stay, and stop unsettling them by talking about moving back. Of course they are going on about it, they see a chink of a chance and they are going for it! If you were firmer they would be getting used to it by now.

I agree with @saoirse31, she makes some god points OP.