To ask your opinions in this situation with close friend?

[shitfriend]

Because right now I feel like the worst person the planet, and keep going over and over it in my head and wanted to get some perspective.

Close group of friends from uni days, we're all much older now! Been through a lot together over the years. One of the groups wedding the other day, we were all bridesmaids. It was the most perfect day, ran smoothly, bride and groom very happy and in love, dances the night away etc. Got home and had a call from one of my best friends in tears saying how hurt she was. I was so confused until she explained it was about a 'joke' I'd made about tenna lady. Now, when we were at uni there was one of those silly moments where we were all laughing, this friend had tears running down her face and someone said quick, get the tenna lady! So at the wedding we were together (before any drinking if it's important) with 1 other person who was from brides work but we all knew her. Laughing away and I said 'quick, get the tenna lady.' I thought I was referencing the uni joke, but what I had forgotten was 4 years ago friend had confided in us she had bladder control issues. She thought I was making a joke about this, and now says she doesn't think she can trust me again. I think I've just lost a very close friend over this. Even when I explained she's obviously now very hurt I forgot the conversation, and I am so lost and confused that I could forget something so important.

I don't know whether there's anything I can do, I sent a long rambling email last night which I think has just made it worst, so I'm leaving her alone now. I can't believe I've hurt someone I love so much. I've always struggled with memory when it comes to real life, I'm very good at remembering words and lyrics but not past events. Don't know if it's important but in the last 4 years I've had 2 late miscarriages, a difficult pregnancy and a bad birth. I have 1 wonderful DS but I am deeply traumatised from everything I've been through, and haven't had time to process it yet. Will this be affecting my memory? I feel like I've let all my friends down, and it's tarnishing the memory of such a perfect day. AIBU to say I'm a true shit friend, and I don't know if I'll ever get her back.

People are going to project their own experiences on threads like that, me included. In my long-term friendship group, we had a ‘dramatic’ friend that would always react in a heightened and really OTT way. People had to constantly humour her, she was single, no kids and we tip-toed for ages. It began to really grate and stopped making it all about her. So, I have less patience for people who will make a throwaway comment all about themselves. To think so lowly of you, says more about her! It’s so common among even very young women to joke about a ‘Tena Lady’ situation and stress incontinence and weeing yourself over a hysterically funny moment aren’t uncommon or such tragic thing to warrant such an OTT, melodramatic reaction. You did not mean to cause offence and said sorry. Don’t feel emotionally blackmailed to continue to pander to her. She needs to get over herself. We all have a lot going on and to expect others to constantly be mindful about a relative minor issue someone mentioned 4 years ago is way to self-absorbed.

You put your foot in it. You explained and you apologised. And hat should be the end of it.

I have a friend who took offence at the slightest little thing. I realised I was watching what I said and walking on eggshells - just waiting for the ‘what do you mean by that’ question. I found myself apologising all the time, then she told me how irritating it wa that I was always saying sorry. So I apologised for that!!

We aren’t friends anymore and I can finally speak freely, I frequently say the wrong thing. I need friends around who give me the benefit of the doubt. We all do. If she can’t get over this mistake then she isn’t much of a friend,

I think your friend is totally over reacting, but you sound like a lovely caring person.

She's the only one of the group still single, and I was very aware of that the whole day and was careful that she wasn't reminded of that as she's also sensitive about that

This is probably where her overaction stems from. Especially if you were all tiptoeing around her anyway. She couldn't lash out over that so chose this instead.

Tell her you're sorry for upsetting her and if she doesn't accept it after that email then don't pander to it anymore. She doesn't get to dump a load of energy into you because she's peed off yet another one of her friends has got married and it wasn't her.

Bladder issues feel anything but minor to the person. And I imagine 4 years on they are much worse. Maybe the tena lady joke really was very very unfortunate timing if you see what I mean.

while I think I probably could take a friend's word for it that it was referencing something else, if it's the first time you've made that joke recently I can see why she's very sensitive about it and not so quick to believe it was an old joke.

Give her time, the joke was in very poor taste but you've apologised and that's all you can do. If she doesn't come round it's her loss but I'm not so sure she's the total bitch everyone is making her out to be.

I actually think your friend is being unnecessarily mean.

I've had similar issues in the past which I was very sensitive about at the time but I would take it as a lighthearted joke if a close friend said what you said.

@Broken11Girl why is it reasonable for the hurt friend to have forgotten a joke but not reasonable for OP to have forgotten a one mentioned medical issue? Both were four years ago.

Everything else I agree with @TemptressofWaikiki - you can't do anything further so just leave it.

I think friend may have been deflecting and possibly found the day hard for other reasons.

I don't think you are unreasonable to have forgotten the incontinence convo - it doesn't sound like you are in everyday contact. But it may be a bigger deal for your friend than perhaps you realised. It's relatively unusual for a young childless woman to be incontinent and so there may be some underlying issues- that might be heightened at a Wedding.

That said, you've apologised. All you can do now is give her time.

OP I do not think you have done anything wrong at all.

Your friend has got the wrong end of the stick.

You made a joke about something you all shared from years ago but forgot about something personal to her from four years ago that she told you.

This is how memory works sometimes, we can remember something from the long distant past but not what happened recently.

Maybe the wedding was hard for her because she is the last of the group still single. I certainly understand that feeling having married late and had kids late.

I would not bring any aspect of this up eith her, if course. But I do feel this is the backdrop to her anger.

It's not unreasonable to forget the ins and outs of friends' health from four years ago. You had no way of knowing that this was still an issue for her now.

Maybe you are not as close as you think or she doesn't wish to discuss it, which is all fine.

You've been through a horrendous time so you honestly should stop feeling bad about what happened. It was a mistake (her mistake as it happens) and you have apologised.

By all means send her flowers if you wish to. But if she really thinks you did this on purpose then your friendship has changed and I would say she is choosing to move away (emotionally) from you, which is fine.

But it is not your fault.

Give it time but if she chooses to hold this against you, her choice.

I think the joke was rather crude and ill-mannered for the occasion,even if it hadn’t touched a nerve for this friend. Meeting good friends in a pub? Just about ok. At a wedding when everyone is dressed up and trying to be their ‘best selves’? There is a time and a place for lavatory humour and a wedding isn’t it.

Has it occurred to you that the poor woman was probably wearing a Tena lady?

If someone made a joke about birth injuries I doubt you would find it funny.

theymademejoin '... you made a joke at the wedding about something that is currently a medical issue for your friend. The original joke is irrelevant.'

No, the original joke is not irrelevant because that was what the OP was making the joke about.

The friend is wrong. She was mistaken and hurt, which is sad and unfortunate but it doesn't mean that the OP really was making a joke about her!

The friend needs to believe (wrongly) that the OP has remembered her bladder problems and also that she has chosen to make a joke at her expense. Both of these things are wrong.

Now the friend has a choice, believe her friend and move on or not.

OP this is just the sort of thread the papers like to pick up on so I would ask for it to be removed as it is very identifying.

And overwhelming readers appear to feel you are not yo be blamed, so go easy on yourself.

The more you write "I spent the whole evening being careful because she's sensitive about still being single" the more it sounds like you tiptoe around her continuously for fear of upsetting her? Has she always gone off in a huff quite so easily?

If it bothered her all she had to do was pull you aside privately and ask you don't make the jokes as she sensitive about her bladder issues.

MaybeDoctor of course it had not occurred to the OP her friend might be wearing a tenna lady, she had forgotten! That is the agile point.

Lots of people make jokes about accidently seeing, when laughing etc. Nobody makes jokes about birth injuries.

Some of these posts just seem very unnecessarily cruel to the OP who is clearly very contrite about a genuine incident.

Whole point

There is a time and a place for lavatory humour and a wedding isn’t it

Erm... OK

Sorry I think being with your closest friends is the perfect time for off-colour jokes you have previously shared with them unsure how fancy clothes makes that different.

Yes, indeed. There should be no jokes and laughter at a wedding.

@Italiangreyhound - No, the original joke is not irrelevant because that was what the OP was making the joke about.

You appear to have missed the rest of my post where I stated :
*You appeared to make a joke about something she confided in you. That was not your intent but that is the way it appeared to her.

Presumably the friend had long since forgotten the joke which, unless it was a running joke with the group, is hardly surprising. However, presumably her continence issues loom large in her life. She had confided in her friend and had mistakenly assumed that she would remember. Reasonable then to assume the joke was referring to that. It wasn't. The op had apologised and explained and so she will hopefully move on.

I love a good wedding and thoroughly enjoy myself when I get the chance to attend one.

But I would generally be mindful that it is not the time or the place to be off-colour or risqué, because it is also a serious occasion where emotions can run a bit higher than normal.

MaybeDoctor I don’t know what sort of weddings you go to but I’ve always found people are extra risqué, especially if there’s a free bar!

shitfriend (which you're not by the way) in an ideal world - or with a perfectly operating crystal ball - perhaps you wouldn't have said it.

I think maybe the key here is that she's sensitive to not being married, and the other single one from the group having just married it left her as the only one who wasn't. So she was on edge and feeling rubbish all day and immediately took what you said in the context of her personal circumstances.

As other PPs have said, it was four years ago that she told you, and it hasn't been mentioned since. I think it would have slipped most people's minds in that time. Leave her to come round when she's not feeling so raw. Hopefully she will. If she doesn't, you don't have anything to feel bad about.

Well I guess she is worried that she confided something to you and you have potentially broken her confidence by referring to it in a joke. She feels it was directed at her ( and as she has bladder issues, that's not a completly unreasonable assumtion) and she probably fears that in the future youmay make another reference to her problems in a joke and she feel embarrassed. I think if I felt someone had made a joke at my expense about a sensitive issue at a wedding, i'd be a bit wary of them adn I'd feel rather humiliated.

I know you say it wasn't your intention (and I believe you) but bladder issues can be quite hellish (i have friend who has had issues for some years, she has been through so much pain, so many intrusive procedures and now has to self catheterise) I wouldn't dream of making a jokey reference to Tena lady, even if I was drunk.

Your recent stresse may well have affected your memory, and I'm sorry you have had a lot to go through, but from her point of view, you forgot her issues, but remembered an old joke from Uni days (not a very memorable joke surely ?).
Was she supportive and kind to you during your troubles? If so she may be wondering why her troubles are joke worthy when she hs been supportive to you. (I understand you didn't intend to hurt, and your forgot her problems, but I'm trying to out her viewpoint. And she probably sees it as hurtful that her problems are forgettable and therefore seen as unimportant).

I'm not trying to be harsh - I'm trying to think how she may have been thinking. Things like bladder problems can be really tough to deal with, especially if you know you are stuck with them forever, my friend is always having to think about access to loos and changing facilities, what clothes she can wear, and loads of other everyday things most people take for granted.

It sounds as if she is important to you. So I think the 'she's a drama llama, she's over reacting' comments are totally dismissing her feelings. You need to find a way to show what you said was completely unintentional, and you do appreciate her problems and that you will never make jokes about them again (again - I mean jokes in general, I know you weren't targetting her)

I think just considering why she may have reacted as she did, is the best way to go forward and repair your friendship, rather than dismissing her concerns as OTT. Think about how hurt you would have been if a close friend you had confided in had made a careless joke about issues that affect you, in public, to other friends.

Thank you Kurri kurri, you've said what I'm feeling. I've forgotten something that features so heavily in her life and as a result hurt her. I don't think she's overacting because that would minimise the hurt she's feeling, which I don't want to do. We've crossed wires, my random memory has picked up a stupid joke from ages ago and forgotten something from 4 years ago, which is still a present problem for my friend whose forgotten said stupid joke. I started this thread to gauge where on the scale friend I was from 'a bit of a wally' to 'worst fucking friend ever.' I really can't imagine my life without her.

theymademejoin I was disagreeing with the idea that the original joke was irrelevant. I think it was highly relevant, since it was the reason the OP made the joke. That was my point. It doesn't feel relevant to the friend as she had forgotten it.

"I really can't imagine my life without her." I really hope she feels the same way and will make up. But if she does not, please do not beat yourself up any more. You made a comment which many others might make and you forgot something, even something important about a friend, which most of us will admit we have done from time to time. You've apologized and you sound lovely so please do not beat yourself up.

I hope you’re ok @shitfriend

You sound like a really very lovely friend. I hope your friend realises this.