Wheelchair user on the bus

[Penguinpower]

Yesterday I was taking my grandmother (in a wheelchair) to hospital on the bus (London bus) and unfortunately it was rush hour as appointment was 9.10

When the bus turned up it was completely rammed and no way we could get on. The bus driver yelled down the bus that people needed to get off to let the wheelchair on and he would give people a ticket so they could get on another bus for free. Unsurprisingly people did not want to do this, a couple of people did but most people ignored and my grandma was uncomfortable with the situation and told the bus driver not to worry. The next bus that came was also rammed and so I called a taxi.

So this is more of a WWYD but do you think people should get off to let wheelchair on or not? I’m in 2 minds as around 10 people would have to get off to let us on and they could then get on other buses easier. As easier for them to squeeze on. However, they have paid for the bus and as it is rush hour they would most likely be heading to work as no one would choose to be on that busy a bus if they didn’t have to be.

My grandma doesn’t think they should have to get off and I think I probably agree but the bus driver obviously thought they should. So what do you think?

But what happens if no one moves.. So wheelchair user can't get on but situation on next bus is exactly the same. Again no space for them. Surely a wheelchair space should be able to be used by a wheelchair user if needed to be used.

I don't agree with people who had already been travelling having to get off the bus. They were on there first. If the wheelchair space was full of people, that means the bus was already full to capacity doesn't it? So there was no room on the bus in which case you have to wait for one which has room.

If people were in the wheelchair space and could have moved to another part of the bus but refused to, then that is a different matter.

and this is why I won’t use public transport with ds unless I really have to!

A wheelchair user should only ever not be able to get into the ONLY space they can access on a bus as a result of another wheelchair user being there. No ifs. No buts. No maybes.

As In the other scenarios mentioned - the restaurant, the hotel room, if someone is using the wheelchair accessible space they would be offered an alternative table/room if the accessible space is needed By a wheelchair user. If one wasn’t available they wouldn’t be asked or expected to LEAVE THE PREMISES.

Why is it different in a bus?

@sirzy your ds is entitled to use the wheelchair space, and you’d expect them to get off mid journey to accommodate him, but why should someone get off mid journey to accommodate you? You have no priority to take someone else’s seat on the bus.

Errm who would actually get his chair onto the bus, deal with his medical needs if needed, know when he needs to get off etc if I (as his carer as much as Mum!) wasn’t there? What a bizzare statement

Why is it different in a bus?

In all those examples you can BOOK your required space. You can’t on a bus. You have to take your chance and so people in a wheelchair should be able to use the wheelchair space and people can be reasonable expected to vacate. That is the difference.

As a point of interest I sell tickets 4 times a year for performances at a theatre. I always leave the wheelchair spaces free in case they’re needed.

Isn't this what the mobility element of PIP/DLA is for anyway? For extra costs of taxis, a car?

It's taken into account that someone in a wheelchair may have difficulty accessing transport that able bodied people can access and paid accordingly.

That's not to say that wheelchair users can't use buses before someone jumps on me but accepted that they may have difficulties at busy times so can afford alternatives.

Not all wheelchair users get PIP/DLA

"Isn't this what the mobility element of PIP/DLA is for anyway? For extra costs of taxis, a car?"

And if the money has already been spent eg on buying the wheelchair?
No it is not ok to say you might have got some money towards mobility costs so it doesn't matter if you can't access public services. Councils etc cannot take mobility dla/pip into account when providing transport for people with disabilities because that is regarded as discrimatory. You might want to think about that.

That's not what I said in my post Sock.

You might want to reread it.

Higher rate mobility is £60 a week. That wouldn’t pay for many taxis would it!

I don’t understand the misconception that you are only disabled if you are in a wheelchair, or that if you are in a wheelchair you must be disabled.

I had to use a wheelchair for 9 weeks due to spd in pregnancy. It would be disrespectful and offensive to have described myself as disabled.

Sirzy. Higher rate mobility is £60 a week. That wouldn’t pay for many taxis would it!

How many hospital appointments in the rush hour do you imagine OPs grandma had this week?
I’m just flagging this up because high rate mobility is really quite a lot of money to many people. I would think in this case it would have been money wisely spent.

Clueing4looks I’m physically disabled but I don’t think I have a right to a wheelchair space over a wheelchair user. I would expect (and hope) to be given priority for a priority seat but I know life is not black and white. I strongly disagree that my disability gives me a right to occupy a wheelchair space if I am not using one.

Also, can I ask you please to not use the term “wheelchair bound”. Nobody is bound to a wheelchair.

iamyourequal who on earth are you to make that statement? Do you have any idea how many complex medical needs people are living with? I go to many hospital appointment and inevitably, the majority of them mean I end up travelling in rush hour. I drive but my appointments are in London. It’s not always affordable to get a taxi and I recognise I’m very very lucky to have enough funds to occasionally get a taxi.

Well ds has 3 appointments this week. All of which cover rush hour. One is 40 minutes drive away. That’s not unusual for us. Thankfully I drive but many people aren’t as lucky as to be able to.

To all the people who for some reason seem to think being in a wheelchair is some how easy, ffs try it,not for a short time but for ever, and its a Wheelchair space.

Plus if you only start having mobility issues at age 65+ you won't be entitled to PIP/DLA (only Attendance Allowance which is based on care needs not limited mobility).

SunnySkiesSleepsintheMorning

iamyourequal who on earth are you to make that statement?

I feel my point is a valid one and I have a right to make it. £60 a week is a considerable amount of money. It could be usefully spent on occasional rush hour taxis to hospital appointments.

But iam posters have already explained how easily that would be eaten up. But this is all whataboutery at olympic levels. Shameful, really shameful

iamyourequal You didn’t read what I said. Many, many people have lots of hospital appointments and yes, inevitably you are there ages and travel in rush hour. Secondly, many wheelchair users are not eligible for the enhanced rate of PIP.

Sometimes I feel as if I’m talking to the select few on here. It’s as if our lived experience counts for fuck all. I’m not a wheelchair user but I am disabled and chronically ill, so I totally get the challenges faced by others.

I have just done a mock quote for taxis to tomorrow’s appointment. That one round trip alone would cost over £70 in a taxi.

I wish the bus company/drivers in my area would give tickets to use on the next bus. They will ask you to leave or fold the pram for a wheelchair which is fine but there is no luggage rack to put said pram. If you then choose to leave they won't give you a ticket to use on the next bus as you have chosen to depart the bus. I literally dread getting the bus with my toddler and 3 month old baby. I have no idea how I would juggle holding a folded pram, little baby and making sure my 3 yr old stayed still. Buses really need to come up with better ways of policing this for all passengers.

Dobby try being in a wheelchair, ffs

Ffs I'm not comparing the two I'm literally saying that bus companies need to come up with a better strategy. Atm it pits one user against another. If I was on the bus I would get off for a wheelchair user if I had the cash to pay for the next bus or try to juggle holding onto everything but some people won't be able to afford another ticket and if buses insist on getting rid of luggage racks then these sort of situations will keep on happening.