Wheelchair user on the bus

[Penguinpower]

Yesterday I was taking my grandmother (in a wheelchair) to hospital on the bus (London bus) and unfortunately it was rush hour as appointment was 9.10

When the bus turned up it was completely rammed and no way we could get on. The bus driver yelled down the bus that people needed to get off to let the wheelchair on and he would give people a ticket so they could get on another bus for free. Unsurprisingly people did not want to do this, a couple of people did but most people ignored and my grandma was uncomfortable with the situation and told the bus driver not to worry. The next bus that came was also rammed and so I called a taxi.

So this is more of a WWYD but do you think people should get off to let wheelchair on or not? I’m in 2 minds as around 10 people would have to get off to let us on and they could then get on other buses easier. As easier for them to squeeze on. However, they have paid for the bus and as it is rush hour they would most likely be heading to work as no one would choose to be on that busy a bus if they didn’t have to be.

My grandma doesn’t think they should have to get off and I think I probably agree but the bus driver obviously thought they should. So what do you think?

Are we also all presuming that wheelchair users travel alone? So 5 people get off the bus to clear the space for the wheelchair user, but then are we expecting some more people to get off to make room for the wheelchair users friends/carer/children? They don’t have any priority.

wow I never understand why its so hard for people to accept that a WHEELCHAIR space is for a WHEELCHAIR its not for all that whatabouts. as for the idea that a person in a wheelchair should get a taxi. why ? apart from the fact that they are more expensive than the bus. they are also hard to book(and sometimes you don't fit , due to height of wheelchair). the disablism on this thread is dreadful.(my return key doesn't work)

^ because you’re only disabled if you’re in a wheelchair?

Logically the position for them is no different than it would be when they can't get on the bus at all if it is too full
I disagree. Having to get off the bus in an unfamiliar and possibly isolated area is totally different to not being able to get on the bus near your home or in a busy town centre. If you had to wait an hour for the next bus you’d have access to shelter, warmth, safety, food, seating, toilets etc because you could go home or use the town centre amenities. Which is not the case if you’re stuck at a bus stop in the middle of nowhere.

so say you go to a restaurant. There’s plenty of tables down a step but one that isn’t, and is therefore designated for wheelchair users.
The restaurant is full to capacity with people eating food they’ve paid for.

A few groups of people then approach who want to eat there, one of the groups having a wheelchair user in the party.

Should the manager evict the people sitting at the accessible table so the person in the wheelchair can eat there? Or should she apologise and say sorry but we’re full, like she did to the other groups?

Should the manager evict the people sitting at the accessible table so the person in the wheelchair can eat there? Or should she apologise and say sorry but we’re full, like she did to the other groups?

Why wouldn't she approach the people at the accessible table, ask them to move and comp some of their meal for doing so?

Because the restaurant is full to capacity. There’s no space for anyone to move to.

'Why wouldn't she approach the people at the accessible table, ask them to move and comp some of their meal for doing so?'

It's an interesting point actually. If the restaurant is full and there is no where move I can't see a restaurant asking customers to stop eating mid meal and leave so another customer can eat...
Does the duty again lie with the restaurant or bus to keep that place empty no matter how full the bus is?

I use a wheelchair. If people were standing in the wheelchair spot I'd be grateful if they moved so I could use it, but if those people had nowhere else to stand I'd feel a bit awkward about people getting off the bus for me.

Although I think public transport is appalling for disabled people, I don't believe I have any more right than anyone else to get on a full bus.

If there was no space on the bus for an able bodied person they'd have to wait for the next bus. I shouldn't be the exception to that.

It's a wheelchair space not a disability space. In the same way that blue badge spaces are for people with blue badges not anyone who has a disability.

Does the duty again lie with the restaurant or bus to keep that place empty no matter how full the bus is?

Like it’s been mentioned, how would that be financially viable to do?

I work in a restaurant like I mentioned, although there are 4 tables that are accessible. The situation was hypothetical but we’re often at full capacity.

We have one regular customer who uses a wheelchair (he always phones the morning he’s coming as he comes in a big group requiring 2 tables and so we reserve them) but I can only think of 2 other times this past year when a different wheelchair user has come in. We couldn’t permanently reserve the tables just in case. It’s not cost effective.

I'm sorry but I don't think being in a wheelchair means somebody should take my place on a bus.

Yes, if I'm stood in the wheelchair space then I should move, but if a bus is full then it's full.

Why can’t people understand, a wheelchair space is for a wheelchair user. If you are in the space and a wheelchair user gets on the bus, you move!

Why can’t people understand, a wheelchair space is for a wheelchair user. If you are in the space and a wheelchair user gets on the bus, you move!

Ok, In the OPs case, 5 people get off the bus to accommodate her gran in a wheelchair.

OP isn’t in a wheelchair. Why should someone have to get off to accommodate her? She doesn’t personally need the space.

And if the bus is full and there’s nowhere to move to, what happens then

You get off

The idea of people simply not standing in a vacant wheelchair space on a packed London bus during rush hour is hilarious.

You know when you squeeze the toothpaste tube to get the last bits out? On a packed bus... you are the toothpaste. You go where you're shoved to!

Personally I would get off the bus, as it seems the gracious thing to do. But I can understand how it might appear patronising or uncomfortable for a wheelchair user to be given preferential rather than equal opportunities, or that other bus users should have got an earlier bus, which they also could have done.

SpikyCactus, your point at 10.30 was fully answered at 7.33. Essentially: if you want to stand in the wheelchair space you accept the risk you may have to get out somewhere inconvenient. If you don't want to accept that risk, stand elsewhere or don't get on the bus.

Should the manager evict the people sitting at the accessible table so the person in the wheelchair can eat there? Or should she apologise and say sorry but we’re full, like she did to the other groups?

Similar to the answer above. The manager can manage the use of the table, e.g. tell staff that that table is generally to be used for people who only want a quick meal so they can be moved on quickly if necessary.

So every patron has to be asked how long they intend to stay? Or told they can only stay a certain amount of time? That’s bound to make them feel welcome and comfortable. What brilliant customer service.

"But I can understand how it might appear patronising or uncomfortable for a wheelchair user to be given preferential rather than equal opportunities."

Every bus journey being faced with prospect that someone won't move out of the one space you can go isn't equal opportunities.