To think life shouldn’t be easier for those on benefits than those who work?

[Alwaysoverdrawn]

obviously not including the disabled, elderly etc in this

I am so fed up of being poor so I looked into doing an access course to increase my earning potential. My sister is doing one and is currently on benefits, she gets it for free with her childcare paid.

Having spoken to them, we earn too much to be considered for help. Having looked into mine and my sisters finances I think this is frankly bloody ridiculous. We are worse off than her ffs.

We make around £2,500 NET p/m, £1000 rent, £900 childcare -2 adults, 2 kids. So £600 ‘disposable’ pm with a lot of debts to pay.

She gets £670pm plus her full rent paid and a council tax reduction for her and one child.

AIBU to think life shouldn’t be ‘easier’ for those on benefits than those who work?

DP hasn’t been to the dentist despite needing to for years as he can’t afford treatment, I’m really down today. Seriously considering moving out so that I can claim benefits and get out of this horrible rut.

Btw I think it’s brilliant your sister’s access course is being paid for to allow her to study and improve her future job prospects. A great long term solution to getting people off benefits.

It is difficult, OP. You’re in the “squeezed middle”, it sounds like. Not wealthy enough to be comfortable but not “poor” enough to get help. I’d be frustrated too - and I roll my eyes at all the MNers who absolutely refuse to accept that there are people claiming benefits who are neither disabled/worthy of sainthood.

@wannabestressfree Im not condoning it?? Im saying this is what people do! People know how to work the system unfortunately. i personally know people that do this and have admitted it to me! its so common in my area.

It’s not easy on benefits OP. It’s very difficult and I had the luck of a supportive family nearby.

I know it sucks when you can’t afford something like the access course but like a PP said, she won’t be entitled to benefits forever and surely it’s positive that she’s doing something to hopefully give her a long term stable career?

Is it something you could afford when your children are at school and your childcare bill goes down?

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There you go OP, do let us know how you get on.

NothisisPatrick, it sounds like you have not been in a struggling situation. 'Jealousy' as you sneeringly call it is perfectly natural when one is working far harder than others to achieve far less, especially when we're talking about needs the born middle classes can take for granted.

I've always lived just above the cut off. I don't actually envy life on benefits, but I'm not totally green either: there are those who choose it. This whole system is bonkers, surely we all know it by now, and it is in the process of collapse. Work doesn't pay. I understand your frustrations op.

But you would be better off than your sister if you'd stuck to having one child too. Your childcare costs are the issue here.

Lakie I wonder if there could be something set up so parents could donate their children's old school shoes (which are in good condition, just outgrown them) so people can have them for free. It would be a good way to recycle as well as helping families who cannot afford to buy them.

The issue isn't really about those on benefits but the fact that so many working families are struggling. If you need anything 'extra' such as dental care or house maintenance you might need to rely on a loan which of course then leads to less disposable income and more debt in case of other unforeseen circumstances. There doesn't seem to be any light at the end of the tunnel.

I think it is tough when you earn too much to access help, but not enough to support yourself independently without getting into debt.

But personally, I'd rather work. I don't think sitting around at home and having to go to the Job Centre once a fortnight is a good way to live, nor is it good for your mental health. The fact that you both have jobs and are in a position to pay £1000 in rent is pretty impressive.

How long will it take to pay your debts off? Surely once that's done and your children no longer need childcare, you're going to be in a much better position than your sister?

I do think that the working poor get no sympathy at all, and I think its a ridiculous state of affairs. There are kids in these households who are slipping through the net in terms of child poverty etc

Im not saying its easy on benefits either though, not every benefit you get free courses or NHS dentists etc. If you are income related benefits you do - but if you are contributions based benefits you get a lower rate than the people getting income related, and no free NHS dentists or prescriptions

and the difference between income related and contributions based is to get contributions based, you have worked before

So even in benefits you get penalized for having previously bothered working

I think some people are projecting a bit here.

At what point did I say people on benefits had flat screen TVs and holidays and goats?!

I’ve also never said they should take the funding/her benefits away, of course I don’t think they should do that. She’s taking what she can with both hands to give my niece a good life I don’t begrudge her it. But what I’m saying is these things should not only be available to those on benefits, when I’m looking at the sums and the prospects and a single life on benefits is more appealing to me in my current situation, something is wrong. And I don’t think what’s wrong is the benefit system, I think what’s wrong is that do gooders and people in charge seems to think helping the poor means those on benefits and everyone writes off people like me who are working and are struggling and get nothing.

Maybe she is spending what she gets immediately/ within a few months and so never saves. If any of her benefits change, she may suffer.

It's not good for single people either. My dp, when single, went through an awful time with his mental health. As a single man living alone he wasn't entitled to any help whatsoever as he was self employed and had no dependents. He got into rent arrears because his health was crippling him and he fell into a depression.

You can see how so many single people end up homeless because they fall onto hard times and aren't entitled to any benefit help.

Dont know how but my neighbours on benefits smoke weed multiple times a day😑

Sounds like the issue is education as much as anything. Adult education in this country is closing down. Soon all that will be left is the schools, who have never and can never be everything for everyone. Oh, and privatised Universities of course for the few who can afford it or will game the system.

Full rent does get paid for council housing- so long as you’re in the right size property for your family.

Are you sure you’re not entitled to any help OP? You don’t sound like the “squeezes middle” at all to me if you’ve only got £600 a month for all food, bills and council tax.

Someone that I know has always been on benefits and has never worked but genuinely seems to live the life of Riley! I'm talking driving round in a Range Rover with a personalised numberplate, Gucci and Louis Vuitton handbags, gym membership, nice clothes for her and her DC (from expensive shops like AllSaints and Karen Millen) at least two foreign holidays per year, and they're always out and about doing nice things.

She had a lot of children and always talks about her 'babies' as if she's earth bloody mother of the century.

I don't know how she gets away with it!

Full rent does get paid for council housing- so long as you’re in the right size property for your family

This really is not the case in most places, which councils pay full housing benefit?

Yeah, there isn't much in the way of easily available and affordable adult education anymore. Plus housing costs and the cost of childcare is extortionate. I can imagine that the working poor now feel as trapped in their situation as those on benefits.

It's a fucking mess really.

I spent four months in the sole after being made redundant. Worst four months of my life. I was constantly worried about money, constantly harassed by the advisors, made to take part in stupid, humiliating and pointless courses that cost me money to get to and laughed at once I said I'd found a job.

It was utterly awful.

I am surprised more people are not pissed at the amount having to be paid by those in work.
The problem is housing costs.

The most any non-working family can get in benefits (unless one of them is disabled) is £384pw (more in London). So a family paying nearly £250 pw rent, like OP, would only get £134pw in other benefits, giving a disposable income of £560 or thereabouts if OP was on benefits.

JSA/IS/UC for a single person is £73.20pw, plus around £63 pw in CTC/UC and £20.50-ish CB for one child, which works out to £670 a calendar month.

I still think OP should be getting some tax credits as well as earnings, especially as childcare costs are so high.

You might actually be better off if the lower earner gave up work and became a SAHP, OP.