To be a little disappointed that Jesus is being taught as fact in Y1?

[PoxAlert]

We're atheists, so therefore didn't consider any faith schools for our DD.

We want her to learn about all cultures and religions and be tolerant of them all. We have friends of many faiths and beliefs and just want to be kind and happy.

Of course I expect (and welcome) Christianity to be taught in school, but we just got a copy of this term's curriculum (DD just started Y1) and for a non-faith school it seems a bit much.

Or am I being unrealistic and the school and church will always be linked?

Some of the RE points are:

"To learn who Jesus was" "who were his friends" "what did he do?"

I guess I was expecting a "what do Christians believe?" "why do they celebrate Christmas" etc etc than what seems to be a fact based history lesson....

Either way I'm not going to kick up a fuss with school, it's not a big deal really, she's free to make her own decisions in life. Just surprised me a little.

I get you OP. I was raised Catholic and struggled with making myself believe when silly old logic started to get in the way.
So now with my own children when they come home from our supposed non-faith school and tell me, as if it were fact, that a 600 year old man built a boat big enough for a small number of every single animal on the planet and managed to not only keep them all alive after fitting them in, they also repopulated the earth and inbreeding wasn't an issue, I give them a look and tell them that it is a just a silly but entertaining story that for some reason, certain people believe is true. I tell them all they ways it simply isn't possible. The same goes for Jesus. If there ever even was a man called Jesus, he only SAID he was a deity's son. He told people stories hoping they would learn how to be kind and nice to each other from them.

Religious stories are all well and good but I teach my kids to look at it realistically no matter what they are told by a teacher to believe. They have to question it.
I'm happy to pretend Santa and the tooth fairy are real (for joy, magic and mystery in the kid's lives) because they have a positive lesson for them. Brush your teeth and be good and kind all year and you'll be rewarded. They also do grow out of it and are expected to stop believing in that nonsense as they age, whereas religion taught by the religious is to be believed wholeheartedly.
I hope my children's school put as much effort into teaching what other religions believe too. I find religion quite fascinating in a way and my DC knowing all about different faiths is a good thing to me.

OP, just correct your children when they state it as fact. Add that it is something that certain people believe but isn't necessarily true.

The historical evidence of Jesus is flakey, and there was certainly no person who could perform ‘miracles’. That is Christian belief, and should be taught as such, never as fact. Teaching about religion should always be ‘they believe’ not ‘this is what actually happened’ based on the belief of the individual. It’s awful that children are still being indoctrinated this way in schools. I long for the day that education becomes secular.

Surely the key question is is why non-christians celebrate christmas?

Perhaps because winter festivities were appropriated by Christianity, so what goes around comes around I guess.

Scholars of the period generally agree that there was a real preacher called Jesus and that his baptism and crucifixion are genuine historical events regardless of their personal religious beliefs. The Christ myth theory that Jesus never existed attracts virtually no support from scholars. However, accepting that Jesus existed is not the same as saying that he said and did the things attributed to him in the Bible, let alone saying that he was the Son of God as Christians believe.

Why not just ask the teacher for more info on how it will be taught? And ask if they will do similar with other religions later on? Then you can make an informed decision about whether or not you let your DD do the lessons or if you want to withdraw her from RE. Or you might let her do them, but make sure you chat about the contents of lessons with her.

@Poxalert glad it wasn't intentional and glad to help.

I get what you are saying but it sounds ok even if talking about a fictional character with magic powers. You would discuss Harry Potter in the same way - who were Harry’s friends, what did Harry like doing, who did he marry... etc

To be honest you would do more good teaching him the ethics of HP than any god.

I totally get you OP. I think children should be educated about religion at an age where they are able to understand the concept. I’m gobsmacked at the amount of people who say Jesus was a real person. There MIGHT have been a preacher called Jesus, but that really isn’t the point here.

The examples you use aren't showing Jesus as fact, but I see from your update you've realised this too

@PoxAlert I get where you are coming from, my DD now 26 got into trouble in infant and junior school by saying that god only exists in people's minds and that people come from Apes. Myself and EXH are atheists and bought her up as one too. She got told
Off for laughing at the story of Jonah and the whale saying it wasn't true despite teachers telling her it was and that Jesus was a real person.
In a modern multi cultural multi faith world I think it's insane to teach children that Jesus defiantly existed. I mean really? Look into religion and understand quite how many re-writes the bible has had.

Have a chat with the teacher and ask about how it's taught and what other religions will be covered.

I was ready to kick up a stink at DDs school as the curriculum for last year covered "Africa" and seemed to describe it as a single homogenous lump. A teacher friend pointed out that there would be differentiation and in KS1 there isn't really the scope to look at lots of different things. In the end they looked at animals, environment and customs.

You might find that not much time is devoted to it anyway.

Pretty standard stuff. Jesus did exist. Most schools emphasise 'This is what Christians believe' and when they study another faith, in our case Judaism, 'This is what Jews believe'.
Why not have a chat with the class teacher, or the RE co-ordinator.

Yes definitely from what you've put about the curriculum, there is no evidence that they'll be teaching as fact that Jesus was the son of God and performed miracles.

Surely the questions are showing how they are being structured for discussion with five year olds?

Just as you would talk about any other stories and their characters (fictional or non fictional).

there is no evidence that they'll be teaching as fact that Jesus was the son of God and performed miracles.

So what are they teaching about Jesus? Genuinely interested, if they’re not talking about the magic nonsense that usually comes with religion.

My study of English literature in secondary school included an overview of events in the Bible. This was done because literature often includes Biblical references and allusions, not as an attempt to covert people to Christianity.

Similarly, Jesus and Christianity changed the course of human history. Knowing who he was and what happened to him is necessary to understanding what followed.

Yes, there almost certainly was a Jewish rabbi called Jesus who built up a following of Jews and was crucified in 30 or 33AD. Those are plausible 'facts'. Not a lot of teaching material there! The rest is speculation and propaganda - not the best of things to teach kids, especially in this age of fake news.

Totally missing the point but this is a Christian country. Why wouldn't Jesus be part of the curriculum?

Knowing who he was and what happened to him is necessary to understanding what followed.

But if what happened to him is made up, what is there to understand? I’m still very interested to hear about the ‘real’ Jesus, and the apparent huge influence he had on history and the world. What did the real Jesus do to change the world, knowing that performing miracles and being the child of a deity isn’t actually a real thing.

Totally missing the point but this is a Christian country. Why wouldn't Jesus be part of the curriculum?

Christianity is a belief, school is for facts - with proof and evidence to back them up. Considering over 50% of our country now apparently don’t follow any religion, I think we can finally drop this nonsense of being a ‘Christian country’.

I agree with you OP, the teaching at school about Jesus and associated stories presented as fact makes me really cross. Not because I don't think Christianity isn't culturally significant or because I don't want my children learning about religions but because it directly contravenes any kind of sensible fact based information that is much more important for them to learn, such as evolution etc.

I have no problem with it being framed as 'some people believe' and want them to learn that 'some people believe x religion and here are the associated god/s, customs and so on.

I don't think it's fair that if you deliberately do not send your children to a non denominational school that any religion should be taught as fact.

It doesn't really help with your dislike of how the school is teaching it but we had similar in our non church school.

I just talked at home about that Christianity being what some people believe when they came home with questions.

I was 'interested' to read dd's RE excercise book at parent's evening in y2. The first page said 'I don't believe in God'

Don’t all religions teach theirs as fact?

I’m still very interested to hear about the ‘real’ Jesus, and the apparent huge influence he had on history and the world.

He founded the Christian church, which then went on to dominate the Roman Empire and lead to the dark ages in Europe. That's true regardless of whether you think he actually performed miracles or not.

Santa is taught as fact to children much younger. I'm not sure I've heard a single complaint about that.

Of course St Nicholas was a real person but he isn't the same as this Santa guy.