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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think she's being a right CF?

503 replies

itchybumhole · 17/09/2018 13:50

A bit of background first, and I'll try my best to give all the relevant information, but as I don't know much about the workings of the system I'm unsure what I need to include.

My partner split with his wife 3 years ago after 13 years together and 7 years of marriage. They have an 11 year old child together. Their marriage ended very acrimoniously after a series of infidelities on her part.
When they separated he immediately moved out of the family home with just his personal belongings and stayed with his parents until he could find a rental place. Since leaving he has paid her child maintenance by private agreement on a weekly basis.

She has today received a letter from HRMC saying she needs to repay tens of thousands of pounds in overpaid tax credits. The tax credits were paid to her during the time that he had left the family home. (He's always worked full time. When he left she went on to benefits. She hasn't worked in 13 years apparently).
The notice says that if she claimed as a couple then both parties must repay, so she called him today and said he's liable for half. His answer was... but how can I be? I have receipts for rent paid to my own house. I didn't benefit from this overpayment so why should I pay half back?
We're both so confused. What does he do now? I've told him to call HRMC but he's still smarting from the phone call from his ex wife. We're these benefits claimed fraudulently? And is he liable to repay half as she insists?
Thank you for any help or advice.

OP posts:
Willyoujustbequiet · 17/09/2018 17:09

So much crap on this thread.

It can have been a joint application and she's done it over the phone whilst they are together. There is nothing wrong with this.

If he has failed to tell them he moved out the joint award continued - HE IS LIABLE.

My ex dh and i informed them within a couple of weeks and still had an overpayment.

But dont panic, you can pay at a greatly reduced rate.

mumsastudent · 17/09/2018 17:09

perhaps cab too?

IfIWasABirdIdFlyIn2ACeilingFan · 17/09/2018 17:18

Flipping hell.

You’ve been dating this guy a few months, you haven’t the foggiest idea what has gone on between them, what’s been said, what’s been signed, what’s been agreed. You’ve no idea about what she has been claiming or earning. It’s all “from what I understand”. But yet you’ve decided she’s a cheeky fucker committing benefit fraud. Hmm

This isn’t your circus at all OP. Not least because you haven’t a fecking clue what’s going on.

knittingdad · 17/09/2018 17:20

Ah, I see. HMRC are taking the loan application as proof that he was resident at the family address. I assume the Ex made a single claim, which would entitle her to more tax credits. Now that HMRC have decided they were still a couple they are asking for the money back.

Somehow the Ex has to convince HMRC that she was single. Your DP has really landed her in a mess with that loan application. He has to help her straighten it out with HMRC, but I don't think that makes him liable legally for any money (which probably shouldn't need to be repaid).

FrangipaniBlue · 17/09/2018 17:37

I think the loan application is a bit of a red herring.....

She's claimed tax credits as being single when in reality she had her new partner living with her, so she has fraudulently claimed the benefits.

The reason she has been caught is because the OPs partner did a loan application at her address. But that's just the trigger, it's not the actual fraud.

She's committed fraud and is just miffed that she's been caught because of something OPs partner did, so she's expecting him to cough up half the repayment.

I'd be saying tough shit, you shouldn't have committed the fraud in the first place!

FrangipaniBlue · 17/09/2018 17:40

Basically she's in a pickle, because she can prove that her ex wasn't living there and so in theory would have been entitled to the benefit, but then she'd be lying and committing fraud because in reality her new DP was there!

She's basically got no choice but to either pay it back and hope they don't do more digging (hence wanting her ex to pay half) or she has to fess up that no, ex wasn't living there but someone else was..... which could potentially land her in deeper hot water!

Spacezombies · 17/09/2018 17:42

@knittingdad

Only for that 1 year. He's caused her an issue for that one, and he should provide whatever she needs so she can prove she really was single that year. The following 3 years where she had a partner living with her are her problem entirely. But she will still blame him if the loan is what caused the investigation. So he needs to help fix his mistake and then refuse to engage with her over the rest.

TheHalfBloodPrincess · 17/09/2018 17:45

@FrangipaniBlue nowhere is there anything to suggest she was committing benefit fraud. How do you know she didn’t tell hmrc her new partner moved in?

Harpingon · 17/09/2018 17:57

Your partner fraudulently claimed to be living at her address to take out a loan. This would have triggered an investigation. She was, by the sound of it claiming legally as a single person. He is at fault.

Original poster
itchybumhole · 17/09/2018 17:57

He knows that applying for the loan on his old home address was a dick move. But he says he made lots of questionable choices in the months following the breakdown of his marriage. He desperately needed a car or he would have lost his career as well as his wife, home and everything he worked hard for.
He's a good man, and I know how hard they are to come by. So no, I won't be dumping him.

OP posts:
Original poster
itchybumhole · 17/09/2018 18:02

Queenofthenight
I'm not trying to sort it out for him. He was at work when all of this kicked off and I said I would find out if he was liable or not. Helping, ya know of it?
And my user name comes from my cat. Not that the situation with my butt hole is any of your business. Hmm

OP posts:
MrsRubyMonday · 17/09/2018 18:02

My wife discovered shortly after we got together that her ex had made a fraudulent joint claim for wtc in both their names and HMRC started chasing her for it. Letters were provided to both, it clearly stated they were both involved. We ended up spending the next year of our relationship paying back the half my wife was liable for, even though she never received a penny into her account and didn't know the claim had been taken out. There were also issues with bills in joint names and joint bank accounts, we had bailiffs ringing at one point.

If your husband was liable, they would be chasing him as well. She needs to find out why the claim is being withdrawn and what evidence she needs. Your husband should then provide it, if it's due to the loan. But I wouldn't pay anything if he's not liable.

FrangipaniBlue · 17/09/2018 18:05

nowhere is there anything to suggest she was committing benefit fraud. How do you know she didn’t tell hmrc her new partner moved in?

@TheHalfBloodPrincess because the letter is in her name only and OP has said she was making a single claim?

If her partner (who OP says runs his own business) was living with her then yes, she was committing benefit fraud!

TheHalfBloodPrincess · 17/09/2018 18:09

If it was relating to the year when it was just her claiming then it wouldn’t have her new partners name on it.

SanFranBear · 17/09/2018 18:10

I claimed tax credits when I was married. When ExH left, I really hope we'd reconcile so didn't change my claim to a single person until about 2 months later (When I'd wised up and realised I really didn't want him back!)

I then claimed as a single person but as I said he'd left the home so many weeks back, I received a letter about the overpayment and so did ExH at his new address..

So the only way I can see him being even slightly liable is if she had a joint claim. As he claims they didn't claim until he'd left, she's either falsely claimed as a couple or they've fucked up.

Either way, I can't see how your DP would be liable provided he's telling the truth about never claimed. If he's not and they did, if she didn't advise them of her single status - he'll have a letter and will be liable.

SanFranBear · 17/09/2018 18:12

That last paragraph is garbled but hope it makes sense Grin

ivykaty44 · 17/09/2018 18:14

His name was on the Electiral Register - where? This would help prove or disprove where he was living

Who filed for divorce and when? This again would be a legal document showing they parted and addresses

SocialPiranha · 17/09/2018 18:20

Pretty sure that if he is part of the claim he owes half but the HRMC will send him his own letter stating that. This happened to me and my ex although it was only for 1 weeks worth we were liable for half each. The person I spoke to on the phone said they pursue both parties for half each. The loan has nothing to do with over payment of tax credits Confused as to why that’s been dragged into it all.

But also worth pointing out in my experience whenever I speak to the people from the tax credits they seem to make up the rules as they go along.

Original poster
itchybumhole · 17/09/2018 18:28

*Willyoujustbequiet
*
They never have made a joint claim because when he lived at the house he was always working full time and they were never eligible for any help. So should he still have informed the benefits agencies he was leaving? Even though he'd never tried to claim anything?

The application must have been made as a single parent. He says he never co signed anything with her after the marriage ended.

OP posts:
TheHalfBloodPrincess · 17/09/2018 18:29

Did she know he applied for the loan fraudulently at her address?

Walkingdeadfangirl · 17/09/2018 18:30

She was entitled to those benefits. It’s only ops dp applying for the loan that made the hmrc say they were claimed fraudulently

Where is the proof of this? its all just speculation. If she was genuinely entitled to those benefits then all she has to do is explain that to HMRC. Its up to her to sort out and still nothing to do with OP's partner.

If the the ex's address was used for a loan then she would have known about it, as that's where the mail would have been sent.

curlykaren · 17/09/2018 18:32

Honestly, the tax credit folks get stuff wrong ALL THE TIME. In the final analysis she might not even owe them any money at all. Full disclaimer: Not read full thread!

TheHalfBloodPrincess · 17/09/2018 18:42

Ops dp was the sole earner. He left the marriage. Op says the ex never worked. Therefore she was entitled to benefits.

If the the ex's address was used for a loan then she would have known about it, as that's where the mail would have been sent.

He was declined the loan so no paperwork would have been sent. But would still link him to her address at a time when she was claiming benefits as a genuine single parent.

lemonsorbetinthesun · 17/09/2018 18:48

My DB has this. By HMRC wrote to him. Think it was nominal £60 ish over payment (seemed to be an overlap of when he had left to the new single claim).

But if he also owes then he would have a letter I think.

Original poster
itchybumhole · 17/09/2018 18:49

When I ask him about the loan and why he applied for it using her address he can't seem to give a straight answer. He says he knows now that it was wrong, but at that stage in his life he was in and out of the family home. Just when he would work his way round to forgiving her for cheating, more men would come to light.
He says that it was a massive error of judgement but he desperately needed a vehicle and he had no way of knowing whether he'd be back in the family home within a week or two anyway. It was definitely declined though, and his boss ended up giving him an old car.

I don't know what to make of this. I know he's a nice person and very caring... but he just sounds like a doormat to me where his marriage was concerned.
He had a mental breakdown after it all ended once and for all. He says that he endured years of being told he was skinny, useless and shit in bed. Then it started to come to light about the cheating.

I know this is all heresay, but everything I've seen and heard confirms what he tells me. She sends him really abusive messages calling him horrible names and belittling him. She also has a criminal record for attacking him when drunk on a number of occasions.

OP posts:
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