... to allow DH to consider this job?

[ricepolo]

Not sure if this is the best place to put this but hey ho.

DH and I have been married for 12 years, together for 16. Four children: 7, 5, 3 and 1. We initially lived in London then moved abroad for a few years and have been back in London for the last four years.

DH is exceptionally good at his job and has been approached about a new role. It’s a brilliant job, just right for him. However it’s in Germany...

The options are to

• ignore the job and carry on as before
• him take the job and commute weekly
• him take the job and us all move out there with him.

Other issues:

• The kids are so settled here. They love their school and all their clubs and activities.

-I’ve just had a promotion into my perfect job: a role I’ve been dreaming of for years.

-I speak fluent German but the kids don’t speak a word.

-We’ve just bought what was meant to be our forever home here and have spent a lot of money doing it up...

• DH has travelled with work since forever. I’m used to him not being here (it’s currently Friday night and I’ve just had dinner and a drink on my own in front of my laptop....)

Realistically there’s no way I’m going for option 3 (us all moving). But I don’t want DH to miss out on this so AIBU in encouraging him to pursue the role and commute?

Is this the death knell for everyone’s sanity and our marriage? We trust each other 100% fidelity wise: as I said, he’s been travelling our entire relationship with no issues in that department. I’m more concerned about growing apart etc. and the impact on the kids.

Depends how easy it would be fir op to get an equivalent job out there surely

I would stay in UK with the kids, say he doesn't like the job or they don't like him and he's fired in 3 months- you're screwed.

Get him to negotiate working from home Fridays so he can leave work and come home. Check flight times though- you might find that planes only go to and from the airports either very early (which is good when travelling out) or very late. Also they are 1 hour ahead in Germany so keep that in mind. Are they prepared for him to get into work at 10am because he flew in on a 7am (8am their time) flight and it takes another hour to get to work and through security? Germans can be very strict so not sure how fluid they would be about flexible hours?

Allow?

He can consider all he likes surely then discuss with you the impact on your relationship and family. Not sure he needs your permission first.

I'd actually prefer to live in Germany than the UK BUT I wouldn't want to move out there only to have to move to a different country in a few years. I also think the 7 year old would have a difficult year learning the language. (When I was an expat most children over 6 took quite a bit longer to pick up the language and that's a whole year of struggling in school, not having friends etc.). There's also the issue of your job and presumably your friends and family in the UK. I think all in all I'd stay put and then you just have to decide whether you're prepared to hold the fort on your own all week .Personally I can't imagine dealing with four young kids on my own all week, getting the older one's homework done while dealing with the toddler/babies but I accept people do manage this so if you're OK with it then that's fine.

He can turn down the job and get another one if he's great. Your perfect job us too important to give up. Most people never find their perfect job. Your OH obviously hasn't found his yet.

I'd be looking to move there all together:
You stay together and DH get's a great job
The kids get another language - very valuable
If you stay 7 years they can apply for German citizenship (thereby opening up Europe for work to your children which they will be denied due to Brexit)
Fantastic country and lovely people and new culture for you all

Can you pay for extra help whilst he’s away in the week? I agree he should negotiate mon to thurs travel or one week a month wfh.

Calculate the cost of the extra help you’d need to make your lives easier if he does it travelling - and also what he would get out of it in career terms if he did it. If the next step up is also in Germany you may have to bite the bullet on moving sooner than later.

My xh always travelled for work so when we returned to uk from a stint abroad and his job was in London but family home in Scotland we decided on weekly commute. Four years in we are divorced and he’s about to marry the OW... I’m not saying the weekly commute thing was the only reason but I’m sure it didn’t help.. we grew apart and he was free to indulge his mid life crisis mon-fri.....in your position with the benefit of hindsight I’d be opting for everybody goes or nobody goes....

It doesn’t feel like an ‘either/or’ decision to me, once you take out the option of you all going (which you say you’re vetoing).

I know a family where it is handled as though the dad (commuter) is barely a part of the family. He turns up, they continue with their plans (made largely without him) and he sometimes tags along. His partner is a single parent, in effect. Not ideal, and not really working for them. She maintains the kids won’t even notice if they divorce!

I know another family where the dad (commuter) comes home less often (9hr flight), but is very involved in the day-to-day. He joins in via FaceTime, sometimes they actually prop a tablet at the dining table and he ‘eats’ with them. He helps with music practice & homework (one on one), and reads bedtime stories. The youngest send him pictures, which he prints off and discusses with them etc. When he’s home, he hides little notes and treats for them to find later, and the family sneak notes into his suitbag. It’s beautiful, and notably a whole lot more connection than many live-in dads have.

It’s how you do it. If you’re up for a bit more effort, it could actually protect you all from a lot of the relationship complacency/laziness that leads to failed marriages or distant parents?

Nah, I'd forget it and move on. He's got four young children, presumably because he wanted to be part of their lives growing up. This is just a job and you've not sold it in any sense like - he hates his current job, this is a one off amazing opportunity etc. Sounds like you're already doing great as a family with your perfect job, forever home, settled kids etc. I'm big on career but in this case I don't see the pros outweighing the cons at all. He wasn't even looking for a new job. So I'd forget it and enjoy your life.

As for allowing being controlling (hate the overuse of red flags on here), I think it's entirely healthy in a marriage with four young kids that a partner would have a say in whether one sods off to work overseas. A veto even. Seems like the OPs relationship is working out pretty well on all sides.

If it wasn’t for your job, I wouldn’t hesitate to go (and I love England). I’d rent the house out and give DH the opportunity to take the promotion and for your DC to become fluent in German (which they will quickly) and experience another country & culture (on the assumption it’s a a nice place in Germany of course!). They’re young, they’ll soon join other clubs and make friends

I would, however, only agree to one year at a time and probably head back in time for the 7yo to start senior school here (or y8 at the latest), unless you really want to stay in Germany permanently at that point.

However, there’s your career to consider too. Could you not transfer to Germany? Get an equivalent job there? It’s not like you don’t speak German. I’m not saying you should go because of dh’s job and yours doesn’t matter, but I think it’s a fabulous opportunity for the children and the whole family. I’d be saying the same thing if you had been the one offered a job there. Maybe if you felt you needed to establish yourself in your job a bit more you could look at staying here for 6 months and DH commuting.

People work away, commute etc all the time, obviously you can make it work, BUT when it’s long term it changes ALL of the relationships and it can be very hard to learn to live together again afterwards. Weekends/time together can be difficult too because of the pressure and the ‘away’ parent not parenting all week and having different rules/expectations and not always realistic ones as children are growing and changing.

Allow him to consider?

Germany is a fabulous country to live & work in.

The 7 year old may struggle a bit with the language at the beginning, but your younger kids will adapt and learn it very quickly - and then be at a big advantage (especially post-Brexit & with German language skills declining in this country).

You could rent out your fab home and it will still be there in 10-15 years if/when circumstances change.

However, the big thing for me would be your own career - whether your DH's career should be prioritised above yours? How easily will you find work in Germany- you are fluent so that should help?

The weekly commute option is easy. DH did this between our home in the UK & London. It's not really much different, especially if he can WFH on a Friday, and You would have the bonus of being able to go out to Germany for holidays (skiing in winter? cheap & easy). DH even spent a few years working in the USA while we stayed at home, and that was manageable too.

Where in Germany? That for me would be the clincher between 1 and 3. 2 would never have been for me, though of course some people/families manage it very well long-term.

I'm in Germany and have been for the best part of two decades. There are a lot of benefits to being here and a lot of positives to being in the EU right now. But there are areas of it I wouldn't move to.

And obviously there is the possibility of you transferring your career to assess. (You'll probably be loved for your English skills, but may find yourself pigeonholed for the same reason. Depends entirely on what you do).

Travelling for work is a different ‘feel’ than living in two places. He will have two lives, not one home life with travelling. I know you say you trust him, but having an apartment/house in Germany will be very different than ‘travelling’ and you have far more freedom to socialise if you’re living there & going home alone is less apealing...it really is the ultimate breeding ground for a life that eventually includes another woman, because it feels like a completely separate life, not a betrayal of life at home.

Yes easyandy101 ‘allow him to consider’, because any halfwit knows she can’t stop him accepting the job, but she can tell him if he does their marriage will be over. So she would be ‘freely allowing him to consider’ without the threat of losing their marriage.

I wouldn’t move because you have just got an awesome job and you shouldn’t have to sacrifice that.

If he can do 4 days a week in Germany and one day WFH it London office I don’t think that would be bad.

He could get an early morning Monday flight, work his socks off and return on an early evening Thursday flight.

All relationships are different. Some people do this set up just fine.

My friends brother only sees his wife and child one weekend every 3 weeks or so - they travel to wherever in the world he happens to be...

If they really want him and he is in a flexible job for the location it’s carried out in would they consider one week in germany one week working from home or 3 days in germany one week 2 days the next?

Assuming your dh speaks German too?

I would consider him going and commuting, if it could be a springboard to then getting a similar job in the UK.

But I I think his red line should be only if they allow the Friday to wfh so he can travel back on Thurs night. I'd also try and negotiate extra holiday.

It's a big advantage that you can speak German. I would get all your children German lessons here (maybe another thing the company could pay for), you can speak to them in German too to practice.

You can visit for longer in school holidays to see what it's like.

Then assess in a year - 18 months time how he is getting on. By that time you'd also have had that time in your dream job so maybe could find the equivalent there.

There are 6 people to consider in this equation, your dh is only one, so it is too much of an upheaval to all follow a job which he might hate - he may hate the people/culture in the company, he might not like Germany, or at least whichever city in Germany.

Tbh, if it were me I'd encourage him to go for the opportunity and make it work for a year - 18 months, so there's a time limit, then reassess - either the whole family join or he looks for the equivalent job in the UK.

I'd carry on with the status quo. He isn't the only one in the partnership, your job is important too. And if it's your perfect job I'm jealous (I'm mid 50s and still haven't found mine!).

At the moment you're happy and the DC are happy; and you've not said that that your DH is unhappy. Why throw that all away? And if your DH is that great lots of other opportunities will come up over the years.

A friend lived the weekly commute life and was effectively a single parent. Unfortunately nature stepped in and her DH got a brain problem so now can't work and also has little relationship with his DC. She had been considering divorce but is now stuck. Another couple emigrated to the US with great fanfare but came back within a couple of years as DH got a health problem. DC lost their places at great schools and house prices had gone up in the mean time. Extreme I know but you don't know what is around the corner.

I'd say if everyone is happy don't upset the apple cart. A bird in the hand is worth two in the Bush....

I know quite a few families where the hubbie works down in London and the family live in Scotland (where I live). We're 20 mins from an airport and the father's/husbands come back each weekend. It works well for them. I know one family who do the same with Copenhagen. The wives/mum's have all found it works quite well. The families earning potential is much higher. The wives do all have PT jobs that are't hugely stressful though and they have set hours that fit in with the kid's and school. It's not for everyone, but I know of three families this do this very successfully.

With weekly commuting. it's your perfect job that is going to take all the hit with four children's sickness, inset days, holiday care etc. I assume you already do the lion's share of all that if he travels, but atm there is possibly still a degree of slack? You should perhaps also be aware that German laws are very employee-friendly in general and that includes child sickness etc and the right to take periods of parental leave up to the child's eighth birthday.

I imagine with two professional working parents and 4 young children you have a full-time nanny. I also imagine that DC are beginning to get plugged into feeder schools for very solid options later on if I read between the lines re your lifestyle. I have known dc to struggle with switches between systems and international school provision does not always offer the choices suitable for every child and realistic options often end up involving boarding.

When my dc were that age, although I had only two, DH was so occupied with work (leaving at 7, back at 10) that it wouldn't have made much difference if he had weekly commuted and we had a period of 18 months when he was in the US more than the UK and tbh it felt like having one less to look after.

My concern op is that with a job and 4 dc you will be spread very thin and more so as all the dc are at school, and you could have 3 schools in the mix looking at the age spread. If you don't have live in support what would you do if one is admitted to hospital/needs a&e overnight? Also wondering, if your youngest is 1 whether you are on maternity leave?

Personally, I know very few families where both parents can be high flyers at the same time without something breaking. The successful families have all compromised along the line and compromise has worked in the strongest family units and marriages.

Marriage and family life is hard and the stability of the children comes first. That stability comes from supporting each other 100% and without bricks cemented with any resentment.

Whatever you decide it has to be a joint decision and joint commitment. You are a partnership and the partnership has to make realistic decisions to sustain its future.

If it was anywhere but Germany I would say stay where you are and let him commute. But GERMANY is the best country in the world, I would have to go if I were you, your children would learn German very quickly. I would say though that this is DEFINITELY the last move to my DH. I hope you are able to decide OP. What a hard decision for you.