Another Roxanne Pallett..

[wolfywolfy]

Lots and lots of threads and media attention about her at the moment.
What she did was horrific and sly...
But can we please stop giving her 'armchair diagnoses of mental health and saying she has a Personality Disorder and that's why she did what she did ...
It may actually be that she is just PLAIN nasty and sly....
I myself a sufferer of a Personality Disorder find it really disheartening when people act in appealing ways and it's because of 'personality disorder'
I have BPD and would never ever think of behaving this way.
The stigma for mental health has been lifted in recent years with more people being understanding and open about it, but it's personality disorders that are still kept quiet and it doesn't help when people in the public eye behave in a certain way and they are giving the label 'personality disorder' it really doesn't help those who have a genuine diagnoses feel able to open up about it because people will automatically think we will behave like someone like Roxanne Pallet.
I hope this thread made some sense .

I just feel that the vilification of both RP and CN has got somewhat out of hand

Smaller sleb "crimes" get a disproportionate amount of attention because it cost the public less emotionally to rage about what is essentially a more fixable, superficial, individual issue, rather than face the darker, much much harder to fix stuff they (and I guess the click sensitive media) would rather not think about.

I don’t think people are using MH as a scape goat. Lots of people suffer with MH problems, myself included, and understand that not everyone goes around making up ludicrous lies about everyone who has the misfortune to even be near her.

It doesn’t excuse it, but it might explain it.

Personally I do think she is a sociopath and a very unsafe person to be around. She makes lies seem very believable.

I don’t think people are using MH as a scape goat

In recent times MHIs are waggled every single time a human fucks up. It's almost like there is a growing belief that perpetrators sans MHIs cannot exist in the context of causing harm.

Alongside the increased awareness of the many MHIs that exist, an explosion in the Dunning-Kruger syndrome has followed. Which is annoying at best.

I think that is what people are reacting to.

I cant fathom that anyone cant see its misogyny.

Willyoujustbequiet
I agree...she has been destroyed, I actually feel sorry for her now. It's nonsense to say 'what if there had not been any cameras'. It's Big Brother, there are cameras everywhere. If they hadn't been on the show it wouldnt have happened at all.

How can it b Misogyny when both men and women are speaking out about her past behaviour? But i agree the witch hunt should stop now thats the side affects of spcial media.

How is it misogynistic? People aren't vilifying her just because she's a woman. She is someone- who happens to be a woman - who tried to create a false allegation that someone - a man - had hurt her intentionally, then manipulated a group of people who didn't know the truth against said man for days and ignorantly tried to use the situation for her personal benefit - whether that was for the sympathy vote or to turn people against Ryan? I'm still bewildered how she thought she could get away with it when they're in a house surrounded by cameras. She has form for it, she's a known liar and bully, the backlash it isn't because she's a woman, it's because she's an arsehole who in other circumstances could have ruined some innocent man's life and she's making a mockery out of men and women who are victims.

Willyoujustbequiet

There are misogynists reacting to this because misogyny. But they aren't genuinely angry with RP. They'd kiss her if they could. Two gifts, heads they win, tails they don't lose.

Either

Women lie cos stone cold gitface female liars like to take an innocent man down and #metoo #IBelieveHer are their enablers/best friend. Example - CBB 2018 RP

And/Or

Previously abused women are unreliable witnesses cos, triggered + ridiculously sensitive = Everestx3 from wormcast. So you can't trust women's accounts of abuse, particularly if they have a history of any kind of abuse.
Example CBB 2018 RP

They don't want her to disappear into anonymity and be forgotten. That doesn't benefit them. They gain far more if she stays relevant, as a co-victim, as a useful reminder in the public eye and mind that they can point to. Regularly and often often.

And the above is what is fuelling a lot of the anger. Because she gave a gift and a half to the worst of us. And may end up causing a sliding back where it gets even harder for women, particularly previously abused women, to be believed again.

Why wouldn't non-misogynists get angry about that in considerable numbers ? They aren't stupid. They know women already tend to keep quiet. The idea that some traumatised women - with more than one abusive partner in their personal history (not rare, not by a long chalk) - could have RP dangled at them by their abusers, for gas lighting and silencing purposes, isn't exactly the most calming thought in the universe.

We actually saw some thing that speaks of a notable change from 1-3 decades ago. Three young men, lads' lads, believed RP. Despite the rather glaring challenge to her word wandering around in the garden, given Ryan was left in the house.

What are the new odds of a repeat of that in the aftermath of this ? On or off camera ?

There will be real ground lost by real people thanks to what RP did, (ably aided and abetted by the production company operating CBB, who squeezed as much ambiguity out of the events as possible, to keep the story line escalating to dizzying heights. For ratings). That's going to be a red rag to the bull of people who were in favour of 70s style disbelief of women staying in the past. And they are not misogynists.

It is an act of illogical thinking to ascribe the response in the main to misogyny. But "down with misogyny" is a tool that some will leap on to employ to help keep her in the public eye with a redemption arc. Where she can be instantly recognisable when used as the example to their "liar/unreliable witness" point in the pub, or in the home of a cowering woman.

I hope she disappears into anonymity ASAP. Eventually as happy as she can be, as improved as she can manage, with as meaningful a life as she can make. I don't want, or need her to pay with a pound of flesh. But I'd like her off scene and forgotten because she has left one hell of an uphill battle. Just to win back the hard fought for hill that so many women have died on already.

CesiraAndEnrico

But that's exactly why it's so misogynistic, because all it takes is ONE bad woman to undo years of work. Women aren't allowed to put one foot wrong, in this society, are they. Just because ONE woman messed up, that's it, back to the beginning. Surely we need real changes of attitude in society, not ones that can unravel so easily.

@Genderwitched I get your view, and it's right. But at the same time, if a man was to say he was raped/abused and it was a vindictive lie, everyone would come out with 'and this is why men aren't believed'. Two sides, both shitty.

because all it takes is ONE bad woman to undo years of work

Bono still hasn't lived down his various feet of clay. His bad apple hypocrisy is still used as a point for people who are not on board with his proported causes. Even YEARS later. People who do care about those causes are in not insignificant numbers still deeply pissed off at him. And I don't blame them. He has been a right millstone.

And he had the benefit of no cameras recording and editing both...

• the evolution of his not so truthiness, whilst playing the role of the panto, vengeful villain. Hitting sharp notes of insincerity left right and centre.

-the far more genuine looking emotional distress and fear of ramifications of the people at the sharp end.

.. for maximum rating and attention all over the globe.

One important take from this is that causes need charities and organisations involved to take selecting the slebs they wish to work with far more carefully. All change is slow, hard won and cannot be taken for granted as fixed in place and unbudgeable backwards. You can't risk that on people who have a visible track record if you do a little digging.

If the orgs/causes and the supporters of the causes involved with RP double down and call the outcry misogeny, then that is their call. But we should brace ourselves, because doing that rather than sharply distancing and saying "that was a shitty, shitty thing to do, thank god it's rare" will likely amplify the negative impact RP can have.

I think I can guess what they will do. RP is far from the first person to shit all over a cause they say they hold dear. Many causes before have flailed about in a non-strategic fashion when dealing with an unanticipated outcry caused by an off leash sleb.

I remember watching American Green/Eco supporters racing all over threads in defence of Al Gore's Massive Energy Sucking House when the details of the energy costs in its construction and running were first revealed. They took the negative impact he was already having and made it many magnitudes worse with the most "shift the blame to his critics" pejorative laden defence they could muster.

It was backfiring mightily right in front of them. But they kept going.

It's nonsense to say 'what if there had not been any cameras'. It's Big Brother, there are cameras everywhere. If they hadn't been on the show it wouldnt have happened at all

It's not nonsense! She has accused people of hitting her before this..when there were no cameras. This time there WERE cameras and as a result it puts a question mark on those times she claims she has been assaulted!
God knows who she would have tainted next!

People have claimed that she has accused them of hitting her in the past, I don't recall any careers ending over it though.

She has behaved disgustingly and has been shown up in front of the whole nation but it's gone too far now, the pitchforks need to be put away.

Maybe it’s not misogyny
But it’s horrible to watch one woman be witch hunted so much

Put another way it’s feels like she is getting it way harder than a man would

I struggle to articulate quite why I find it so horrible to watch

Put another way it’s feels like she is getting it way harder than a man would

Bono has had some serious fire storms that rolled on and on and on. He still gets utterly ridiculed, roundly insulted and verbally spat on today. There was a recent (about a week ago) high profile video being used by his opponents, referencing his past fuck ups from years ago and people have not and still do not pull their punches.

Bono's massive ego, enormous wealth and considerable talent provides him with much more insulation than RP enjoys. But there has been no lack of vicious in how his failings get described, commented upon and constantly pulled out for new airings. He's more insulated, but still human, so not immune to the slings and arrows.

So it might feel like she is getting it harder. But that doesn't necessarily mean she is. There isn't an empty space where there should be examples of men letting their causes down, who have then been the focus of serious, dragged out backlashes. With no small amount of vitriol from both opponents who enjoy the faux outrage, and their own side who feel betrayed and let down. Saying so in no uncertain terms.

I don't blame you for finding it hard to watch. She's a human being whose life and future is imploding. By her own hand and with human collateral damage she created. But all the same it is deeply uncomfortable to watch such a dramatic and decisive fall from grace.

People have claimed that she has accused them of hitting her in the past, I don't recall any careers ending over it though

Becuase she isn't as good as she thinks she might be at creating enough ambiguity to land the accusation square on the target. 3 false accusations were based on incidents she claimed happened on stage. One on TV. And possibly the pool incident on the same programme was an early attempt that she didn't follow through with cos Hardeep shut it down at lightning speed.

Each time she has tried it her co-star has had their future in the balance. Because all she needed was enough ambiguity to provide plausibility. Although the more she's done it and failed to land an accusation that stuck, the lower her chances have become.

I have nothing other than gut and a deeply cynical nature to back this up. But I don't think those 3 stage events were a secret in the business. Her deep and widespread unpopularity with colleagues seems relevant.

So I rather suspect that is at least part of the reason why she was selected for CBB. Another attempt in house might have had 2 attractive qualities. Ratings gold. Plus the end of her career, much to the relief of the people who have, and would have had to, work with her. And their mates in the business, who may or may not have a hand in CBB.

It was a high risk strategy that didn't exactly put the other HM's welfare front and centre. But... does that surprise anybody ?

Cesira you have articulated that beautifully. I really wish your post could be published as an article in any publication which has given this incident oxygen.

(I meant your previous 12.02 post)

Just basically trying to put a feeling into words. But as per motive. I wonder if the money/fame trap may be a factor. When you do well people come to rely on you and you get used to the lifestyle that accompanies your success. It can feel like stepping away is an impossible act.

But when the pressure of the work that causes the lifestyle goes well beyond too much, consciously and sub consciously a human brain can start to look for ways to lob a bomb at their life. To make it collapse. To force an escape, that doesn't look like an escape.

I'm not saying that would make her methods excusable. A blatant disregard for the human collateral damage of your cunning plan of definitive career self harm does not scream fairly flawless character.

However, looking at the repeated attempts. With odds of it blowing up in her face with each one, as a pattern gets revealed. The choice of incidents always with a high number of wittnesses who can counter your accusation and leave you open to the outraged shock of doing something so devious, callous and dishonest....

It might be nothing, it might be something. But I do think that while there are many possible explanations for why, an escape route from a showbiz career she was struggling to cope with the pressures of, and feeling trapped in, may be worth consideration.

I've not seen anything quite so dramatic. But I have seen, and indulged in, taking a sledgehammer to one's own life because it has become unbearable, and turning it to rubble and dust feels like the only way out.

MyRelationshipIsWeird
😘