Why does my daughter have to have butterfly or heart zipper pulls on her school uniform?

[MsMotherOfDragons]

Just that, really.

Why do the school uniform options for girls not have things like rocket or dinosaur charms? And why don't they have pockets?!! It drives me wild.

I've looked at several of the main supermarkets and they all seem to have the same problem. Eventually I went for the Sainsbury's ones on the basis of price and quality, so we're stuck with butterflies on everything.

Can I replace them with something else... does anyone know where to get rocket charms or similar? Can anyone recommend a better supplier? I'm kind of appalled that all the gender nonsense starts so early. It's so unnecessary.

@CrochetBelle, but skirts and dresses are labelled for girls by the shops, not the customer... surely this is discouraging boys from wearing them if they wish to ask well?

@noeffingidea, I don't always want to take a bag. I have to if my clothes don't have pockets. My kids like collecting small things like stones and stuff. Why should I encourage my 6 year old to carry a bag because her clothes have no pockets when her brothers can just pick it up and pocket it?

It's not so much the gender conformity of clothes but why clothes designed for males are more practical. You don't get a man's top being 2 piece with a see through mesh top to go with a pair of skin tight trousers with no pockets...

I'm all for people wearing what they want to. But practicality should be the overriding priority in clothes imo. All the frippery should come second.

But do you not realise that by even using the term 'clothing for girls' for eg. you are adding to the problem?

^ for slipperyslipper

Why are dinosaur or rocket charms okay but butterflies are not? What’s wrong with butterflies?

Yes I do. Hence when I go shopping, I go to buy clothes for 'my children'. What the shops choose to label them as is what we should have a problem with.

Let's face it, let Toys be toys has done a great job on reducing the gendering of toys, especially by colour. Perhaps we need a similar campaign for clothing.

Mine have pull on jersey style pinafores that also have pockets (got them from Asda but I think they're online only). Easier for my younger child to get on and off independently... and don't require ironing! No zipper pull charm antics required.

School uniform is there to equalise children and share a common identity. Boys' styles remain largely unchanged over the years. Why do "girls" styles need adorning with "feminine" trinkets and trims? Does a polo shirt need a frilled collar? We managed perfectly well in previous generations. (Cynically wonders as the owner of boys, if these trinkets and trims magically affect the prices)

Actually pinafores would be fantastic for DS2 who can't keep trousers or shorts hitched up. Easier for the toilet than the dungarees he wears out of school!

Depends on the child, last year my daughter had plain ones from Tesco, this year she wanted butterfly’s like her best friend so butterfly’s it is. It’s twee I admit but there are plainer options out there too.

Ah first world problems.

Our school donated old uniform to a school in Africa because they can’t afford uniform and the kids are doing their best to look smart in falling apart clothing, walking several miles every day just to get there and receive some education.

So I can’t get worked up about a heart or butterfly charm. It’s wonderful if that’s all you have to worry about though

Some girls like the little charms. Some girls like the frilly collars, embroidered hearts etc. There is nothing wrong with a child (girls or boys) liking ‘girly’ things, I hate this notion that a girl in particular wearing something perceived to be ‘girly’ is inferior to girls who don’t like those things.
If you don’t like it or your DD doesn’t then you’re free to shop elsewhere.

"But do you not realise that by even using the term 'clothing for girls' for eg. you are adding to the problem?"

It tends to be under a sign (in a shop) or under a heading (on a website) that says "Girls".

For people saying they don’t get why pockets are important, they’re essential for my eldest. She suffers from ridiculously high anxiety and carries a couple of fidget gadgets with her at school, as well as her pass and her phone/earphones (with permission). They’re better in her pockets than her bag or locker for obvious reasons.

She also finds the current trend for ridiculously slim formal trousers annoying. She loves her skinny jeans, but school trousers don’t need to be sprayed on.

Vote with your feet. Buy something else. There’s plenty available.

My son loves pink and butterflies.

But now he's at school, he's been taught that those are for girls. Peer pressure has had the effect it has on most people. He like snuggly things, and drawing, but gets given robots and cars. The older one prefers trousers with lycra, but lots of boys ones are made of (admittedly sturdier) inflexible fabric, unlike the girls ones - and then they cover them with glitter and flowers - which he doesn't mind, but really he just wants plain, normal trousers.

I always liked rockets and cars, but got given dolls. I want to wear sturdy, practical clothes but have the body of a short, dumpy woman, so can't buy in the mens section because things fit even less well than they do from the women's, so I have flimsy jeans, and t-shirts that aren't long enough to tuck in.

Children are children. The butterflies and bows aren't needed on uniform, so why put them there, leave that for non-uniform clothes - the clue is in the name - keep the day to day school uniform simple and unadorned and then we don't have such unneeded polarised gender stereotypes.

I'm getting so bored of this. It seems to me like these days people want attention for being different. Two of my friends have girls that only wear boys clothes, I have absolutely no issue with it apart from the fact both parents every time they see me seem to turn the conversation around into 'of course X won't wear girls clothes' or 'oh I'm having trouble with X finding clothes for a wedding/party/whatever because they'll only wear these clothes'

It's all a bit boring and really as PPs have suggested just take the dangly thing off!

Or even say 'Sorry Persephone, it comes with a butterfly on but it's £4 cheaper than in John Lewis so that's that.'

And stop harping on about it.

Does your daughter dislike hearts and butterflies?

Asda do summer dresses with pockets and flower or butterfly charms - can't get worked up about stupid charms tho - it's just a zip

As far as I’m aware the Aldi school uniform is unadorned. But there may not be much left now as the event was a while ago.

Why are rockets and dinosaurs preferable to hearts and butterflies?

L

Hate the dismissive attitude of many posters - 'this is a non issue' etc.

Of course it's an issue! Why should a child's gender limit them to a specific set of likes or hobbies?! These ideas start early in children and shouldn't be dismissed. This is part of the reason why STEM subjects have always been so male dominated. Reminds me of the awful gender reveal cakes in America that day things like 'ruffles or rifles?' 'Pants or plaits?' UGHH

Buy your girl the stuff she actually wants to wear. Get stuck into the boys' section. Ignore the haters ✌️

I send countless emails and letters about this! Let Clothes be clothes is a good resource.

FWIW Asda zip up summer dresses have stars. They got my custom this year because of it even though Im closer to Sainsburys which had 20% off. If I struggle next year Ill get the Etsy ones.

For those of you who think it is a non issue. Fair enough, each to their own. But there is too much segregation of toys and playing and despite what many think this is having an effect on children and young teens. Its a constant drip of these small things that makes it worse imo.

Now don't get me started on girls school shoes...

I'm another who CBA to gripe about something as insignificant as a zip-pull. My sporty, assertive, good-at-maths DD likes hearts and butterflies, and I don't consider them an emblem of submission or oppression, so what's the problem? If it means the shop can flog a few more because some little girls prefer the decorative zip-pulls to plain ones, well it's an effective bit of marketing isn't it? Get the pliers out and replace them if it matters that much.

Pockets are a different matter - putting them on a garment would mean a higher price due to the extra fabric, cutting, machining and finishing, plus my kids are buggers for leaving tissues in pockets which then break down in the wash and leave fluff on clothes. I prefer no pockets.

It is easier for girls to go "tomboy" and go for the more neutral/ default boy option than for boys to go for the "feminine". DS was looking at grey trainers with pink elastic laces sewn in for PE. All it takes is one comment about "being a girl" from another 5 year old to alter his sense of what he likes. He manages to have longish curly hair and wear school logo cardigans without comment, but any more overtly "feminine" touches could go too far for some child parrotting narrowminded gender stereotypes. It shouldn't matter, but children do care about what their peers think of them.

Items for babies/ children have got so much more genderised in recent years and it's not causing any increased happiness, infact concerns about gender was one of a list of factors identified in yesterday's self harm study results.

The reason it’s done for girls clothes and not boys clothes is that girls need to learn that their clothing defines them. For boys clothing doesn’t define them.

I bought DS2 lovely soft school trousers from Asda. It was only after wearing them for a few days that he came home very upset that he’d lost the butterfly decoration. I hadn’t spotted it prior. I had noticed that he’d gone through the knees whilst the old joggers were fine still.